The Trouble with TradWives

[@EmmaThorneVideos]

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[@mattx9260]

in america, childbirth cost like $20,000. so its a bit expensive. i believe this is why its gaining popularity.

[@DavidAndrews-eb7gm]

My partner and I both work full-time in professional occupations. She earns more than I do but we could easily survive comfortably on either of our incomes alone. She is terrible at housework. Excels at creative cooking and enjoys living in relative order but is a chaos elf otherwise. I’m XY. She’s XX. Get out of the kitchen/lounge room/ bedroom/ bathroom. I love you but you’re not helping.

[@desperadox7565]

@@DavidAndrews-eb7gm "Get out of the bedroom, you're not helping"? That would worry me tbh.😎

[@Amoth_oth_ras_shash]

as far the only places where a majority of people could afford this deranged motivated style of life , are those living in societies that noted there was way more negative things with said life style then positive ones and correspondingly changed how some of its laws was formulated etc to for example ensure people are seen as individuals in the law not just husband + leashed brood pet :/

[@DavidAndrews-eb7gm]

@ desperadox 😜

[@iheartacebear]

As a pharmacist, we learned so much about the barbiturates and amphetamines that kept a house wife “going”. Not healthy at all

[@S.e.t85]

Chocolate in the 30s, 40s and 50s definitely had an extra kick in it

[@totto79121]

I was born in the '50s, a kid in the '60s. Doctors handed out valium like candy and my mom became addicted. She wasn't the only one. We tend to see those days through rose colored lenses.

[@denisemayosky1955]

"Mother's little helpers", they called them. The Rolling Stones sang a song about it. I remember hearing it.

[@CoolOldBiker]

Same ones some men use today for a job that's physically or mentally hard ,, ya mean those 😅

[@queenmotherhane4374]

Yeah-“healthy,” my @$$. That word is code for “don’t be fat.”

[@gingerbatch1]

The historical dress community have a saying Vintage style, not vintage values. And as someone of a certain age, raised in the American South in a fundamentalist house/church, these 'tradwives' gross me the hell out. I saw so much abuse in the church, it was mind boggling...

[@electronics-girl]

Yeah, I absolutely love Kristen Bell's aesthetic in the "Santa's Coming For Us" music video. But I would never want to be a tradwife. Just give me all the pretty dresses, and that's enough.

[@grumpy_gremlin]

I feel like the historical dress community can give us the perfect response to this - if they're going to cosplay American 50s housewives, let's cosplay British 40s landgirls 😂

[@bbureau12]

I love history. I can trace family back to the Crusades. 1400's and 1700's are my jam. I have a fancy tricorn. I commissioned a suit of armor based on what my ancestors wore in the Hundred Years War. While I adore all this history, I don't want to go back to even a romanticized version of that time period, or those sensibilities. Really, it's the difference between finding the pirate aesthetic "fun" and wanting to go around committing absolute atrocities on the Spanish Main.

[@kevinrtres]

U said: *I saw so much abuse in the church, it was mind boggling...* Jesus said : “The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field, 25 but while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat and went away. 26 So when the plants came up and bore grain, then the weeds appeared also. 27 And the servants of the master of the house came and said to him, ‘Master, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have weeds?’ 28 He said to them, ‘An enemy has done this.’ So the servants said to him, ‘Then do you want us to go and gather them?’ 29 But he said, ‘No, lest in gathering the weeds you root up the wheat along with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest, and at harvest time I will tell the reapers, “Gather the weeds first and bind them in bundles to be burned, but gather the wheat into my barn.”’ Matthew 13.

[@IanIsrael]

@@kevinrtresBlah,Blah,Blah!! 🙄🤦

[@matthewwakeman5047]

Traditionally, women used to hunt, to plough the fields and to fight alongside their menfolk against tribal enemies.

[@ShintogaDeathAngel]

Exactly - "traditions" vary so much (depending on time/place), and people forget that sometimes/places, women were on a more equal footing with men.

[@moon_wobble7782]

This “trad wife” stuff is just living like it’s 1950. There was a short period where some women lived like this. Nothing “traditional about it

[@mikearchibald744]

That very much is not always or often true. In some very tribal societies it may be true, but certainly not all tribal societies and certainly not most 'societies'. "Civilizations" have been very much about enforcing hierarchy all over, and in the home was a very effective tool, as it still is. But the fact is, you can BUY lunches and even ready made meals. IN other words your 'traditional' wife does about four years of care then the educational system does the rest and they'd be doing nothing all day.

[@ChristopherSadlowski]

Yup! And some women were so good at fighting they were given warrior's burials. They were laid out in their regalia with their weapons by their side at the ready in hopes they would protect their people even in death. If that doesn't show that women are protectors too then I don't know what will.

[@mikearchibald744]

@@ChristopherSadlowski That sort of thing was pretty rare in most cultures.

[@EdieBird]

I was basically raised to become a tradwife. Homeschooled, church, oldest daughter does much/most of the child-rearing for the younger ones. Learned all the "feminine" hobbies. I even spin my own yarn. I got engaged to the son of my mom's best friend. (it was just an assumed thing, all but arranged) At the time it was long distance, so when I was visiting his family, we of course had to go to his church. Someone asked me how many children we were planning to have, and before I could answer, he jumped in. "As many as GOD will give us!" I must've looked more than a little displeased as suddenly this woman started backing away as I firmly replied "We haven't discussed that yet. Or the Amway I asked him not to get involved with..." Anyway, that was the beginning of the end. I went home, did not marry him, and have now been married for twelve years to a man who actually considers my opinions to be valid and doesn't believe that any part of my anatomy is his to own. I love vintage clothes (but most in my size have been worn to rags so I have to make reproductions) and I greatly enjoy cooking. BUT I would rather cook for just EVERYONE sooo I do that for a living.

[@tomokolovecraft3792]

Glad you dodged that red flag factory of a bullet. Hope you continue to have a happy life.

[@kevinrtres]

So how many children do you have now?

[@EdieBird]

@@kevinrtres zeroooooooo. And I'm about to hit menopause so it'll stay that way.

[@thesilvernymph]

​@@EdieBirdAs the eldest daughter who was default-parentified, it is really common to be uninterested in parenting again.

[@groerhahn225]

They tried to brainwash you so hard and failed. Good for you, you rock!

[@blazej799]

Conservatives long for a world that never existed.

[@ig4299]

So wahr.

[@mikeappleget482]

They yearn for the yoke.

[@DaveB-hg7el]

I agree, and I have two brothers don't see this as a fantasy created by people who are trying to use their fear as a weapon. It has been impossible to convince them otherwise, because after awhile facts don't matter. Peace 💚

[@Colddirector]

Honestly I think it's even sadder than that in the case of the 1950s - they long for a world that only existed in advertisements designed to sell crap. They're not even falling for old propaganda, they're falling for old advertisements. I used this analogy somewhere else, but it's like looking at a Coke ad from the 90s and assuming every guy back then had a babe in each arm.

[@drewcoowoohoo]

@@Colddirector I blame Leave It To Beaver and Walt Disney for widespread false pasts. I assume that everything in homes in shades of grey is because black and white TV shows show that past.

[@fepeerreview3150]

Childbirth is dangerous. I have a cousin who died in childbirth. It still happens. My niece's first childbirth went smoothly. So she tried the second at home, but with provision for a quick trip to the hospital if necessary. It WAS necessary. The birth was very difficult and probably would have killed her if she'd been from the pre-WW2 generation. It took her body several years to recover and she won't be able to have another despite wanting to. We are all so grateful to the modern medical advances that she is with us today and her 2 children are both healthy. Historical maternal mortality rates are difficult to know because data wasn't consistently gathered, but in the UK it was in the 1:100 in the 18th century, dropping to 1:200 in the later 19th century. The rate is now about 1:10,000, two orders of magnitude improvement. And I haven't even touched on the survival rate of children. I'm guessing plenty of these "trad" families probably have issues with waxines as well. They want to go back to a world where the majority of children did not reach adulthood. That is simply evil.

[@daniellamcgee4251]

I am so sorry to hear of your cousin. Yes, child birth is dangerous. That's why home birth midwives have a Masters degree in midwifery, and are taught modern medicine, and have plenty of modern equipment with them, and know when to refer to hospital. 😊 The lack of understanding about germ theory, and ability to monitor what was happening with birthing person, and baby, is why there were high birth mortality rates. Obstetricians coerce people into unnecessary induced labours, and C-sections, because their specialty is in intervention births. Infection rates are high in hospital. There are pros and cons for home births vs hospital births. Ultimately, the choice should be available to decide what is the safest, and best for them and their baby. I have written a more comprehensive comment, if you are interested. A close relative is a literal expert on this topic. 😊

[@fepeerreview3150]

@@daniellamcgee4251 It wasn't my intention to say that home births are wrong. I didn't say that. But childbirth is indeed dangerous. Thanks for acknowledging that. That's why I gave the second example of my niece. She didn't make a mistake in choosing a home birth. Her midwife, like you, was a professional and, most importantly, a back up plan was in place. That's what a good midwife like you does. The midwife makes sure that back up plan is in place. In my niece's case it was necessary to resort to that plan. I have another relative who gave birth at home, without problems. But the back up plan was also in place, as it should be. Not using painkillers is just plain stupid though. That's just men punishing women because of "the sin of Eve". There's no justification for that in any except the most extraordinary circumstances.

[@ChrisBreederveld]

Just wanted to tack on that here in The Netherlands home birth is still quite the norm. There is no additional risk added to it, but only because of the expertise of the midwives (hope I'm using the right term here) and our incredible infrastructure and healthcare. Half of home births still end up in the hospital though. All in all I think that if you do not live in this ideal situation, probably home birth has a higher risk factor.

[@bbureau12]

This. Even if these people are into the romanticized version of Ye Olde times, have they not seen the eclampsia scene in Downton Abbey?

[@ArchmageIlmryn]

I used to think "wait why are people so worried about home births, my two younger siblings were born at home (to highly-educated, science-minded. left-leaning parents) and it was fine?" Then I realized that for said home births my parents had at least two medical professionals come out to our house, and the tradwives advocating for home births are probably...not doing that.

[@stonykark]

My wife is very traditional, she loves working on projects for the home. She redesigned and completely redid the basement (including new flooring), repainted the whole upper floor and spends a lot of time restoring old furniture that fits our aesthetic. She’s also the primary breadwinner as I’m changing careers. I help, but don’t share her passion for “tradition” (power tools and sawdust). I love her so much.

[@weschilton]

Sounds like she really just has a hobby that she loves. I wouldn't characterize that as "traditional." She just likes working with her hands. Sounds great.

[@slayerangel6597]

I'm glad that you and your wife have such a great relationship!

[@seeleunit2000]

She doesn't sound like a traditional housewife, but she does sound awesome.

[@Tristan1962]

@@stonykark My wife has her own tools and likes doing projects as well. She is very self sufficient. She does like help sometimes but others she wants to do it herself. Or she wants me to teach her the skills so she can do it. It is a very lovely partnership. 😁

[@desperadox7565]

That doesn't sound very traditional but it sounds great. I'm sure she has a lot of fun.👍

[@colourblindcrossstitch9415]

The thing about “be beautiful and healthy” advice is it often comes out a bit ableist. Like, doing your best to stay healthy is a generally good idea, for anyone (like learning to budget and do housework). But this lady and her ilk tend to word it in a way such that if you don’t/can’t stay healthy, it’s a moral failing. But sometimes, you just can’t maintain a fitness routine, whether it’s because you’re running around after eight kids, or because you developed arthritis or some other disability that restricts how much exertion you can safely do.

[@jakeking3859]

Very true

[@queenmotherhane4374]

“Healthy,” for these folks, is code for “Don’t be fat.”

[@onceuponamelody]

It most certainly is. I used to be a fundie and disability is usually viewed as punishment for a sin (yours or your parents).

[@queenmotherhane4374]

@@onceuponamelody That’s disgusting.

[@onceuponamelody]

@@queenmotherhane4374 it really is. Funny how me, a disabled person didn't want to stay in that religion haha /sar

[@sleepingkirby]

Patriarchy: Men needs to be strong and independent and not need help from anyone. Also patriarchy: If you cook for yourself you've failed as a man.

[@patrickcardon1643]

Don't forget doing your dishes, laundry, cleaning, etc. ... no wonder my father wouldn't survive alone for 1 week, the time the food in the fridge and cupboard runs out and clean clothes are all used up

[@sleepingkirby9211]

@@patrickcardon1643 Yeah, I don't get that. I learned how to do the laundry (aka, throw your clothes and put in the laundry detergent) when I was 8 or 9. Started cooking when I was 10. Like, what did they do when they lived by themselves during college or something? Did they just starve? And if they had their parent come over and do them, what's less manly, needing your mother to do things for you or just washing the dishes yourself?

[@Ragnar452]

Honestly that's dumb. You can cook for yourself for sure. What I really fail to understand is the concept of marriage. Care to explain the benefits of this? I see just a headache.

[@Ragnar452]

​​​@@patrickcardon1643 Bro we have tech for this. And delivery services. How difficult can this be. For cleaning Roomba is awesome, for dishes you have a dishwasher, for laundry you guessed it, laundry machine, as for groceries, if you really are that busy, you have delivery services. Stand by for more tech/robots/AI.

[@sleepingkirby]

@@Ragnar452 " What I really fail to understand is the concept of marriage. Care to explain the benefits of this? I see just a headache." Legal benefits, tax purposes, citizenship purposes, a vow of commitment, and hence, a sign of loyalty and/or security. There's quite a few aspect and they vary from culture to culture, country to county. Any particular aspect that you're particularly looking for explanation on?

[@BanjoPishos]

All I can say is it takes all kinds.Some folks dream of a 1950's utopian America that never existed. Some of us dream of the day C'thulu will return from R'lyeh to consume the world. Only time will tell which of us is right.

[@ig4299]

Top Kommentar. 😂 Grüße aus Germany. 🤘

[@stephennootens916]

Not to be that guy but am rooting for Cthulhu.

[@tessaninetails8065]

My money is on C'thulu 😅

[@Aliyah_666]

​@@stephennootens916Fair...as a woman I'm going for Cthulhu as well...🤷

[@CAPSLOCKPUNDIT]

Amen, brother! May you be among the first eaten!

[@Tristan1962]

I am 62 years old and from the USA's west coast. I took a class in middle school called "Bachelor Survival" which was home ec for guys. It taught the same skills that starting home economics taught the girls, but it was an all-male class. I think it was brilliant that they taught us how to cook, clean, and sew but in a format that wouldn't make us feel as dumb.

[@DaveB-hg7el]

I'm 65, and my mother taught her 4 boys these same skills. She was determined to make us understand that there is no such thing as 'women's' work. Learning how to do the cooking, laundry, cleaning, etc gave me the opportunity to find my partner, and make life better for both of us. Peace 💚

[@electronics-girl]

I'm almost 50 and when I was in junior high school in the Midwest, boys and girls had to take the same required classes, which included both home ec and shop class for everyone. I'm glad the classes were co-ed, because I turned out to be trans, so now I don't feel left out by having been in the wrong class.

[@chrisgraham2904]

I am so disgusted by men I have known who could not, or would not cook an egg, make a sandwich, sew on a button and rely upon their wives. Equally sad when a woman cannot hammer a nail, hang a picture or mow a lawn. My father was one of 10 children raised on a farm where the six boys and 4 girls were taught all the same skills. The girls could mend fences, shovel manure, bail hay, drive and run all of the farm equipment and care for the livestock. The boys were taught to prepare any meal from scratch that was eaten in the household, including baking pies and cakes, full turkey dinners, bottling a vast array of preserves, mend and operate a sewing machine, tend the "house garden" and all the other "household chores". They'd often be preparing meals for up to 30 people consisting of family and hired hands working the farm. Dad made sure that those skills were handed down to my brothers and myself.

[@DaveB-hg7el]

@@chrisgraham2904 Not that you or your father need me to say this, but congratulations to the both of you for realizing that these are the basic skills people should learn just to function as an adult. It seems that almost every story I have heard like this, including my own, has a beginning that can be traced back to a rural or farm family culture. The loss of family farms in the US has eliminated a large part of the culture which was responsible for showing the next generation the value of every child learning how to do all of the skills needed around the house. I wish I knew an efficient way to show our children the benefits of being able to cook, clean, drive a nail, use a saw, grow your own food and then preserve it, etc, but this mentality must start with the adults in every child's life, not from an outsider telling people how they should live. But hey, I try to do what I can for my granddaughters. Peace 💚

[@chrisgraham2904]

@@DaveB-hg7el Yes, pass it on! There should never be any shame, or embarrassment to learn any skill that can benefit your life. These are life skills, not male and female skills. My children have those skills and my grandchildren at 8 and 11 are acquiring them. Not to mention the enormous and often overlooked financial benefit of not relying on others that have those skills.

[@molybdomancer195]

The fact the ballerina’s husband is the son of an airline owner played a huge part in how he got her to marry him. He had asked her out several times and she had said no because she was studying hard at the best ballet school in the US. She was flying from her home state of Utah to New York where the ballet school is. He found out and upgraded her ticket to first class and got himself the seat next to hers. He then spent the whole flight persuading her to finally yes to going out with him. Romantic? No creepy and also using his financial power to impress/coerce her. Sadly it worked.

[@kevinrtres]

Why sad? It sounds like a happy ending for both of them - just like in the movies where the guy has to overcome all kinds of obstacles to get his wife. I think that outrage against God has gone to someone's head. Romans 1:28 applies.

[@molybdomancer195]

@@kevinrtres there is a fine line between stalking and being romantic. If you can’t tell the difference I pity any partner you have

[@sashadoom]

@@kevinrtres Greetings. My commentary relates to any relationship, not just the Neelemans'. And yes, it got rather lengthy... I would first like to point out that movies aren't real (aside from documentaries). The scenario you mentioned might seem normal due to its pervasiveness among Hallmark movies or cheesy rom-com's, but that doesn't make it healthy or wholesome or ideal or worth emulating. Same can be said of most movies that romanticize things that, when taken at face value without the ribbons and bows and sugar-coating, reveal a more questionable message and/or motive. The message you seem to have received is apparent by the use of the phrase "get his wife". If you see no issues with a relationship initiated by the pursuit and acquisition of a piece of property, a possession, a prize to be earned and displayed in a trophy case, I may be wasting my time, but all I ask is to at least take an objective look at the underlying assertions and assumptions of this type of relationship dynamic. It may be what works for some folks, and that's fine - they embrace the movie fantasy and both partners are on board with the roles they cast themselves in. In the context of an action/adventure/sci-fi movie, having to overcome literal obstacles to reunite with or save your spouse's life is an appropriate part of the plot line. In the context of real life relationships, not so much. Others, myself included, see the cracks in the façade, the absurdity of entering into a relationship in such a manner that completely ignores how people come together in real life (or rather, how they should go about forging a bond in a free country w/o arranged marriages). If 2 people genuinely like each other and enjoy spending time together, you shouldn't have to "get" or "convince" the other person - I mean, why would anyone even want to be with someone whom they have to "wear down"? Have some dignity and let it go if your efforts are not being reciprocated. Groveling and relentless persistence isn't a good look and isn't a healthy foundation for building a relationship. This applies to men and women. Would it still be cute and romantic if a guy was being relentlessly pursued by a woman he'd already turned down? Should he be flattered if she manipulated his travel plans using her family's connections, to where he couldn't escape her attempts to convince him to go on a date with her during an entire flight? If it's unacceptable behavior for one human, it's unacceptable behavior for all humans. Lastly, I don't think it would be very productive to go too deeply on this one, but one can't be outraged at something that they don't believe exists. Rather, it's the unhinged fanatics and the repercussions of their influence on society that tend to piss atheists off. While I can't speak for Emma (whom I assume is the "someone" being referred to), it's a solid and logical hypothesis. Romans 1:28 does not apply if one is an atheist, because we don't care what the Bible says. Without evidence of divine inspiration, it's just a book, a piece of literature. We all know that social media comment-section discussions rarely if ever result in a paradigm change, & that's not my intent. Such exchanges do allow us to see things from different perspectives, which is valuable to not only cultivating understanding and tolerance, but also in reinforcing our convictions by preparing us to defend our beliefs against a wider range of criticism. I would be interested in your thoughts and if I've misinterpreted anything, should you be so inclined to respond.

[@ErynnSchwellinger]

​@@kevinrtresbabe. Those are fantasies. Things cool in fantasies are not always cool in reality.

[@wyleecoyotee4252]

It actually hasn't worked if you've seen more current videos.

[@RobertDeCaire]

If that type of homemaker lifestyle was so great, WHY DID EVERYONE STOP DOING IT AS SOON AS THEY WERE ALLOWED TO?

[@soylencer]

Honestly? I don't know if it's that simple. The real answer is probably financial independence. This is separate from autonomy. If a family had enough money to have "help" at home, the wife probably didn't run off to start a career. Sure she may have wanted to pursue hobbies, those may have even included domestic things. But the economy was changing, and the number one way to get out from under your husband was to go work and pocket a little money for emergencies, and for if your husband drank it all. The fact that people still CHOOSE to live like this shows that it's not simply the social pressure - because of course there is more social pressure *not* to live like this. The autonomy to choose a lifestyle is key.

[@charisma-hornum-fries]

It was also a method to get out of the house and do stuff she wanted. She was working hard in the home and at work while ww1+2 needed them to and when they were over they didn't want to go back to the home as their only job. They also talked to each other jat work and found out that they didn't have to be home with abusive husbands. There's more but takes too long. ​@@soylencer

[@unicorn73212]

​​@@soylencerit's definitely a financial issue people get together because they can't afford to live alone or at least they were not raised to be a career woman oddly enough my parents raised me from an early age of 14 to take a job bagging groceries at the supermarket for 5.60 an hour stuff was different back then it was easy to make a living because groceries were cheaper so if they were not raised to be independent by there parents they usually become co dependent on there parents resources or there husbands resources. That's why people thank me now because they realized just how long I worked in retail it's not a new thing I'm trying out just so I can have some pocket change you can live off a small income if you learn how to save your paychecks it's just annoying because you will see money in your account that you can't spend.

[@soylencer]

@@unicorn73212 well I think it's important that people contribute to a household in a tangible way. Either with income or labor. But my main point and answer to the user above is that if it was all terrible, we wouldn't be seeing a revival. The problem is the toxicity and bigotry emanating from the main proponents of the lifestyle: heteronormative religious fundies and vanilla bigots/chauvinists. Other than that, it would be great to have one partner run the house and one partner secure funds, ideally conferring and convening on budgeting/priority projects and childcare. There is a perceived imbalance when one partner makes all the money the other is spending, but that's actually a *concession* not an imbalance. The homemaker does not get time off, they are always clocked and on-call. The breadwinner gives a share of their income the same way the boss throws pizza parties and holiday bonuses - you keep your morale up at home and both parties prosper. Note that I don't care about the gender in this example, despite that it describes a two-adult household [and regardless of relationships - married, siblings, roomies, adult child/parent, etc]. Homes with three or more adults will need to figure out a split that works for them. The biggest key is that it works great, and it has for millennia, except for when people are *forced* to do it, and become prisoners in their own homes, which is why we saw such a rebellion from it once the social attitudes began to change. In traditional families, I'm sure many strong feminists returned home once they became able in the 90s and 2000s, and for sure more men stayed home once their wives started out-earning them. The only downside there is the generational knowledge lost as women were not at home to pass home-making and practical knowledge to their children, and Home Economics started to dry up as a skill set... That is not to say that they SHOULD have stayed home, it's just taking a few generations to rebound from, especially in the west -- People moved on to paid child care, cleaning services, and packaged food as both parents were out working -- disregarding that this cuts the net income level of the second worker, it means that our current later-Millennial and early-Zoomers adults grew up with mothers who had to work for economic reasons, and grandmothers who chose to work for social reasons, and grew up without the traditional matriarchal lessons. Again, it's not that it's inherently "a woman's place", it's that it was systemically the woman's role and most men simply didn't know how to run a household, having never had to. (Old WASP men who can't load a washing machine properly are a real threat). So to bring that back in, we have youth (any gender) who never got proper training on how to cook and clean and budget and mend and etc., and that is probably why we are seeing such a rebound today, or at least a trend of finding the comfort in nostalgic self-reliance content like Trad stuff or DIY and cooking videos (but also why most of these are "dumb" common knowledge hacks and basic skills that the comments seem mind-blown by). Tldr: autonomy is super important, and regardless of gender, someone should be at last *able* to care for their home, and for better or worse we lost a bit of that. But it's also generally a positive step that women, specifically, are not generally locked in their houses any longer.

[@meguca201]

This is generally the critical logical problem that all conservatism runs into, and it's why conservatism always collapses into Nazism. Here's the picture: in the conservative ethos, societal form has already been perfected. Traditional hierarchies, alongside gender roles, are thought to be determined according to objective nature. It is not the form that is faulty, but human beings, whose divergence from the form is what brings about societal decay. Conservatives believe the goal of politics is to keep a watchful, punitive eye over such divergences, to stop subjective human inclinations deviating from the natural, perfect order of things. But therein lies a contradiction: if the natural order of things is perfect, then how could such divergence ever emerge? How is it possible for a perfect system to disrupt itself and become imperfect over time? The answer is always that this differentiation or alterity is brought about by an absolute Other. It's not that women are unhappy with the supposedly objective order of things, and that the system itself generates its own destruction---this conclusion is impossible in conservative logic. If they admitted this, the whole thing falls apart, because they would have to admit that what they want to conserve is something that doesn't work. Rather, it must be something from the outside that has invaded our perfect system, and disrupted the natural order of things. This must be the foreigner. This must be the Marxist. This must be the jew. So on and so forth. Taken to its logical conclusion, conservatism must always posit an absolute Other, some externality that is the root cause of the "natural" order's decay, because they cannot identify the cause internally. As such, all conservatism collapses into Nazism, the belief that societal harmony must be maintained by the full eradication of this external Other.

[@YourNewSleepParalysisDemon]

I have pill cases that have vintage 1950s pictures of housewives that says "Mommy's Little Helper" on one and "I used to care, but i took a pill for that - better living thru chemistry."

[@stephennootens916]

If I remember right the company that sold those pills hid the fact they weren't addictive and course birth defects from the public.

[@desperadox7565]

They ain't really vintage though. Mostly post-Rolling Stones era.

[@YourNewSleepParalysisDemon]

@@desperadox7565 Yea. They have vintage pictures of women on them. My actual vintage pill boxes have flowers on them.

[@HalfAsleepSam]

tasty pill

[@patrickcardon1643]

Vintage is usually linked to one's age ... black and white movies are normal for me but utterly vintage for kids ... depends what you grew up with. I would assume people consider something vintage if it's from before they were born.

[@SpyderQueen1988]

Jessica Kellgren-Fozard is a great example of vintage aesthetic not vintage views, she's stunning and so's her wife!

[@megdelaney3677]

❤ Jessica & Claudia! & little Ru too!

[@justynmatlock8873]

I was just thinking that !

[@ClaraDarko]

Yes! Jessica is gorgeous and her whole vintage look is magnificent, yet she's an advocate for progressive causes like equal rights for LGBTQ+ and disabled folks!

[@picksleydust4985]

Jessica was my first thought when Emma started taking about vintage fashion

[@austinluther5825]

And her snark game is top notch. Just *chef's kiss*

[@TrolletAmok]

My wife died from cancer a couple of years ago. While it was hard, I did not fall to pieces because I was the one that did the most cooking and washing up, and I learned from a young age how to clean a house and wash clothes (and we did share those tasks, though she would insist on doing more as she felt guilty leaving the kitchen to me). You never know what curveballs life will throw at you, learn to take care of yourself.

[@Insertia_Nameia]

I remember so many cases where the wife would die first and learning why it's tradition for when that happens is for all her friends and the wives of his friends to always bring pre-made meals that are easily frozen and thawed and microwaved for the windower until he can remarry. Because most of them could barely boil a pot of water on the stove, let alone make even some dry pasta and doctor up some store bought sauce to go along with it.

[@jackrussell1232]

It's also disturbing that all ads targeted at women from the 50s were actually targeted at their husbands to use on them. You know, kind of like how dog toys are marketed to their human owners? It's like they saw their wives merely as housekeeping robots that require regular maintenance, which is reinforced by the fact that all of these tradwives come across exactly like uncanny valley androids from weird sci fi novellas.

[@scloftin8861]

Ah, Stepford Wives reference! Cool.

[@Mimim0n]

I am very jealous of this frog blouse

[@Ann_T_Social]

There should be a frog blouse movement.

[@MacMoonie]

OMG me too... I LOVE this blouse!

[@abiliv-lf9tz]

Flower crown too :3

[@weschilton]

It is pretty epic.

[@slocoast5]

Agreed 😂Omg! Her glasses 👓 got subtle greenish tint 🐸

[@neil2796]

My mother was a SAHM whose first of 9 kids was born in 1950. These tradwife kids (get off my lawn) think real life was like the TV shows of the era. They could not be more wrong.

[@keithlevkoff8579]

But, of course, all they know about it is what they saw on those old TV shows... And, as I recall, June Cleaver (Leave it to Beaver's mom) always SEEMED really happy... Her biggest concern was probably what "the ladies" were talking about at "the beauty parlor"... (Although we never heard how women in those days managed to afford to spend a day a week at that beauty parlor.)

[@queenmotherhane4374]

Right? As a kid in the ‘50s and ‘60s with a SAHM, I used to watch those shows and think, “I don’t know anybody who lives like that.” In our neighborhood, we lived in little starter homes and nobody’s dad went to work carrying a briefcase.

[@Sableagle]

9 kids born in the 50s (and maybe early 60s)? How many of them saw 1970?

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

⁠ My mom was born in the 50’s, and I actually used to get upset that she wasn’t like the mom’s in the old shows from the 50’s. She was abusive, emotionally distant, always needed to start drama, blamed the kids for everything, etc. I later learned that her mom was 10x worse and most people’s mom’s from that era were like that because they had no rights, were abused by their husbands, and took it out on the kids to have some form of control. My mom’s better now, but it makes me sick whenever she acts like her mom was amazing or someone not from the 50’s glamorizes that era. It was a nightmare for many as I’ve heard. Even the child star from leave it to beaver said he wouldn’t go back.

[@stainlesssteellemming3885]

@@Sableagle Well, the ones born in the early 50s had to survive Vietnam. But generally, as someone born in that period, we had effective health care by then (I think my first Vaccine was smallpox, with Polio a few years later) - and families were already getting smaller (3-5 kids, not 10). In the First World, it was much less common to know people who'd lost siblings. My parents' generation (born in the first third of the 20th century) were more of the 6-10 kids size and, barring two wars (both our fathers went to Korea, the oldest uncles were in WW II), most survived into their 70s or 80s. Though it was more routine for 2 or 3 of those kids not to survive into their teens. The usual indicator was when you had a large age gap between two of the kids - that often meant there was one in between which didn't make it. Our grandparents, born late 19th Century, also came from large families - and childhood mortality was much more common. But then you're throwing in kids working in mines, no electricity, few vaccines, no antibiotics, and two World Wars (my grandfather fought in both of them). And, frankly, we stopped at 3 kids only because of finances. Otherwise, we would have happily kept going - 5 would have been good.

[@queenmotherhane4374]

Re “housedresses”: Those were what my mother wore around the house to do housework in the ‘50s and ‘60s. They weren’t what a woman wore to go out on errands. Re the Tradwife phenomenon: You can be the world’s best cook, homemaker, mother, hostess, supportive wife, etc. etc. etc.-but if you aren’t thin and pretty and perfectly coiffed, you don’t count.

[@znail4675]

As for thin, women are much harsher about that then men are. You don't even need to be thin to get or keep a man, it's mostly being obese that are an issue, but then that have other issues as well. But most importantly, you will have a hard time claiming men are pickier then women.

[@pembrokeshiredan]

Wife: I want to dance ballet! Husband: Ballerina? BalleriNO!

[@valolafson6035]

Balleri-nah

[@DaveLH]

It reminds me of Paul and Morgan, because didn't Morgan have dreams of being a singer before she knew Paul and got lassoed into a "tradwife" lifestyle?

[@ChymoNZM]

The voice is a mormon thing, ex-mormon women often reflect on how their manner of speaking changed after leaving

[@diestormlie]

I've head it called 'Fundie Baby Voice'.

[@StarlightEdith]

That’s interesting. I just recently joined the church. I’ve never particularly noticed a “voice” aside from the prayer voice, and sometimes missionary voice (this only apply to two people I know and one only does the voice when she’s talking about the spirit).

[@pollysshore2539]

@@diestormlieYes, and it’s not just a Mormon thing. Who is the politician that recently gave a speech from a kitchen? I’ve blocked out her name. Scar Jo did a brilliant parody of her on SNL. She completely changed her speech pattern and did the breathy, sexy (so they think 🤢), fundie baby voice. It’s a character/adopted persona for sure. I have a 26 year old co worker that was sheltered and homeschooled by conspiratorial religious fundamentalist parents that struggle with mental health issues. (She is very sweet, can’t help the way she was raised, I love her to bits and want so much better for her.) She is on the spectrum, has ADHD, she was not really socialized, basic hygiene can elude her times (she constantly steps out the back door to blow boogers out of her nose and onto the sidewalk😂), her every day self is fairly tom boyish but even she does the fundie baby voice at times. She sounds more like an actual 7 year old with a lisp when she does it. She does it when she wants to come across as being very helpful and pleasing to people at work. It’s not meant to be remotely sexy or pernicious in her case and I don’t think she even realizes she does it. Everyone can and will engage in code switching at times but the fundie baby voice is a very specific type of code switch that can and will be used to manipulate others.

[@diestormlie]

@@pollysshore2539 I think the article I read talking about it was written in the wake of that 'Kitchen Table' speech, actually!

[@pollysshore2539]

@@diestormlie.Katie Britt! That’s her name. The Duggar mom is a good example. Several Mormons talk about the soft spoken voice Mormon men adopt as well when they need to seem Godly and kind. My co worker has never been married, though she is currently engaged to her first love, so she is really slipping back into the voice of an actual child. It’s most likely something she did when speaking to her parents. *She also uses the voice when talking to her sister. “Hi, sissy! What doin? I workin’. I uv you, sissy!” They will both keep the conversation going like that for some time. It’s not just a silly sisterly greeting. They have a good 10 min conversation in baby talk and then settle in to their actual voices. It’s kind of jarring when I hear her do it on the phone at work because she naturally has a bit of a deeper voice (as do I) and she is fairly loud and boisterous most of the time, It is a voice often used by women to show submission around men, submission in church. Someone might infantilize themselves to come across as smaller, weaker, in need of kid gloves. It can be done in an attempt to thwart anger and abuse. It’s also used when trying to manipulate, when being fairly malicious - sarcastic to others, when gossiping … Among some couples it is a form of fundamentalist age play. It’s a kink, a fetish.

[@seansteele6532]

Me a little tradwife building my little Warhammer 40K Ork army. “It’s important to have something just for you.”

[@LordVolkov]

Does your husband know about the Boyz you're playing with? 🤔

[@electronics-girl]

I spend most of my day in the kitchen... writing code on my laptop at the kitchen table.

[@seansteele6532]

@@LordVolkov Someone's gotta crump his basic ass Ultramarine Army.

[@sarahthesarah2850]

Da Boyz da Best! Orkz da Best! Green da Best Giv im a propa krumpin 🧌🍄 Da gitz gonna get zoggin krumped fur eva cuz Orkz da Best! 🦷🦷🦷 Gotz sum flashy dakka for da boys who krump fur ya?

[@AsassinoSilenzioso]

New source of biomass found, deployment of vanguard bioform started

[@donpark8316]

I grew up in a "traditional family" situation and I always felt bad for my mom. She would get up at 3:30 am to get ready and make sure my dad had a cooked meal before leaving the house at 5am. Fast forward about 54 years and she was in her 80's. I went for a visit and this was still going on even though my dad had retired. I was helping her cook dinner one night and she said to me in a whisper, "your dad is retired." I was like ok, I know this. She said "when the f@ck can I retire? It was pretty funny but she was tired, had arthritic hands and had trouble walking. My dad pretty much sat in front of the TV watching Fox News. After my dad passed, she never cooked again, she had prepared meals delivered. Last week she moved into an assisted living condo/apartment. I hope she can relax during her retirement.

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

This is a good point that I hardly see anyone bring up. I get the vibe that these trad-wives think they’re going to be living luxe when their husbands retire, but that’s not true. Wives and mothers never retire unless their husband makes so much that they can shift the labor onto hired help and even then the wife is still expected to perform her other duties while the man just relaxes. It’s rather funny because the trad-wives say they don’t want to be a wage slave, but you can eventually retire from a job.

[@2degucitas]

​@@tiahnarodriguez3809 They just become another kind of slave.

[@Agarwaen]

they're basicly larping 1950s magazine fantazies.

[@AnotherCraig]

It's just so creepy; an inauthentic, propagandistic copy of an inauthentic, propagandistic lifestyle

[@happytofu5]

worse, in LARP, people generally know and communicate that they are just pretending and that they are not actually knights and mages

[@daa5249]

@@AnotherCraig Yes, a wife staying home and raising the kids and enjoying it is down right creepy. More women would be this creepy if their household could afford one earner.

[@Aeivious]

​@daa5249 way to intentionally miss the point. Nothing wrong with a stay at home parent. Being a Trad wife is so much further down the rabbit hole than being a stay at home parent.

[@Agarwaen]

@@daa5249 except this is still a larp fantazy. you're dreaming about a small post war period and a small subset of the population, where a woman could be at home doing nothing but cooking and cleaning while the husband earned a wage.

[@chloewright1]

It's the home birthing that worries me about this "trend" I had my baby in hospital 17 years ago, without pain medication. There were complications and the umbilical cord got wrapped around my baby's neck and it was critical that the dr's got him out immediately. I couldn't push him out though, so the dr's had to cut me open and remove my baby with something called a "ventouse" (it's like a suction device that literally sucks the baby out of you) anyway, the reason I'm mentioning all of this is because I would have lost my baby if I hadn't been in a hospital. My pregnancy went without a hitch right up until the birth. Things can go wrong all of a sudden and if you're not in a hospital with the necessary equipment and people who have been trained to use it, the smallest thing can become life threatening in the shortest amount of time.

[@Saol.Alainn]

Thanks for sharing, but I wish I'd never heard of a baby vacuum 😂

[@charisma-hornum-fries]

Your story is not unusual. That's exactly as you say why a hospital is a safer choice. Especially when talking about the suctioning that couldn't have been done in a home setting. Of course there's the aftercare and monitoring you and your baby.

[@charisma-hornum-fries]

​@@Saol.AlainnIt's not unusual.

[@scloftin8861]

Sorry you had the issue. And good that you were in the perfect place for you. Sadly, not all hospitals or doctors are as on the ball as yours was. And most midwives today are trained professionals and know when to transport. First kid got stuck, 40 years ago, and some of the attitude because I had chosen a home birth was so condescending, and they literally waited until the baby was in distress, two hours after I got to the hospital, before deigning to do an emergency C-section. Experiences differ and I am incredibly glad you were where you needed to be to help you and the baby survive.

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

@@scloftin8861 You’re right, but the point is giving birth at home is not always a magical experience and neither are doctors, but if the event that something does go wrong it’s best to have your options open. I’ve seen women put their babies lives in danger and insist on a midwife just so they can brag that they had a natural birth. I consider that a form of endangerment. The doctors who helped you were jerks and likely deigned you care to try to teach you a lesson. I know how that goes and I’m sorry that happened to you. It wasn’t right.

[@marc21256]

You hinted that women in tradwife get "trapped" there. That's exactly how wives were back then, so that's quite authentic.

[@matthewwakeman5047]

I used to have a vacuum cleaner but I got rid of it; it was only gathering dust.

[@EnbyFranziskaNagel]

😂

[@carriepinkduck]

Ba-dum-cha! 🥁

[@sandorski56]

That sucks.

[@h3rbsman]

Well there’s your problem, you gotta get the vacuum first and then the cleaner

[@RealPumpkinJay]

😂😂

[@apocrypha5363]

Back then, if you were a housewife who wasn't happy with that life, you were told you were a bad woman. You were told that unhappiness was a failure of yours and you should feel shameful to not living up to the feminine ideal. So they stayed quiet. They pretended to be happy because they thought all the other women were happy and they didn't want to be the one who wasn't... I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of the white, middle-class women back then were miserable and pretending not to be and thinking they were the only one doing that... And honestly, that terrifies me.

[@electronics-girl]

My mom was a white, middle-class, stay-at-home mom, and sometimes when I would get up in the middle of the night to get a drink of water, I would find her sitting at the kitchen table, in complete darkness, crying.

[@tealkerberus748]

The lucky ones were drugged so they didn't have to think about how miserable their lives were.

[@wyleecoyotee4252]

You were told to endure

[@thomashooper2451]

Emma's trad-wife voice took years off of my life. Great impression

[@kingdomgnark]

when you said it was interesting that women are traditionally the cooks in the house and men are more traditionally chefs you have to realize that it isn't about the task, it's about whether or not performing it is seen as socially lower status or one that garners respect. The chef is a boss in charge, the man grilling at the party is the center of attention, the woman in the kitchen is an unnamed servant. When you look at history at gender roles with tasks that seem similar to tasks that men would take in certain situations but not others, you will find the common thread is always whether it is done in a respected role vs acting like a lowly servant without thanks.

[@tomokolovecraft3792]

I'm reminded of the saying "tradition is peer pressure from dead people."

[@uberrod]

I'm a guy and my mom raised me as a feminist, not overtly, but it just happened. She taught my brother and I how to cook, sew, do laundry. At age 9 I used a cookbook and made potato pancakes from scratch. I was also raised Mormon (I got better) and as a teenager there was a "class" for the young men to prepare them to be away on their missions for a couple years. We were given simple household tasks like sewing a button, making a simple meal, etc. Some guy (one in charge) grabbed my button and gave it a good yank expecting it to fall apart. It held and he couldn't pull it apart. I was like, "Dude, i know how to sew. Buttons aren't that hard." They were shocked. Really shocked that I could sew.

[@DaveB-hg7el]

I learned the same skills from an early age because my grandmother grew up poor in strip mining country. If you didn't do for yourself there, you went without. Both my grandmother and my mother made sure that all of us four boys understood that lesson from their history, and I've been grateful ever since. Peace 💚

[@connla]

25:30 I'm reminded at how angry a lot of boys on twitter and those specific corners of youtube over films like The Woman King and filled wikipedia etc with all the historical innaccuracies, but they'll embrace these fantastical interpretations of 1950s america or Ancient Rome without question and get angry at anyone that tries to factcheck either.

[@KC-2049]

"'historical inaccuracy" and "realism" only apply when feminists do it, duh. it's the same in the nerd community. of course Batman can walk through AR fire and be absolutely fine, even though the whole bottom of his face is uncovered. or paste the side of a bus in a wingsuit going probably close to 100 km an hour and walk away. it's such a grounded and gritty and REAL film. but those women in Birds of Prey using their established skills as trained fighters/henchmen/cops/superheroes in the exact same cinematic universe to kick the shit out of a bunch of muscly dudes? nah, unrealistic - burn it. lol

[@iluvtacos1231]

God, I would be so mortified to admit on video that I hadn't done a full load of laundry during my marriage, or that I needed to call my wife to learn how to use the dishwasher.

[@pollysshore2539]

I am so relieved that my 26 year old co worker has actually found a decent guy. I worried about her for 2+ years (still do) because she was homeschooled and sheltered by fundamentalist conspiracy theorists. She was raised to believe that her main purpose in life is being a submissive wife and mother. She was not allowed to watch/read/hear anything from the “outside world”. She was taught to distrust medicine and doctors. She still has absolutely no idea how awful her education was. I had to teach her to write in something resembling complete sentences. She says her mother was a teacher but I have my doubts. She believes her homeschool curriculum was approved by educational experts and closely monitored by them. Her one and only SE lesson was being taken to a billboard that said life begins at conception. She was raised to prep for Armageddon. I could go on but you get the picture. She is a very sweet young woman with a heart of gold. She is more open minded than you would expect when it comes to several topics, and as close minded as you would expect on a few others. She cannot help the way she was raised. She is smarter and more capable than she realizes and she deserves a fighting chance. I was so relieved when I heard that her fiancé told her, her parents, sister and the unqualified couple doing their pre marriage counseling that he would NOT be the head of the house, she would NOT be submissive or subordinate to him and they would be equal partners. So far he has pushed back on all the right things. He even got her to take a breath right after he proposed. She was trying to rush to have a wedding because she wanted to get to the honeymoon at warp speed. It’s the classic saturated in purity culture since birth, has a mental breakdown about being “impure” every time she makes out with her fiancé, conundrum that makes people feel the need to rush. Her sister was married 3 weeks after her husband proposed. I fear she wont be able to shake the lessons of purity culture after marriage. He’s had to discuss why they cannot have a family and live on one income on sustainable farm while awaiting Armageddon. It’s not feasible, reasonable or doable. It’s still a struggle. Recently she announced that they decided that she would be staying at home and homeschooling their future children in one of pre wedding “therapy” seasons and he said - No! No we didn’t. He knows she is not equipped to educate others when she did not have anything resembling an education herself. Again, he also knows they cannot afford it as a new couple/family. Maybe she can stay at home one day, with one child, until they start school. That’s a reality for many. Making sure you can afford a roof, food, and basic necessities is priority number one. Instead she has become hyper focused on raising her children the exact same way she was raised because that is what she was trained to do. It’s scared me at times because she has now decided that a Christian school is the way to go after being told, by multiple evangelicals, that Christian schools do not prioritize education. I don’t understand the disconnect even though I know she was raised to believe that standard education is bad and buying into conspiracy theories is “intellectual”. I’m amazed she doesn’t believe in a wider range of theories but she has been convinced to not trust anyone/anything outside of her faith. Progress is being made, slowly but surely, but it’s a bear. * Edit to fix autocorrects

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

Her finance explaining to her why they can’t live off of one income on a farm waiting for Armageddon took me out. I e had to explain this to many women and they still wouldn’t to believe me 😂. Average income in the US is $65k. Ain’t nobody living comfortably on a farm baking fresh sourdough all day on that.

[@pollysshore2539]

@@tiahnarodriguez3809 No, and we live in an area that runs behind the national average. Her parents barely squeaked by. Typically people want something more for their children but the way she was raised = the exact opposite. A proper education? No. Being closer to financial security? No. It’s an ideology that keeps people stuck in the same place, while demonizing asking for help.

[@fepeerreview3150]

3:50 Just getting started with the video here and as always, it promises to be excellent. I want to bring up one serious problem with "trad wives" that Emma may or may not get to. When the women has no professional life outside the home she is in a financial trap. So long as the marriage is happy she's okay. But if anything goes wrong she has: 1. No job skills (probably, unless she happened to pick some up before getting married, which ideally for trad wives is very young) 2. No job history 3. No related contributions to Social Security, unemployment insurance, pension plans, retirement plans, etc. This complete dependence on her husband for her survival means that he can be the world's worse @**hole, who lies, cheats, physically and psychologically abuses her, and there's not much of anything she can do about it. I strongly encourage any young woman who finds the "trad wife" idea appealing and seductive to take a step back and really focus on the worst possible outcome, because the worst possible outcome happens on a daily basis to women everywhere.

[@danilooliveira6580]

yeah, I saw that happen first hand. a friend of mine married and got pregnant very early, and she had a terrible marriage. after a few years they finally divorced and now she has practically no work experience and can only find simple jobs that require no experience and pay practically nothing. she is looking for a new husband mostly because she want someone to take care of her because working makes her miserable. though at the same time I've the same situation with other people turn really well because they had an amazing marriage, like my father and stepmom. the difference is that most of those cases that turn well the wife have hobbies for themselves, not just taking care of the home, and sometimes they turn profitable. the thing is that these "profitable hobbies" only work because they have someone that support them so they can just spend time doing something they like without worry. the problem is that you never know if your significant other will be someone that will support you on your ventures or will use and abuse you because you don't have other choice.

[@h3rbsman]

And that’s not to mention how only fairly recently did women have the ability to even open a bank account, so they were already pressured into to jump into a marriage as soon as possible

[@lanorte1]

Yes, yes, yes, 100%!

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

I disagree. Even if the marriage is happy. Plenty of tradwives have found out that their husbands did it set anything aside for them, they have no bank account of their own, she doesn’t qualify for social security, and life insurance does not pay well. In short the wives are happy until later down the road when the reality of their situation hits.

[@danilooliveira6580]

@@tiahnarodriguez3809 that is maybe US thing, because here the wives are entitled to continue receiving the retirement of their husbands AND life insurance. it's actually a problem with military wives because they don't just get a very generous pension after their husband die, but their daughter are also entitled to receive it after their parents die. my Brother when he used to work for the army he even found a case where a woman received pension from both her father AND her husband (both deceased, but she was supposed to receive only one pension) and she didn't even know, she had a fortune saved that no one knew about because she never bothered looking into her bank account and her children were all well off and independent. I'm not sure what came of it though, if they allowed her to keep the money or she had to give it back.

[@jakeking3859]

I watched the Anti-Bot's (Taylor's) video on this, just this morning, and in the Times' article, she read even further into it, where The Ballerina Farm (Hannah?) said that her now husband basically stalked her for I think it said years, following her around and continuing to ask her out until he asked his father to pull some strings and get him a seat next to her on her flight. I would not want to know what kinds of things he said to her, then. I can only imagine it had something of a threatening undertone, even if the words he spoke were 'innocent' - the message was already sent; "I can follow you literally anywhere, I know where you are, and I will not stop until I have you." I am honestly so terrified for that poor woman, and I hope that she can get out before something really, really bad happens.

[@LordVolkov]

That he then rushed her into marriage and pregnancy to squash her dancing career is so gross.

[@purple8133]

Her whole story, from the little that has been shared, is so fucking sad.

[@patrickcardon1643]

If they were sitting in a Boeing she would have had a chance to get rid of him ...

[@nbhubbard]

My grandma was a traditional grannie who got up every morning several hours before my grandpa and cooked his breakfast on a huge wood-burning stove. Grandpa was a traditional husband who expected a large breakfast waiting for him when he got up, and he liked a big breakfast: bacon, eggs, flapjacks, buttered biscuits, the works. I grew up in the Fifties of working-class parents who both worked full-time, yet my mom was still expected to cook, wash dishes, do laundry, etc on top of her job. My father never helped with any of that stuff. He enjoyed being the pater familias instead. But when Mom's schedule at the auto plant shifted to evenings, those domestic duties fell upon me as the eldest son (my four younger brothers- the rats- never helped out with any of it). Turns out I enjoyed housework: especially cooking, which I loved (the texture of the ingredients, the smell of the cooking food and the rewards of the taste of the finished product)--and still do. Good thing too, because I married an ex-hippie chick who's not as domestic as me.

[@soyevquirsefron990]

I’m a standard masculine guy and I used to support the family with my masculine union job, but I still did the dishes and laundry when I had time, because those are routine things that need to be done the same way every day and I could do that when I was exhausted and half asleep so that my wife could be attentive to the kid’s ever-changing daily crisis and she could think about future plans while I was getting us through the week one day at a time. She also went to college in her 30s and gets paid as much as I do so now we take turns with who works more overtime and who eases off and pays attention to the household and I’m not stumbling home exhausted every day and she’s not stuck in the house with the kids every day.

[@CrzyLaAnd]

Trad wife stuff is just depressing. I don't think I've seen trad wife content that didn't ultimate advocate for regressing women's rights or raging against feminism despite feminism being about have the freedom to choose how you want to live.

[@christopherflux6254]

I know housewives who aren’t anti-feminists and have genuinely chosen that role for themselves. (Their husbands are respectful men) But they don’t have social media channels, so they aren’t doing the traditional housewife thing to push an agenda.

[@poulhenne]

@@christopherflux6254: The problem is not the stay at home part or SoMe-stuff, but whether the husband allowed her to have a real choice of career. There is no problem in liking to spend many hours in the kitchen, it is the “husband forcing the wife to stay there” that is problematic. And of course the culture selling the narrative that it is “the only natural career” for a woman. If it was so obviously great, they wouldn’t have to force and manipulate women into that careerpath (which is maybe a bit too strong a word for it).

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

@@christopherflux6254 There’s a huge difference than a housewife vs a tradwife. Even the most respectful of tradhusbands ultimately is for the oppression of their wives in the form of making them submissive under them. Housewives have more freedom and aren’t always subjected to trad-views or to the same degree as tradwives.

[@hexonyou]

yeah the voice is definitely that very practiced "keep sweet" sort of thing; it's probably not her real voice or cadence, but definitely a practiced piece of the tradwife puzzle. Also the sad and creepy part of Hannah's story is that she wasn't really interested in the man who is now her husband, but he was very smitten with her and to buy time for them to get to know each other he had his airline owning dad find out what flight she was on and put him next to her.... She was literally trapped on an hours long flight next to him by his own design. He pursued her hard in the way that extremely rich fundie guys can/do, and she was raised to think that was a good thing (even though she herself was trying to pursue a life outside of that sort of upbringing; she was a really accomplished ballerina with all the potential and chance ahead of her... but his will wins out for what she gets to be/do)

[@onceuponamelody]

I was married from 2009 from 2013, and was part of a fundamentalist baptist church (think: Duggars, but not quite as strict - women could wear pants) from 2007 to 2014. I wanted to be a "tradwife" so bad, because our pastors said that was what would make our husbands happy, our marriages successful, and bring us closer to God (as a child of divorce I wanted all of that SO BADLY). I was then cheated on multiple times by my then-husband and left for another woman -alone at home with a toddler and without a job. I'm lucky I had family and friends who helped me out, but damn if I wasn't taken in by a huge lie invented by the patriarchy to make men's lives easier. (I'm an atheist now with a college degree and not a part of that church or religion and I'm happier than ever. :) ) The reason I bring religion into this is because the majority of these tradwives ARE some type of fundamentalist. Hannah Neileman is Mormon. Their religion has a LOT to do with their lifestyles. It is THE basis for the way they live their lives and WHY they think they need to show everyone else how they think they should live THEIR lives. Hospital births are frowned upon because "God is in control" and therefore doctors are not seen as needed (if a baby or mom dies during childbirth, it is "God's will").

[@astreaward6651]

The whole "tradwife" thing vaguely reminds me of the Völkisch movement that culminated in the rise of the Nazis. I don't know how to explain it but it's all bound up with nationalism, faux-wholesomeness, and a premise that we need to "return to simplicity." It all just makes my skin crawl, TBH.

[@tealkerberus748]

All the key tenets of nazism came from the US. History is repeating itself - misogyny, transphobia, and homophobia running rampant in the US, alt-right parties rising in Europe, and racism everywhere.

[@glennhiggins7680]

Me mum (bless her heart) once said that she wished to live in "past times". I pointed out that she`d have to pluck and disembowel a chicken for Sunday dinner. She blanched.....

[@queenmotherhane4374]

My grandmother used to do that back in the ‘20s and ‘30s!

[@grumpy_gremlin]

She wants to live in "past times", but she wants to be really wealthy 😂 she just needs to be more specific in her wish (oh, and okay with being the property of a man for about 90% of historical periods).

[@Colddirector]

Let me tell you, a single bout with pneumonia was enough to completely beat any desire to live in the pre-antibiotic age out of me. I have modern science to thank that a particularly bad month wasn't like three or four, or didn't straight up just kill me.

[@visaman]

My grandmother did that.

[@CaptainRedBull]

Almost done with this video & I'm stuck on "sometimes she's so exhausted she can't get out of bed for a week". How does this sound like anything other than moderate/severe depression? There's no amount of physical exhaustion that requires a week in bed to recover from...That's something else.

[@hetislarsje]

You're right, that's mental exhaustion, not physical. And sounds more like burn-out or some form of depression. Definitely something she should see a doctor about.

[@Colddirector]

To be slightly fair, when I had severe allergy problems and a bad sleeping schedule last year, I'd basically sleep all weekend because my body's trying to make up its sleep debt for the rest of the week. I definitely wasn't depressed, I was just pushing myself way too hard with an untreated medical condition.

[@peterdeane4490]

Could also be anemia, although I'm sure there's an element of depression there.

[@tealkerberus748]

Chronic fatigue and a really bad bout of post exertion malaise can knock you down for several days, but if you've got chronic fatigue you know about it - literally all the time.

[@user-td3yi1mq7p]

THere are other things that can cause that, but it's not something to be brushed off in any case.

[@didograce3531]

I'm so, *SO* glad that you mention homeschooling as part of the tradwife trend. I am one of those people with the negative experience you talk about (starting at 10:20): I was homeschooled for 15 years and have spent all my life since then trying to make lemonade out of the sh!tty lemons that being homeschooled dealt me, and failing despite my best efforts. It's had severe and permanent effects on my mental (and maybe even physical?) health that I don't wish on anyone. It's one thing if you want to follow a more "traditional" lifestyle for yourself because that's what makes you genuinely happy. However, if you homeschool your children only so you can isolate them from the real world and brainwash them for religious and/or political reasons, *THE CHILDREN* have to suffer the negative consequences of that education (or lack thereof) *FOR THE REST OF THEIR LIVES.* Same goes for medicine: it's one thing if you choose to completely forego modern medicine, doctors, or hospitals for yourself, but when parents make that risky choice *for children,* they are committing medical neglect. Thank you so much for this video. Child rights suffer so much in communities that prioritize parents' backwards religious or political ideologies over what is best for the child. ❤

[@DaveB-hg7el]

Yes, and the worst part of it is that there's almost no oversight on home schooling. It seems that the government is too afraid of religion to do the right thing. Peace 💚

[@didograce3531]

@@DaveB-hg7el absolutely. I grew up in Texas where there’s literally no oversight, thanks to homeschool advocacy groups.* I could’ve disappeared completely and the government or school district would’ve never known because we weren’t even required to tell anyone. No contact with mandatory reporters either, where I could’ve told them in private about what I was dealing with at home. *At the state level there’s the Texas Home School Coalition (THSC). There’s also the Home School Legal Defense Association (HSLDA) at the national level. Both organizations are run by religious conservatives/fundamentalists who support parental rights at the expense of the rights of children.

[@emmyswordhand2711]

Ironically, i love putting on these "house dresses" as costumes. It makes me focused when im cleaning my house, and i feel fun. Its nice. Granted, I'm a single gay nonbinary person who only has cats, not kids. I also do it with no makeup because i would wear makeup for me, not others.

[@stephennootens916]

While I am more dog person I must say even though it might be controversial cats are better than children.

[@denisemayosky1955]

Hey, you do you!!👍

[@CAPSLOCKPUNDIT]

No house dress for me, please. I wear a kaftan for the cleaning chores.

[@kevinbissinger]

How are you gay if you're non-binary? Do you only find other non-binary people attractive? Asking because I'm autistic and very literal and confused

[@dutchess406]

Same but trans femme with dogs and a trans partner

[@pher2chris]

I have never heard anything so pathetic as a bunch of grown men saying they don't know how to do the laundry or dishes. Also sewing has never been mainly a female thing, tailoring for instance is and has always been mostly a male profession.

[@zotha]

Seven home births.. so she statistically extremely lucky to even be alive.

[@smokinggnu6584]

I find the concept of willingly submitting yourself to this kind of subservient life... unsettling.

[@MrEmpireBuilder0000]

Emma hit the nail on the head. The patriarchal/religious influence is VERY subtle. I see it with my conservative relatives A LOT.

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

It’s subtle till you get into their inner circle. Then it’s undeniably in your face that’s why this content is so dangerous because it subtly tells girls to be one way and be for they know it they’re enmeshed in right wing propaganda.

[@gregorsamsa4580]

I remember the 50s. You want them, take them. They weren’t so romantic at the time.

[@stephennootens916]

I do note remember the fifties but I have seen enough moves made at the time that there wild sex crazy violent teenage gangs roaming every town some even smoking dope. I have seen The Violent Years and know about the girl gangs robbing gas stations and raping men.

[@visaman]

Happy Days was filmed in front of a live audience.

[@wendyheatherwood]

"Butcher block altar" sounds like a phrase from a particularly dark Nick Cave song.

[@DaveB-hg7el]

Ooh, love the reference. Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds is a very underrated band. Peace 💚

[@theresamnsota3925]

Not only is the Ballerina Farm wife a professional dancer, she is a Julliard trained professional dancer. The dance program at Julliard accepts only 18-26 dancers a year. Just crazy. She received a dance education which is highly coveted, and essentially threw it away.

[@DaveB-hg7el]

Yes, and the woman who became my wife after her first marriage fell apart, was a Juilliard trained opera singer who was essentially forced to give it because her first husband was jealous of her ability to create magic with her voice. Such a petty man, much like the husband in ballerina farm. Control is not love, it's fear. Peace 💚

[@amandasomething538]

@@DaveB-hg7elDoes she use her training again now vocationally?

[@DaveB-hg7el]

@@amandasomething538 She did. One of the best things I have ever done was to convince her to go to the tryouts for our city opera. She was a member of the chorus for 16 seasons straight after that day. I lost her 3 and a half years ago now. We lost her daughter, my step, 15 months before that, and Karen lost her voice soon after. She couldn't find the joy in life after those two events, and only stayed around as long as she did for me. So, to answer your question directly, yes she did get to use her training professionally, on stage with the opera, and as a paid lead singer for multiple other vocal groups. Thanks for bringing back the sweet memories. Peace 💚

[@jverz9430]

Make sure you don't pick an abusive man who spends your entire premarital relationship hiding that fact because gods know those same exact people have been putting an extraordinary effort into taking away any avenue for a woman to do something about it later.

[@manicjackson]

Hey guys you know if you enter into an entire authoritarian hierarchical a social relationship where one person holds all the power and can do whatever they want that you better hope that they're a f****** saint

[@geektrash180]

Oh no I didn't get the feminist agenda or the gay agenda. WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING? Help I cannot plan my days.

[@firbolg]

Homeschooling is actually illegal in most European countries unless you're abroad. I had a friends who spend her childhood in a sailboat with her parents and she was thought by her parents but still had to come to Switzerland to pass the exams at the end of the year.

[@noodle_fc]

Tradwives make being beautiful for the husband a pillar of their relationship with zero comprehension that _no one is beautiful forever._ "Maintain your beauty" = your relationship is on a clock, lady. Notice how you don't hear from a lot of middle-aged tradwives? They learned that when the beauty clock runs out, husband also runs out to find a younger model.

[@MorgenPeschke]

Also, it normalizes the idea that people (men especially) have one specific type of woman that they're into (specifically: thin and young), and that this doesn't evolve as you grow older. I'm past 40, and while I'm a lesbian and can't speak for the guys, 20 year olds haven't been attractive to me in at least a decade. That touch of gray in my wife's hair is gorgeous in a way I don't think I would have been able to appreciate in my 20s, and barely have words to describe even now 🫠

[@noodle_fc]

​@@MorgenPeschke Good point! The way I wrote it makes it look like I agree with the trad-hubby opinion of temporal beauty, which I don't. It's not just the beauty standard, though, it's combined with the _transactional_ nature of ultra-traditional pairings. The man wins bread, in return for which the woman maintains the looks of a slim 25-year-old with a full face of makeup-and _that_ kind of beauty most definitely has an expiration date. After 20 years of career advancement, a man is winning more bread than ever, and (from his perspective) getting less youthful beauty in return. That story doesn't end well for someone wholly financially dependent on a partner who values them less each year.

[@MorgenPeschke]

@noodle_fc Don't worry, I didn't read it as you agreeing with the trad-hubby mindset. It was more of a "Yes, and it also does this too"

[@xakaryehlynn4749]

"now remember, just DON'T marry anyone abusive! We know that some BAD WOMEN do STUPID THINGS and DATE THE WRONG MEN. Not me though, and not good trad women. We can just not-date bad men, watch"

[@bobmetcalfe9640]

Jesus Christ, that woman looked like a doll. Not even a Barbie doll. And she spoke in the sort of voice that Japanese women put on when they're talking to men or people above them in the hierarchy. This is beyond weird.

[@timothy8428]

Crying over onions: understandable. Crying over potatoes: depression.

[@yup123288]

Your "tradwife voice" is simultaneously impressive and very scary. Like, if I heard it in the middle of the night, I would be abandoning my house because it is clearly haunted.

[@KitsuneVoss]

My mother went to the doctor during maybe 1979 to 1980 having complaints. I don't know what the exact issues were but they seem serious. The doctor, an older doctor likely trained in the 1950s, diagnosed her with "Housewife Syndrome." She ended up in the hospital not long after with ovarian cancer all over her body.

[@markseagraves5486]

It’s White-Christo-Fascist Cosplay. It seems culture is more complex. It was more the cumulative effect of advertising, fashion and things people simply like. The Trad Wife thing is just a marketing campaign from a very narrow source.

[@matthewthomas4620]

Everyone in a relationship needs something that is "theirs" and ideally a physical space that is their 'away space' as well.

[@theoriginalpandanon]

Am I a stay-at-home mom? Yes, am I trad wife? Hell no, my husband just finished cooking dinner for me and our kids while I rewired a lamp. 😁 Balance, people!

[@AnnoyingNewsletters]

30:30 chores Laundry is the easiest chore. Put clothes in washing machine. Add detergent. Close lid. Adjust settings. Press start. Walk away and do literally anything else. When the buzzer goes off, move the clean clothes to the dryer. Make sure lint trap is clean. Add dryer sheet. Adjust settings. Press start. Walk away and do literally anything else. When the buzzer goes off, empty lint trap, then remove clothes into a basket. Take clothes to the living room or bedroom. Fold them or hang them or whatever. You can watch TV or listen to music or whatever else while you do so. VOILA! I air dry my clothes, hanging them on hangers in my loft to dry. When dry, I can either pull clothes directly from there like it's a closet, or I can move them to the closet, already on hangers, good to go.

[@DaveB-hg7el]

Yes, and to add to your example, there are many times cooking is the exact same process. Do stuff, get it in the oven, walk away and do something else. Obviously it's not quite as simple as doing laundry, but there are times when it is. Lol 🙃 peace 💚

[@DizzyBusy]

I hate doing laundry 😂 it's my boyfriend's task in our household

[@AnnoyingNewsletters]

@@DaveB-hg7el I was just picking between Dishes and Laundry, that these grown ass married men in the clips were unable to do. With a Dishwasher, dishes are even easier. But these guys have finally accepted that they can cook occasionally, without wearing an apron, and their 🎱🎱 won't fall off in the process

[@ralfbauerfeind8236]

Trad wife life, or as I would call it "Wilma Flintstone life" or "advertisement happy life". ..... In Germany there existed a 'medical drink' called "Frauengold", that would be able to 'calm down hysterical women' and help them 'being pretty' (and docile), according to the advertisements. Ingredients were alcohol and herbs. Back then it was one of the ways for women to get addicted to alcohol. (The other being Klosterfrau Melissengeist.) Also it contained a potential carcinogen and kidney-damaging herb. It was sold from 1953 to 1981 at a quite high price. There is little to be found about a similar medicine for men of that time, called Eidran.

[@AragornElessar]

Frauengold got discontinued for being a health hazard. The ads for it were wild, I've seen a few and it's surreal

[@TheToothless-79]

I went to a Christian high school. Small campus. The "headmaster" was a big fan of reminding of us how his wife had been a feminist in college where they met, and now she's happy being a homemaker, mother, and part-time Spanish teacher. Disgusting.

[@tealkerberus748]

Well, at least if she's teaching she has an employable qualification and a work history. Too many of these women have no capacity for financial independence, and no matter how their husband abuses them, they can't leave or they'll starve.

[@kelpiekit4002]

Growing up in New Zealand we got a lot of British shows when I was a kid so my immediate thought of a traditional wife is more like Hyacinth Bucket (who would absolutely have a KZbin channel if Keeping Up Appearances was made now days) or, even better, Nora Batty from Last of the Summer Wine. The world needs a Nora Batty trad wife influencer. Though talking about the importance of having something for yourself the picture that came to my mind is groups of trad wife homesteaders gathering for their weekly Dungeons & Dragons game with a husband casually querying why everyone's playing a barbarian.

[@dellaanniehughes4533]

Neither Hyacinth nor Nora would have considered taking orders from their husbands. Nor would their husbands dared to try giving orders.

[@electronics-girl]

Other than the cute dresses, the weekly Dungeons & Dragons game is the only thing about the tradwife lifestyle that appeals to me.

[@wyleecoyotee4252]

That show with Hyacinth was absolutely hilarious

[@MacMoonie]

I can't with the tradwives... the "you have to be beautiful for your man" from a bleach blond with big boobs. Maybe its just me but I don't get the desire to be in full dress while doing all the housework and talking softly and sweetly. Also, do they sleep in seperate rooms like the "traditional" marriages did? So the wife could be responsive to all the kids and household stuff and not disturb the "breadwinner".... so he never sees her as a real person without perfect makeup and dress???

[@nancycraig7828]

I'm probably a little older than all of you 😏, but the "vaccuuming in pearls and high heels" trope is from the 50's/60's sitcoms, where all the stay at home mothers (think Leave It to Beaver) were played by...working women. At that time, the married couple slept in twin beds. 😝

[@stephennootens916]

The separate beds thing was not real it was part of the censorship. It goes back to the Hayes code that was put in place back in the 30s. You couldn't show even married couples sharing a bad. Hence twin beds.

[@seadinosaur3313]

10:25 As an Italian I find this hysterical because that hand sign right there? The good ol' "Mamma mia Marcello" sign? I'll let you in on a secret: it actually means "What kinda bullshit are you talking about?!". So, uh, yeah, they're actually right... not in the way they think though.

[@thomasdowning6768]

I happen to be cis-male hetero white Southern American. Trad wives literally make me queasy...I just can't imagine such a life style!

[@thomasdowning6768]

Maybe I should clarify...it's the whole submissive bit that I find repellent; give me strong independent people who know and speak their own mind, please.

[@danilooliveira6580]

@@thomasdowning6768 to be fair I absolutely get the appeal of living a submissive life. it usually means your responsibilities are delegated to someone else, you don't need to worry about what happens outside your bubble. you just have to do your duties so you get taken care of. if you are the type of person that likes to make your significant other happy then even better. as someone with all kinds of anxiety this kind of life appeals to me, if only it was that simple...

[@stephennootens916]

When you say Southern America are we talking south of Mason Dixon line or South America? That asked, I always thought Tradwives are weird. I can't imagine leaving with.anyone who doesn't have an opinion about anything or will speak up if you might be fucking up something. I think of it this way if there is a fork in the road one leads to inbred cannibals and the other leads to safety I want some to discuss which road is the safe one and which one leads us to be killed and eaten. I don't want to be stuck making the choice on my own.

[@infernalsquid]

@@stephennootens916i love the analogy and the specificity of the cannibals being inbred. would genetically diverse cannibals be less dangerous?

[@visaman]

​@@thomasdowning6768how about a woman that rubs your feet after a hard days work?

[@joannahaddock4338]

I am gay, Trans, atheist, progressive and a feminist.... I want to know why I have never been invited to one meeting where we discuss agendas or even gotten an email. And it seems like this whole thing is just a way for men to get a unpaid, live in maid with benefits.

[@Creepybusguy]

The word you're looking for is bangmaid. The men want a bangmaid. Also we sent out the fliers for the agenda setting meeting weeks ago... Maybe update your address in the Soros/Clinton payments database(??)

[@jc3drums916]

Conservatives like to throw around the word "traditional" without understanding that, just because something is "traditional," doesn't mean it's automatically good.

[@Harpersferry-42]

"The trouble with trad wives, " I know that's a Star Trek reference! 🖖😂❤ And no that's the Fundy voice as it's called.

[@Shin-e2w]

Women being silent, not speaking loudly etc is also a big part of the 1950s tradition. “Women and children are best seen but not heard”.

[@lbxani19]

Never thought about it until watching this video, but for all the love a mother might be trying to pass to their child by birthing the child at home amongst family, what little love they are showing their children by not having them in or near medical facilities or personnel. You want to have a more 'natural' birth? You didn't need pain meds? Great for you! But what happens when something goes wrong and you can't get help for your child because you wanted to live off the land and you're 2 hours from a first aid kit let alone a hospital.

[@LiamLivesOn]

It's not kidnapping, abuse and breaking the Genova Convection... It's what used to be considered normal... The true spirit of slave ownership is rooted in tradition.

[@_shannons]

That voice is called fundy baby voice. It's a whole thing.

[@RaymondBCrisp]

I see this representation of 'tradwife,' but how do they really compare? Because I think back to my grandmother, who was born in 1917 and passed in 1996, and this was a woman that could kill, pluck, and clean a chicken. This is a woman that made clothes, including denim jeans, for me. She used a washboard to clean the clothes and hung them on a line before modern washer and dryers were available. I found it in the tool shed when I settled their estate. I want to see a modern tradwife do that, then maybe I'll be convinced.

[@Colddirector]

Damn, I'm a guy but I'd take some lessons from her. I've always wanted to sew some MOLLE webbing into an old hiking bag I have, and make a custom pouch for my MP3 player. I don't care if it's "gay", useful skills are useful skills.

[@RaymondBCrisp]

@@Colddirector Nah man, no judgement. I totally get it. Granny did teach me to darn holes in the ends of my socks, so sewing is useful. She also taught me how to cook, and that's about one of the most useful skills out there. Being able to fix tasty, nutritious meals is great instead of relying on fast food or other takeout.

[@IamBored22]

2 hour ago I watched The Antibot talking about tradwives. Now You! One more and I'll be an expert on the topic!

[@CollinGerberding]

I'd suggest looking up Rachel Oates. A specific video of hers doesn't come to mind, but if you're not aware of her, you might like her and I'm pretty sure she has at least one video on the topic.

[@elizabethmccoy272]

I can’t stop!! I go out and look for it! Depending on your style Jordan and McKay have a whole series and a very in depth video and a response about this article. FunkyFrogBait has a funny one too. They are totally different styles and I love them both

[@IamBored22]

@@CollinGerberding Thanks! I will

[@pcoleman1971]

I watched the Antibot video as well. I loved her observation that many Only Fans models have adopted the trad wife style as part of their performance. I think that says it all. It's a fetish.

[@elizabethmccoy272]

@@pcoleman1971 well now I have to watch this one!!…after Emma of course. My most favorite!

[@harryrabbit2870]

I have no trouble with people living their own lives any way they want. You only get to live once, so knock yourself out. Have a good time. My ONLY issue is when these movements transcend the personal and enter into the public arena, especially politics. Do you worship a Christian God? Good for you, just don't ask me to come to church with you. My reply will be polite only once. And if you are formulating PUBLIC policy with your religion, expect outright hostility from me. If everybody minds their own business, life can be good. Enjoyed your video, Ms. Emma.

[@victoriaroberts7034]

Regarding the voice, i saw an ex mormon KZbinr who said when she was a Mormon she had that similar kind of weak soft voice but since leaving she has now lost

[@raistlin3462]

Totally not a red flag.

[@marcoriviera06]

This idea doesn’t speak to ‘alpha males’ (whatever that is) but appeals to men who are very VERY insecure

[@_1Sentry1_]

I'll never forget the time i got invited round to an acquaintance's house, his wife cooked us a large delicious meal three portions and we all chat and eat and enjoy a movie, we get done eating and i go to gather the plates and cutlery to take them into the kitchen and i ready myself to wash the dishes and my friend stops me and says "my wife will take care of that." i look at him for a second and say "are you serious?" to which he replies "what?" and in turn i say "she prepared all of this, the very least i could do is wash up, honestly its no problem" he looks at me like I'm speaking French then laughs and insists i put the plate down and let her take care of it. Something about that 10 second interaction bothered me and it still pops into my head to this very day. I see no point in designating specific tasks to your wife like she's a robot. If i see something that needs doing like laundry or vacuuming or plates in the sink or cooking then i'll do it. I'm not just gonna stand in suspended animation like Isaac Clarke from deadspace hit me with stasis and expect my lady to do it for me. If she happens to get to it before me then great bonus but I'm not just gonna cease doing tasks i know how to do the minute i marry. God forbid she have free time and autonomy to do something she likes. It's such a bizarre mentality to me. Trad wife seems like a red flag to me. I want her to be my best friend not an item that preforms tasks like an A.I out of a horror movie.

[@Telorand1]

To any pregnant person or future pregnant person: there is no shame getting an epidural. It's your birth. There are no prizes for voluntarily enduring more pain, and in some cases, it can make birth harder (such as going through labor at night, not being able to sleep, and then being too exhausted to push when it's go time). Don't let society or these insane masochists make you feel bad for choosing modern medicine.

[@happytofu5]

Why would anyone NOT take the painkiller?! Nature is brutal, it has no interest in our wellbeing beyond being able to survive long enough to produce offspring.

[@orionspero560]

Valium being mother's little helper is you're talking about relatively functional. When the rolling stones use that reference, they meant queludes (Methaqualone).

[@LordVolkov]

The lude explosion after it was prescribed to housewives as a sleep aid 🙃 I wonder about the first few women who stumbled into the later stages 🤔🤣🤣🤣

[@stonephoenix7728]

Take on sewing Introduce fake fur Make gloves Make costumes Make paws Make fursuits for suspiciously rich furries Divorce husband ... Great success👍

[@AnnoyingNewsletters]

18:00 Epidurals *_No pain relief! Suffer the curse of Eve!_*

[@chrissnyder8108]

When my husband and I first met each other, he was something of a "trad husband" just because he liked doing homesteading things, including gardening, making maple syrup, beekeeping and rendering the honey and beeswax, and cooking fabulous meals. He wasn't a Luddite, because he was also a techie and his job was computer tech support at the local University. So yes, doing traditional things can be a big part of happiness if you like being able to make things for yourself and your family. But the misogyny and dictated gender roles and Christian Nationalism is not a requirement of enjoying homesteading.

[@grumpy_gremlin]

My partner and I imagine being like that - we live in a city we'd never leave, but we fantasize about what we could do with a large garden. I want to grow herbs and vegetables, he wants to keep chickens and bees. I've baked bread once and really enjoyed it, he loves to cook. I'd love to learn woodworking and we're both into DIY. However, we also want to run a pub, and there aren't enough hours in the day for both (I have a chronic illness and he's a workaholic). Definitely the key is removing the gendering, and actively choosing the activities you enjoy.

[@chrissnyder8108]

@@grumpy_gremlin The herbs and the bee-keeping can be done with just a balcony and/or some windows in the city; an observation hive can be internal to a home, with a sealed box that has a narrow projecting entrance/exit for the bees that fits into the opening of a double or single hung window that slides open vertically. The actual honeycomb the bees build need to be protected from the sunlight, so the glass observation windows into the hive have to be kept covered with solid wood panels most of the time, and the bees probably want to stay cooler and drier than most houses, so that they don't have mold and mildew issues that can kill them, but it has been done before, and/or city folks can do regular hives on the rooftops of buildings. Herbs can do well in pots either inside or outside, typically bringing them inside during freezing cold weather, so the amount of space in front of windows will be the limiting factor. My husband has dozens of non-native food plants in pots, including citrus and kiwi and fig dwarf trees, which sit outside on a porch in summer, and we bring them into an underground cool windowless root cellar once they have dropped all their leaves and gone dormant in the fall, after the mild frosts but before the first hard freezes that would freeze the roots in the pots. They stay in the cellar for 3-4 months and he visits them maybe once every month or two to give them a very little water if the soil is dry, and them they go back outside when the risk of freezing the pots is past in the spring.

[@benstone5895]

The "Evangelical/Fundamentalist Baby Voice" is an adaptation to (1) demonstrate to the Man that one is properly submissive and not a threat and (2) slightly conversely signal to other evangelical women that one is speaking with the backing and borrowed authority of the Man. Sort of "I am using this sweet and gentle voice to show you that I'm in my proper (biblical) place and therefore the things I'm saying must be correct." It's also a big part of the "keep sweet" idea that you see with people like Michelle Duggar who has a whole big explanation for why she trained herself to talk like that.

[@New_Wave_Nancy]

Regarding the tradwife voice, here in the US we were all bemused by Katie Britt, senator from Alabama, using the tradwife voice for her response to the State of the Union address this year (March 7, 2024).

[@jeffmacdonald9863]

Thanks, I knew it had come up in a political context recently, but couldn't remember the details. Since I've got no personal connection to that world, I wasn't familiar with the term before, but I have heard the voice itself a few places in passing. Weird.

[@-suphur]

The irony that the conservatives were instrumental in destroying much chance at a couple existing on one income. If you can afford to keep your spouse at home in this day and age, you are either wealthy, or secluded on a farm.

[@howardpalys6929]

Real life Stepford wives.

[@howardpalys6929]

If the shoe fits wear it.

[@VexedForest]

One thing I always think about is what happens when your husband passes? My grandpa passed last year and it's been a big adjustment for my grandma. She was married at 17 and never even "allowed" to drive.

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

They don’t want to think about that because they don’t think anything bad will happen. The reality is plenty of tradwives find out they weren’t even on their husband’s will or insurance because they didn’t think they needed to make sure they were, so their family has to scrap by to care for them, and they’re treated like a burden. The most insane part are the amount of tradwives that are ok living on 50k a year and think they’ll somehow live comfortably after their husband retires, or get good alimony if they divorce. That’s how they end up in poverty.

[@OldNewsIsGoodNews]

Re: the Estee how-to tradwife video, I (very, VERY) briefly dated a schmuck who legit didn't know even the basics of cooking in his _late effing 30s_ because apparently he still lived a couple blocks away from his mum, who would come over and cook for him on a regular basis. Like, I tried enlisting his help in cooking dinner for the two of us once, asked him to chop up some garlic, and he legit thought _peeling a bunch of cloves_ was the same thing as chopping them. Unsurprisingly, the dish didn't come out as well as it usually did when I made it on my own, and for a whole host of reasons, the relationship didn't last. But all that to say, I've def met men well into their "adult enough that you should know the basics" years who were ... "are you sure you're not still in uni?" levels of incompetent.

[@bemasaberwyn55]

Jfc

[@Colddirector]

I'm at the point in my life where I'm something of a control freak about food and I'd rather cook for myself if at all possible. I think I've actually offended some people (my mom included) because of it lol. Apparently this makes me effeminate according to some wierd guys because apparently not having basic life skills is manly.

[@Colddirector]

Also am I the only person who find Estee really, really creepy? Something about her just triggers my fight-or-flight instinct.

[@dawn8293]

I'm a housewife and I love it, but I would suck at being a tradwife. I grew up Mormon, and while my mom isn't what I would call a tradwife by modern standards, I saw how she indoctrinated herself into giving all the effort she had to others. Early in her marriage, she went to a family reunion, and due to her being married, and therefore seen as more of an adult (I don't know if that's a Mormon thing, or just my family), she was asked to do a lot more chores. She doesn't get to have the vacation she hoped for, and was disappointed. She learned from that that she should just find joy in doing all that work. "Forget yourself and go to work" is a common phrase. Self sacrifice. I refuse to exist for others the way my mom did. It wore her out and even made her passive-aggressive at times, because she doesn't know her own needs.