Nio ES8 1000 km challenge with battery swap

[@brian.z6592]

I'm a Nio owner, you can actually press to start the swapping process after the car parked, then open the door quickly to leave the car for pee break😁 And in China, you can actually ask the staff to do the swap for you, while you do whatever you want.

[@bjaco9530]

From a user perspective: we swap on avarage every 10 days. We dont charge at home at all (home charger and installation included when we bought the car) As a pioneeer we have 6 free swaps/600 kwh free charging each month. It works great, just need more swap stations ( 2 in Norway atm).

[@xmtxx]

The idea behind home charging, is that you never (99% of the time) have to go to the station, even if it's only for 5 minutes. You should definitely try charging @home, it's a nice feature, not a chore.

[@bjaco9530]

Yeah, but I have to pay for charging at home … I dont pay when I swap since 6 swaps are included when leasing the battery

[@xmtxx]

@@bjaco9530 Ohhh, I see. I understand. I forgot that you had to lease the battery. I, personnaly, already really didn't like the system, this doesn't help. You are not paying extra for your charger at home? You are just talking about the electricity cost? IMO, this model encourage bad habbits, for so few benefice (long haul trips, which are, generaly, pretty rare),

[@martijnlafeber]

6 free swaps a month means almost no one pays for swaps right? Do you lease the battery?

[@bjaco9530]

Correct. Note, 6 swaps only applied for those that ordered the car before 1 March 2022. We are entitled to 6 free swaps as long as we have the car.

[@TiY]

Finally!! If it is in China I can confirm that you can leave the car while doing the swap, some users here they get off the car and have the technician take the car in for parking like vallet parking, then he press start inside the car, he then need to come out to start the process on the screen outside, the key still inside the car. At this time no one is inside the car. You may try this with the key inside the car, not sure when you left, the key was with you or inside the car. And currently more than 1,000 stations in China and they start trial run as BESS for when the grid is down, it can feed power to the grid as well. I did timing when I tried on my channel it was almost 4 mins per swap not too bad and for sure better than 20 mins DC charge at any rate 🤭 but when I tried I was inside the car to see what happens inside though

[@pnketia]

As an early investor in Nio I was glad you did this video on swap stations and the actual swap process because so many critics say it will not work outside of China, but I believe it will! My only concern is that I am getting reports out of China that the swaps are starting to take longer because there is a line of vehicles waiting to swap batteries and if this is the case Nio has to build a lot more swap stations otherwise the benefit is negated by the wait times.

[@eruma]

The point is every manufacturer would have to place such a swaping station, if the concept would spread. That's not really realistic. If Nio stays solo for that tech it might have its advantage but the better the batteries will become, the closer it's getting to the performance and probably overtaking it eventually (111km/h swaping vs. 108km/h charging).

[@pnketia]

@@eruma Don't forget the other big advantage of Nio's battery swap is when battery technology changes owners can pay to upgrade their battery to the newer technology without having to buy a whole new car. No other manufacturer is offering that right now.

[@silys5253]

@@eruma Why not realistic? NIO already has over 1000 Swap Stations. Most of them come with chargers. Gen 2 can in theory do 300 swaps a day. New Gen3 will take only 3 minutes to swap. They will also hold more batteries and be able to do more swaps per day. Users say there is only a line during rush hour which is fine as there are also chargers. NIO has done limited testing of discharge to grid and will roll out en mass with Gen3 swap stations. This will make more and more sense to you the more you learn about it.

[@eruma]

@@silys5253 A single manufacturer can do that, it's fine. But it won't come for the majority of car industry. Every car company would have to build such infrastructure, that would lead to a mess. And as we saw, the average speed isn't that much higher. With better cell tech, you might draw or even outperform the swap-system.

[@tren133]

@@eruma Eventually NIO drivers will be able to swap their 150 kWh big pack batteries, which will still take only 3 minutes on their gen 3 swap stations that will be coming online in the next year or two. I seriously doubt there is any DCFC tech that will be able to add 130 kWh to a battery inside of 3 minutes, or even 5 or 10 minutes. Currently something like an Ioniq 5 can add about 50-55 kWh in about 18 minutes, and that only takes the battery to 80%. If you want to take it to 90% like a NIO battery that comes out of the swap station, it would take even longer because charge speed goes down at higher SOC levels. And the Ioniq 5 is about as fast at charging as you can get these days.

[@gisobo]

No toilet stops anymore: AWD - Always wear diaper

[@oummanith6026]

NINE NINE NINEE NNNINNNEEE!! *Shit profusely*

[@maartenb9207]

Great concept. Think it is good that the driver has to stay in the car. Nothing more annoying than a fully charged car hogging a charger. Imagine a car blocking the swapping station because the driver is sitting at burger king.

[@kevinmills5293]

The car automatically positioned it’s self for the swap so why couldn’t it leave the swap zone automatically?

[@BizzMRK]

you realize that the car automatically leaves the swapping station though right?

[@kevinmills5293]

@@BizzMRK I didn’t know that.

[@SjohnyS]

I totally agree with this. Even if it automatically leaves the station, where will it park? It will definitely take up a spot that someone else needs. Waiting for 6 minutes, or possibly less in the future, is definitely doable by anyone. Just pee before you swap 🤣

[@bjaco9530]

This is not correct

[@James_Ryan]

Changing to a 'roll in, roll out' maneuver (ie entering from the rear rather than reversing in) would help speed up the process.

[@krs400122]

the current setup allows nio to build the power swap station across only 3-parking space. if they do the drive-thru design it would take up more space

[@Janaale]

I've been saying this since like forever. Geely does this and it takes much faster than NIO 2.0 power swap station. Geely battery swap station in action: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j2aQkKeMo7yjkMk

[@aleksandrastvardauskas7288]

@@krs400122 Fair enough. How about a turntable inside the swap station? You drive in with your front and get turned during the swap to drive out with your front as well.

[@kardy12]

@@Janaale That’s pretty impressive if they can do it in just one minute…

[@leooconnor1820]

When will you get to try a Lucid?

[@georgepelton5645]

Epic comparison of battery swap vs. gas vs. DC fast charging. I will stick to DC charging myself, but good to see other options are available. Thanks Bjørn!

[@Cornelius87]

Yeah the idea is that you have the option to go the swap route or the charging route with this car. The ice car still gives you the most freedom because you can stop as frequently as you want but you're not forced to.

[@dtpett]

I guess Nio could implement through software a way to leave the car during the swap. Although I guess they also want to avoid people forgetting to pick up their cars.

[@kdihalas]

Why not to let the car do it for you, it can automatically do the swap and then move to a bay next the the swap station and wait for you

[@brembodream]

It should ba able to autopark outside when swap is finished

[@richardgoldsmith7278]

It needs to self-park afterwards.

[@Hans-gb4mv]

@@kdihalas because cars are not allowed to drive themselves. You, as the driver, have to be present. Not run off while the car is attempting to park itself. Until we have a full self driving car and we have legally figured out who is responsible, then it would become an option.

[@pppscooby]

Self parking sounds good but if its busy where does the car go, I don’t think manufacturers want to hire out more real estate either for temporary parking spaces. Much better to get the driver to sort themselves out.

[@vettezoon]

because you initiated the swap by pressing the "start to swap" button, then opening the door triggered the safety protocol by stopping the swap, it is for safety reason. if you want to leave the car, get out first, then press the "start to swap" through the window.

[@byddf]

Thanks a lot for this test. This proved that Nio's battery swap is very fast. I think it will be suitable for Thai drivers. (I think the Thai very hot weather makes the waiting for charging is much more difficult than in Norway.) I think Nio should bring its cars and its battery swap systems to Thailand.

[@peterhuang3376]

There will be 3-4 minites with no air condition. Acceptable even in very hot days.

[@mgshg1627]

I own an ET7 in Shanghai and the swapping time is as close as you can get to gas station fill up with an ICE. There is actually no need for the bigger battery, since you can "just" swap the smaller one (that's what I do). There is no range anxiety, since the stations are always in range with the max. distance of the small battery range. At home I have 3 stations within 3km, so no problem. Agree with the report from the "guy in China", there are now occasionally swap Staus on the popular swap stations. They will introduce the 3. generation of swap stations in the future, which will speed up the process by a few minutes. The current Version 2, the same you use in Norway, still waste lots of time entering the station, the slate which removes and gets the new battery from the storage. So I think they can push it down to somewhat 3 minutes or so. (That would equal to 1500kW fast charger based on the 75kWh battery capacity).

[@Eric_Garrison]

Bigger capacity is very necessary for road tripping... I use(d) 100kwh pack and drove all over China. Would have sucked with the 75kwh packs.

[@mgshg1627]

@@Eric_Garrison I can see that in the less swap station populated area. Here in the Yangtse River delta, 75kWh works fine. The road trips you did, which I loved to watch, 100kWh is for sure recommended. As a daily driver with the occasional road trip in the area the 75kWh is sufficient.

[@Eric_Garrison]

@@mgshg1627 Def for city driving 75 plus swapping is plenty. Thanks for watching the videos ...and hope you are loving the ET7. Can't wait to get one in USA.

[@krisvandermeulen253]

The audio message just before the swap should also say: "keep your hands inside the vehicle at all times - enjoy your (swap)ride" as now it almost sounds like an amusement park ride 😀

[@MrVurtan]

Thanks a lot for the video. I'm glad to see the swaping stations in action. Hopefully it will get it's way to other countries and car manufacturer as well.

[@Cornelius87]

This is great because it's not like you're forced to do a battery swap. Options are always good. If you just want to get to your destination and there's a swap station near then you can swap. If you want to stop for lunch then charge. It's a win/win also I feel like if this catches on, cars with swappable batteries will be more attractive in the used market. I always buy used and the degradation tests on this channel keep me away from buying an ev but if I could swap the battery any day then that changes things.

[@christophernoble6810]

Amazing as it may seem battery swap existed in London for taxis in 1897! Great video.

[@KPFaaland]

Unlucky with the toilet run. I've exited and swapped myself, so it's definitely doable.

[@superleggenda]

Not sure how this reflects on real trips, especially in southern Europe. Finding a supercharger is complicated in places like Italy. NIO swap stations could be on Mars as far as lots of people are concerned. It is amazing technology, especially because battery life becomes someone else’s problem. But quick implementation in less advanced countries? I don’t see it in the next few years. Maybe I should move north.

[@LunnarisLP]

It's great but practical use seems bit low. You need to build and maintain a huge battery swap station + you need spare batteries that can't be used in cars. There is no way possibly you can really have a dense net of them, can be a cool gimmick if it's on your road for long trips at popular places, but I feel like with cars approaching 500km+ of real world autobahn range this is just overkill to save yourself maybe like 4-5 minutes? Given the fact you have to stay in the car while it swaps the battery currently you will then need to take your pee break afterwards, maybe you grab something to drink and a small bite to eat and your stop is going to be like 10-15 minutes anyway, which means you don't really save that much compared to using a supercharger, especially with the charging technology getting better and better, whereas if you can possibly have your car do the battery swap by e.g. just parking it somewhere and then it drives in, swaps and parks again outside by itself. The 2nd problem is that you can't really scale this shit. Whenever there is more traffic, you could possibly have 2-3 cars ahead. With superchargers you can have 8-16 stalls at a time, they can easily be added to any parking spot and given the low price for adding additional chargers once the key infrastructure has been done it's rather cheap, but you certainly can't go ahead and build 4 instead of 1 swap station. Let's assume only 4 cars ahead, even if each one only takes 3 minutes for the swap your own swap will take you 15 minutes, while with the current technology you would probably have to wait in the car for the whole time.

[@Eric_Garrison]

Works great on road trips! Over 1000 swap stations in China and tons along the main highways

[@francescoboselli6033]

In reality the situation in Italy is getting better at a fast rate: Tesla opens new location with regularity, plus the new year probably the superchargers will be open to other brands also in Italy. Also highway companies like Autostrade per l'Italia, who with FreetoX and other energy provider, have all plane to triple the ultra fast charging station by the end of 2023

[@superleggenda]

@@Eric_Garrison you probably missed the bit where I referred to Southern Europe. Or central, basically anywhere but Scandinavia

[@superleggenda]

@@LunnarisLP exactly. It’s a gimmick and is not scalable. Not in Europe, at least.

[@javiervazquez7141]

To all those who are not convinced about this technology: -Think about the countries where most of the people live in flats and don't have its own garage to charge their car during the night (like Spain or southern Europe where I live). This is perfect solution! Without your own home charger the EV experience could be a nightmare! -Think about the advantage of getting the new battery technology (solid state or whatever) every 5 year or so and don't worry about degradation -Think about the grid power demand: with this system the batteries are charged with low power so both the grid and the battery won't suffer (300kW charges are very demanding for the grid) Swap technology could offer huge advantages, It's not just the time saved during charging!! GAME CHANGER

[@dmunro9076]

It is actually quite inexpensive to provide large numbers of low amperage outlets to apartment garages and parking areas, to allow for overnight charging, to meet daily needs. It just takes some organization to get it done. Also large apartment complexes could provide several 25kw to 50kw DCFCs so that EV owners could fully charge on an ~approximately weekly basis.

[@javiervazquez7141]

@@dmunro9076 yes it's not impossible, but I just wanted to say this technology is useful and can help to the transition, both systems can coexist at the same time

[@dmunro9076]

@@javiervazquez7141 How much does it cost to install a battery swap station with the required staff and extra battery packs, along with the needed charging infrastructure for the swapped out packs? It seems to me that the same investment in additional DCFC chargers would provide a much better return on the money spent. The Nio battery swap system is part of the problem, if it means less investment in charging infrastructure.

[@LilaKuhJunge]

The gas pump experience - how much do I *not* miss it...

[@boostav]

Like everything it has its pro's and con's, will be very interesting how it goes in the future. From a maintenance perspective it seems like a nightmare given how many moving parts there are in a swap station vs a supercharger which effectively has none. I do love the potential for the swap station to act as a battery storage system for the grid though.

[@Lucas-wp2ph]

These work exactly like laser cutter automated storages have been designed for over 10 years. They run for 24h a day for many years no problem. What is complicated is to change a battery that is broken inside a car that is not designed for battery swap. kzbin.info/www/bejne/oquugGOmnspgatU

[@huggybear1]

Never going to last for the whole car industry. You would need a different station for every manufacturer. With improving charging speeds I don’t see the point for 99% of users. Interesting video all the same.

[@KPFaaland]

CATL is already entering the market. You just need to standardize on the same level as charge ports. And it's not supposed to replace charging, it's an alternative. Great solution where charging infrastructure isn't as easy or available to build out, or where personal parking spaces with charging options are also unavailable, like in larger cities. Look to China and see how widely this is already in use.

[@Bud_Terence]

Some chinese manufacturers ahave already formed an alliance and established a common standard for theyr swaptechnology. To assume it wont play a role for the autoindustry is kinda ignoring that fact. It may not play a role for you, but for many others. I gues in countrys whre high chargingspeeds are not possible becouse of the grid, swaps will be the way to go. Less peakpower to charge the battery and possiblity to help out the grid when needed as a backuppowerplant.

[@jasonw98]

@@Bud_Terence you would peak up at charging the battery to serve more customers

[@robertsarkezi2080]

Speedfreaks will love this. Hammer at >200km/h on Autobahn and just swap for a fresh battery in

[@jasonw98]

@@robertsarkezi2080 "slowly charged". Business will detest to that

[@NoelBarlau]

Definitely the most interesting thing I'm going to see today. Thank you for the thorough review of the swap process. Also, I think that the voice they chose for the vehicle sounds a lot like the little robot in James May Our Man In Japan. "Hey, Bim!"

[@3kkk514]

This is a real game changer i hope NIO will be all over europe I like to have one of this EV car.

[@HotelGolf82]

Extremely interesting video! Small note from someone still driving a Hybrid (Volvo V60 T6 Recharge Inscription 2022 Late). The pumps nozzles are possible to lock in Sweden for everything but Ethanol. So, gasoline and diesel will lock and auto disengage when the tank is full.

[@patblackd6499]

Thanks for the video Articles are flowing about your test 👍 It's a technical solution to win time but I'm not sure that you can't have a standard 20 minutes charge every 2 hours just for safety (and eventually restroom and food) Except if standard battery pack for several EV you can not imagine swap stations every 200km (accessible for all budgets)

[@bsl2501]

Fancy, sure, but • More expensive (on the infrastructure side, more things to break, more maintenance) • Very specific (this car, this battery - and it must be constructed for swapping) …hence, I guess, nope. And it would not even be the first to fail, RIP betterplace. (They were there before high power charging was a thing.)

[@AndreaDeBernardi]

11+ million swaps with 250k cars says yep

[@frodobaggins2852]

They have done this millions of times... If it catches on, manufacturers can move to their own stations

[@tymanot]

Thanks for the Video Björn. Great car. Let us see if swapping will be sucessful in future...

[@fredpinczuk7352]

Been a big fan of the NIO battery swap system since its announcement. They need to modify the station to allow one way drive in, and allow the driver to leave during the swap. Can't wait to see it in the US.

[@LL-bn1xn]

The station is designed to drive through, just it will take a lot space in order to install the station this way , not economic .

[@fredpinczuk7352]

@@LL-bn1xn You mean like a drive through Mc Donald's?

[@Janaale]

Really looking forward to the ET7 1000KM range test

[@nachocollantes7602]

This is a great. Good one Bjorn

[@MrHammarborg]

Takes me back to when I had a Renault Fluence Z.E and did the battery swap here in Denmark at “Better Place”. I took a 240 km trip in it, and two of the battery swap places, i got either a 70% or 90% battery swapped into my car. And with that I could not reach the next destination, so drive around, and try one more swap, man that was not easy. And in rush hour it was almost certain that there was waiting time before you could get a swap, because the battery there was recharging, needed to reach a minimum before you could get it swapped into your car. Terrible experience, and let’s hope Nio would not get into a crazy loop like back then.

[@valanz_]

People still don't understand that Swap is an ADDITIONAL WAY to charge a NIO car. This brings just an advantage over the competition and as we saw, is the most competitive way to charge a car so far, despite some technical problems (due to lack of familiarity of Bjorn). Besides, The time will improve depending the location of the battery inside the station, from 4 to 7min. there is no downsides to have an extra option to charge. Get over it, Other automakers are dinosaurs now, is time to innovate.

[@elic.2443]

Wow just realized that NIO went from last using standard fast charging...to Second place overall using battery swap. Great technology that's only going to get faster and better. I imagine one day with autonomous driving we can have the car parked and it will drive itself to and from the swap station. Even if only in the same parking lot. Then we wouldn't have to be inside the car at all, just would have to be nearby.

[@Gaijin101]

Swap station + summer traffic = 🙃

[@theolich4384]

No idea why people seem to have an impression that NIO cars don’t have the option to charge.

[@Gaijin101]

@@theolich4384 Dont get me wrong. the car is great. swap station needs some serious speedups tho.

[@dondonaldson1684]

What are the hours of operation for swap stations? 24/7?

[@navtown]

Time spent stretching your legs and going to the restroom if added, eliminates the "swapping" advantage. So, I don't see this as a game changer at all. I don't mind the supercharger experience at all. Also, with a super charger, if one is broken, you can move to another one, with this if broken you're screwed!

[@Tekkenmover]

Keep in mind, you can still super charge it, it's not limited to only battery swap. And they will make in mid 2024 a 800 Volt battery platform. So you can charge it from 10-80 around 20 mints.

[@LL-bn1xn]

What if 80% cars in NY, London, Tokyo, Shanghai , Hong Kong are EV, can they charge easily at home ? Can each residential car space install a charger ?

[@spl1011]

If it’s broken charge it, duh. Your Point is irrelevant.

[@navtown]

So we’re moving to a “everything disposable” world. Don’t take special care of your precious things like your car battery because why the hell, just go to a swap station and replace it? Dump your abused battery (if so) on someone else?

[@adewouters]

Interesting! What about redoing the same 1000 km with the same car but charging using usual method to see the real gain of swapping ?

[@pbasista]

It has already been done: kzbin.info/www/bejne/inm2pKamr8RpqtU The time was 11:25, i.e. 2 hours and 25 minutes longer than with the battery swap.

[@realbase]

batteryswap 4.0 - drive it in, auto car wash enabled - battery swap done, car clean ;) (yes, battery & water might not be best idea.. )

[@mackwoods5080]

I love Nio this is great news

[@MaikTerOriginal]

The problem with swap stations: It's proprietary manufacturer depended technology. I.e. only NIO customers can use it. And other manufacturers (VW/Tesla/...) would need to build their own stations. Which will be a waste of public space (and money). Imagine a gas station needing 3 times the space because 3 different swap stations need to be built. Meanwhile CCS-HPC chargers can be used by ANY car brand.

[@elic.2443]

How did I miss this two weeks ago!!!

[@iowa_don]

17:10 - a Caterham 7, nice!

[@Bud_Terence]

Leftover energy might play a role in places where you can hammer it. With ET7 150 kwh in Germany and drive fast wherever possible would maby result in a time around 8 H or less.

[@hardywoodaway9912]

even if you hammer it, you won’t shed an hour. The normal traffic will prevent any advantage of driving fast for few meters.

[@Bud_Terence]

@@davids.6671 No haha there at all. Depends when you drive. Mostly i start at night when i go to vacation(150- 160 wherever possible), so i get at least 120-130 average speed. ;)

[@karlitono]

Nio just really needs to pick up pace with rolling out swap stations in Europe. Hopefully the Hungarian factory solves it.

[@edc1569]

So every manufacturer is going to build a swap station? Right.

[@ME-cb1vw]

will there be always personell at the station? around the clock? Or is it just during the first few months?

[@qb4hkm]

Bjorn, running to the toilet, WITH A CAMERA?!

[@bjornnyland]

OnlyFans 🤣

[@qb4hkm]

@@bjornnyland a quick one in the loo 👍

[@LarsDennert]

800V architecture on 350kw will be competitive. After 4 hours at the wheel, most people could use an extended break. Great video though! Thanks as always.

[@s0012823]

People always want more, I charge my Tesla at 250kW charger from 10% to 80% in 20 minutes. With 350kW it will maybe will be 15 minutes. I drive on vacation for 2,5 hours and charge. It is just perfect. Stop asking for more!

[@LarsDennert]

@@s0012823 you're lucky to have a Tesla with a reliable charging network.

[@TheMartonMovies]

What if you would lower the driver side window, step out of the car, then press the button through the lowered window for starting the battery swap process? you could then leave the car as it is and have bit of time for whatever

[@Janaale]

I'm a NIO battery swap station fan but after seeing this NIO should do a lot to improve their battery swap stations. Also, NIO shouldn't forget to invest time and money into fast charging and solid-state batteries.

[@AndreaDeBernardi]

you mean like the 150k solid state battery comening in 2 months and the 400 people development center for battery research and the hungary factory for chargers and swap station and the unmanned 800V swap station gen3 coming next year?

[@ItsOnlyElectric]

Very cool concept to swap battery instead of charging. Let's see if others jump on this train or if the battery chemistry evolution will eat up the time difference.

[@AndreaDeBernardi]

timing is the last thing.... while battery evolve, in 5 years you wil be stuck with an ancient tech in other cars. Nio, just upgrade (incredible resale value.) you all miss that point that they do this just to be faster

[@ItsOnlyElectric]

@@AndreaDeBernardi maybe..but that's up to the goodwill of Nio. They will most certainly not throw away all the existing working batteries just because theres new chemistry's available. Not so environmental and also not good for a company that wants to produce and sell new cars.. ;)

[@leotek..]

in china there are already a few others offering this, all following the tried and tested business model of competition to the death. so financially not sustainable. but for customers it’s a hell of a party as long as it lasts.

[@johntyson1958]

Classic solution in search of a problem. My SR+ Tesla with 10,000km has used a supercharger once in a year. Battery swap is a non starter. 31 days of home charging cost $6.

[@Lucas-wp2ph]

😂 Comparing a Tesla to a Nio is funny,

[@AndreaDeBernardi]

yeah a non starter with 10+ million swaps and 1070 stations

[@AndreaDeBernardi]

@@Lucas-wp2ph yeah these guy have no idea.

[@23Kaugummi]

you can also put a bigger battery into the es8. ":) the batteries can be put in all nio cars

[@kardy12]

Seems like an odd way to design the swapping station. Wouldn’t it be more simple to drive in to the back at some designated space, let the car do the final few meters and then drive out the front?

[@BizzMRK]

Probably space restrictions at the locations. It looks like it is intended for drive-through but they didn't have the room to orientate the stall properly. It should also be mentioned that this is the only swapping stations in all of europe right now, so it is more of a demo station.

[@bjaco9530]

Probably due to space limitations in China

[@kardy12]

@@BizzMRK Well, you can see space both in front and behind the station, so not sure space restrictions are such a constraint at least in this case.

[@dellyet]

How about winter, could snow get in way for battery replacement?

[@hodgenhe]

China also has big snow areas.

[@Paul-cj1wb]

Bjorn, when are you going to run the Lucid Air dream edition (500 plus miles/800 plus km range) on your 1000 km challenge? You should only need a quick 11 minute recharge time to reach 1000 kilometers. That could rival your fossil car record.

[@dmunro9076]

The EV-6/Ionic-5 claim 10-80% in 18 min vs 6 min for a battery (90% charged) swap, but then you have to add the time taken to get food and use the restroom... It seems to me that the EV-6/Ionic-5 should only be about ~20min slower on the same route with a 1000km test distance.

[@johniooi3954]

But that 10 to 80% is best case. Which is not a real world case. If you watch Bjorn's EV6 video you will see the problem. Swap is always going to be faster.

[@dmunro9076]

@@johniooi3954 It is a real world case and there are lots of YT videos available to prove it. However, it is true that the EV-6/Ionic-5 need firmware and/or hardware mods to ensure that the optimal 10-80% charge curve is available over a wider range of ambient temperatures; this seems to be an easy problem to solve. Providing battery swap stations and the extra battery packs needed to do that, seems a somewhat more difficult and costlier approach to the problem.

[@tentenone8825]

You have to be in the car because the platform below has moving components, it's for safety.

[@kelvynbettridge]

Not sure why deduct for first PP break as that appears to be the requirement.

[@enginblitz7877]

what would you say is a good bang for the bucks full electric vehicle for a family of 5 ? I really like the BMW i4, but it is expensive?

[@roybm3124]

Livestream was amazing! Model 3 performance is only 15 minutes slower that is impressive.

[@royjonzejr]

So if you choose to buy your battery and NOT do Battery As a Service, are you just not able to use swap stations? Otherwise, how would you get your battery back?

[@N0xiety]

Yup, seems that's how it works. Also, it seems you would be paying for the full price of the battery in about 6 years of leasing it, but you obviously won't own the battery. There is only one scenario that i can think of that would profit you in the case of leasing for more than 6 years, and that would be if you are traveling so much that you would run the battery to the ground in 6 years anyways. Then yea, guess it makes sense, if they allowed it that is. I'm not sure if the lease comes with unlimited miles, but if it does, yea this is a great deal for people who drive long distances a lot that they would ruin a battery in 6 years.

[@royjonzejr]

@@N0xiety True. Although a silver lining is that money now is always better than money later. So if you take the money you save by not having to pay for the whole battery up front and invest it smartly, you can probably make a 6% return per year (compounding) and cut down the amount of money you lose by renting the battery and not owning it at the end. Similar to the benefits of renting a home vs buying one.

[@sebestyenrif3858]

It would be interesting to see this working during winter time. Bottom freezed up, no screw access due to ice blockage. Melting snow dripping all over the mechanism and inside the battery station. Not sure all weather test was concluded already, was it?!

[@isaiah123456wp7]

That's a good point. I guess we'll have to wait and see. I hope we get a video on it for winter swaps

[@AndreaDeBernardi]

several video about this from China... works just fine in sub zero. (they are not stupid.....)

[@AndreaDeBernardi]

also... 11 Million swaps. not a novelty at all

[@bjaco9530]

No problem so far. We have used the swap station since January (=snow, ice and salted roads)

[@dannyyo7948]

should i invest in Nio stock? :)

[@NicoSchurr]

Without standardization of the pack across manufacturers its a nice proof of concept but not much more. And idk if I'd want that standardization. Might hold back car design a lot. I also don't like not owning the battery. Also, there will absolutely be wait times. A swap station is way bigger and way more expensive than a charging station so you can't just build a few in one spot, that wouldn't be economically feasible. With just one vehicle before you and a pee break you're already on par with a stop with a Taycan or an Ioniq 5.

[@BizzMRK]

This seems like a very good solution for trucks and busses but not for regular cars, considering you barely save any time and have to stay inside the car during the process.

[@LoneWolf-wp9dn]

imagine that you mostly charge at home and you only swap on long journeys... means they can charge the battery as slow as is healthy... so never any unhealthy fast charging... also you wouldnt have to worry 10 years from now about the state of your battery you would be changing them all the time any way... that being said the fees might be way too much

[@molassis8474]

Great video really liked your explanations.

[@RelakS__]

Wait, what is that? What I am always talking about, that do not charge your batteries, swap your batteries? As you don't cook fuel at home. One thing though: There should be a smaller battery, which keeps the car alive while they swap the main battery. Hopefully, a swap like this can be easy as swap AA batteries, but in bigger scale.

[@Daniel-lb8tu]

At a Tesla Supercharger, you often meet between 5-10 Teslas during a 20-min charge. So if you would meet 5-10 Nios at a swap station, it would then take you 30-60 min (6 min per swap) of waiting. Plus, you have to kind of wait inside the car the whole time to move your car every 6 min. Doesn't really sound like an easily scalable solution to me. You would need a second or third swap station, and I don't think they come cheap... Let's see, what the future brings, I am excited about every new approach anyway! :)

[@Lucas-wp2ph]

Look at what the owners say in China. They tell a different story. Many have changed their e-trons and Model x for the es8.

[@Daniel-lb8tu]

@@Lucas-wp2ph Ah ok, I think I missed that part. Yeah well, then it seems like a good deal for people, who drive 700-1000 km on a daily basis.

[@broderwow]

what is the swap price compared to charging "traditionally"

[@Bud_Terence]

He mentioned 100 NOK/Swap + the received kwh's (forgot how much the kwh costs). Pretty cheap for now. Probably subsidized by Nio i guess.

[@robduncan599]

It simply has to cost more ? The battery still needs to be changed , plus labour at the swap station ? Also if you swap with 20% charge still on the battery, is your 20% swap is that taken into account , not likely ? So likely cost extra as time costs money and this saves time ? But will this catch on ? I can absolutely see this working for commercial purposes large trucks and delivery vehicles, where a lot of time is spent charging large batteries?

[@BizzMRK]

Nio charges a subscription for it, the base subscription includes 2 full battery swaps per month. The subscription fee ranges between 146€ and 209€ per month. They charge 0.20€/kWh plus a 10€ swap fee outside the subscription. This is only available if you lease the battery rather than buying it, which is roughly 9000€ cheaper but the subscription is more expensive after only 4 years of using it without using any extra swaps outside the subscription. It should also be noted that this swapping station in Norway is the only one in existence in europe right now. With the swap taking around 5 to 10 minutes I really see no benefit in it to be honest. It takes just marginably more to use a HPC, which is significantly cheaper and you can walk away from the car.

[@moestrei]

These swap stations must be way more expensive to build and operate compared to fast charging stations...who is paying for that? With the arrival of solid state graphene batteries swapping may become obsolete in the future??

[@susynne2124]

if triggered by door opening, what about if the window is down and you climb out it? ...just wondering...

[@testi2025]

When I was driving my diesel, I just to jam the gas cap to the refuelling handle, and get me a coffee. Sure it didn’t keep it fully pressed but usually it was done when I returned.

[@Outsider.Reviews]

and depending on which country you live in... that's not allowed lol. Canada for one has signs stating so at our gas stations.

[@chatchaik]

should be good if we can see how swapping process works.

[@tesla-spectre]

Very interesting video and of course a totally different concept! Missed that detail probably (maybe you could add time markers so one finds the key things quicker) but: how much does it cost per kWh used on the trip (especially since you need to do full swap even if you have say 40% left). Does it charge you just for the exchanged kWh (so say you used 50% you pay for those 50% in the new battery) or is at for all? And if you then take all the kWh you used for 1000km, how much does that cost (to compare to normal charging). That you cannot leave is indeed a small disadvantage (like with ICEs while filling the gas tank), since as you say those minutes you gain when charging normally for other tasks like toilet. But 6 min is bloody fast. But 9:00h is very fast. of course all will depend on a network that covers same way as Superchargers or others do... lets see whether that happens

[@bjornnyland]

2 kr/kWh and 100 kr/swap. On average 3 kr/kWh. HPC in Norway costs up to 7.5 kr/kWh.

[@tesla-spectre]

@@bjornnyland wow that sounds like an extremely good deal!

[@KPFaaland]

You only pay for the energy you "charge up". If your battery has 40% when you arrive, and you leave with 90%, you pay for whatever that 50% equals in kWh.

[@tesla-spectre]

@@KPFaaland ah makes sense

[@bjornnyland]

But you actually pay for kWh before charging losses.

[@Trevlig]

Is air-conditioning on while it's swapping?

[@1morphector1]

Are the battery stored in the swap station already heated? Cause I would hate to get a cold 90% charged battery that's been sitting at -35C... Would love to see the system working with the underside of a car when I just drove 200km in a snowstorm...

[@bjornnyland]

Yes, it stays at 25°C.

[@laser_simon922]

So, with this battery-swap we have more pollution, as there is more than 1 battery per car produced, the added complexity in the car leads to more failure and potential safety risks, the infrastructure needs much more space, money and time to setup. For a stop time reduction of like 10 minutes (7 min battery swap + at least another 7 for finding a parking spot and visit the restroom) all with the possibility to wait until you can enter the swapstation (I assume there will never be as many stations as charging points, due to the limitstion of space). The legal issues with battery health is also a problem: Do I own the battery? If so, do I get the same health every time? If I don‘t oen the battery, do I get penalised if I hand in a „bad“ battery? I don‘t see any benefit to this system…

[@frodobaggins2852]

They have done this millions of times (11 million swaps with 250k+ cars) so the safety and reliability is answered.. Many people claim they have gone to toilet while it was swapping,.. Not to mention, you dont have to always pee while swapping, factoring in 7 mins pee time for every swap is stupid... It takes as much or even lesser space than a carwash... Batteries are being reused and recycled so pollution bit is answered And finally, you dont own the battery, the price of the car doesnt include the cost of battery, hence is cheaper...if they remove a battery from your car, it gets automatically checked for damage/ issues.. If damages are detected, they remove that battery from circulation and repair it.. So no matter what, you get a good battery with company claimed range

[@davedave1398]

When road tripping my model 3 SR generally the car is done charging before we are done using the bathroom and maybe getting some food/drinks. So I don’t see this being all that helpful unless you can just drive up and get out and the car swaps autonomously. Then car self parks in a lot while your taking a dump.

[@ralfw8083]

one Nio Station is built in Germany at Zusmarshausen

[@benderbalsam7066]

Is there no HVAC during the entire swap?

[@44Bigs]

Or music, let alone Netflix. I’m not impressed.

[@isaiah123456wp7]

These battery swap stations are really interesting. I wonder if we'll ever get anything like in here in the states

[@SamuraiTacos1]

same here

[@SamuraiTacos1]

will be interesting how the battery swapping will work

[@Bud_Terence]

Afaik Nio wants to go to US. Probably in 2-3 years we know more.

[@SamuraiTacos1]

@@Bud_Terence yeah its an interesting idea for people who can't charge at home

[@jasonkleung]

2024 or 2025 supposedly they are putting a swap station for testing in November this year, probably in the California office location. Some people online says they are shopping for a store in the old Barney's NY location in SF

[@sarunss6393]

Is the AC on while swapping? Is the car locked during the swapping? Can you still get out during that period of time? I think they have to pay for the cost of logistics managing trucks transferring batteries between swapping stations for restocking.

[@jasonkleung]

No it takes the battery out so you are without heat or AC for 3-5 minutes. As for restocking battery swaps once full I don't think you need to restock unless you are looking for a different sized battery. Like if you had 10 70 kwh and 3 100 kwh but 3 people changed out from 70 to a 100 kwh batteries. Once full each car would do a 1 for one exchange. Of course unless what I pointed out or if a battery has under acceptable margins.

[@sarunss6393]

@@jasonkleung Interesting in terms of tech and idea. I have seen lots of opportunities in business here too (advertising during the swap) lol

[@robhaitch5544]

How come it’s not a simple drive through ? Arriving perpendicular to the station seems inefficient

[@igeekone]

It might be based on land use. I would imagine there is a drive thru variant, which would be more efficient.

[@nanterre38]

Looks a bit complicated and expensive swap stations vs time saved.... First point to focus is efficiency to save time. Same test with Tesla Model 3 LR 2022 in the same conditions should demonstrate that the swap doesn't allow any saving time.

[@kaspersteensig8496]

Should start over of the need to push the breake when its autoparking?

[@uob5]

Great video👍 Do they have room for significant improvment? I‘m questioning this, because 1 car in the queue and this concept is behind M3LR. And with the next generation of cars and there improved charching time maybe the majority of cars will be ahead the swap-concept.

[@LunnarisLP]

I think the only benefit you have here is once you can leave the car and have it swap by itself or if you actually can save yourself a stop because you get a 100% battery compared to a supercharging session you would usually end at ~80%.

[@davidmathews9678]

Is your warranty affected by changing the battery

[@jasonfournier]

Scaling, operation, and maintenance of the swap stations are much worse than the charger stations. Servicing the same number of cars will be so costly. I do like the renting a battery and the option to swap to a larger capacity when needed. As soon as there is any queuing swapping will be longer that charging in many instances.

[@DouglasJMark]

Swap stau, LOL! Pee stau! ROFL! Thanks Bjorn.

[@edo_vdk]

What will be the costs of swapping your battery if your 'old' battery is still charged 25% and you swap it for a 100% battery?

[@nickieredshaw7835]

Great video thanks how much is swap when you have to pay ? But it was only 15 mins faster than model 3 ie a charging car over 1000 km so if you got in a swap q you would not save much! But good idea 👍 even better if you could get out a do stuff while swapping

[@bjornnyland]

2 kr/kWh and 100 kr/swap

[@JonathanPalfrey]

I guess for people who can't charge at home and those that do regular very long journeys battery swapping could be useful. For everyone else though it just seems a bit excessive and too slow, easier to just charge for 5-10 minutes on the way home, at least you can go and do other things while its charging. Also if this ever got popular the queues would be a nightmare! Imagine being behind just 5 other cars waiting for a swap. It would take 30 minutes before they even got to you.

[@JonathanPalfrey]

@@onetwothreefour-s1n are you angry at my comment?

[@michaelcarney6280]

The press car had free battery swapping how much is it for owners per swap?

[@bjornnyland]

2 kr/kWh and 100 kr/swap

[@michaelcarney6280]

@@bjornnyland Thanks i'll convert it

[@smove99]

Interesting System, but why there have no buffer battery for the infotainment? Completely Power off with no information on the screen about the process is not that best idea. But who can „charge“ the battery faster to full? Nice.

[@chrisobber5604]

If we would achieve a standard for all car manufacteurs this would be awesome! But, yeah... the problem is obvious unfortunately...

[@luihinwai1]

I like how he said we could do this in the future or in China today.

[@leooconnor1820]

I think if it is slower than gas it’ll be because the station is located before you hit a very low state of charge making more swaps necessary. I wish you’d mention a swap price vs a charge price.

[@rossr6616]

Do they lock your doors so you cannot get out?

[@olestampevestergaard4746]

I wonder if they will be able to do a fully automated swap, where you just leave it in the "stau" spot and pick it up from a holding spot afterwards

[@kodez79]

if there is stau, it might actually be faster with HPC?

[@BizzMRK]

@@kodez79 I highly doubt you will see more than one of these swapping stations, maybe two per location, while you get around 4 HPC stations with the same footprint.

[@olestampevestergaard4746]

@@kodez79 real world, my experience is that it takes at least 15 minutes for my family of 4 to go pee anyway, so 1 car stau would not be an issue, as long as we could press a "swap when ready" button, and leave the car, it would likely be available for us when we were done with peeing and getting some candy

[@newscoulomb3705]

It's crazy to think that the Lucid Air would still be faster to 1,000 km. 😱