Game of Thrones/ASOIAF Theories | Littlefinger: The Whisperer in the Darkness

[@dmckenzie9281]

The ability to take on someone else's voice makes the Mocking Bird sigil more appropriate too.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

That’s brilliant. I wish we thought of that

[@meganfinch711]

Dale Mckenzie Niiiice.

[@fuzzydunlop7928]

Mockingbirds are also known for laying 'alien eggs' - which is when a bird goes into a different bird's nest - lays its eggs there - and makes those birds raise its young unawares. Ring a bell?

[@meganfinch711]

Fuzzy Dunlop Also Niiiiccce! Lol

[@jakemcclelland3114]

@@fuzzydunlop7928 "sweet robin" ;)

[@davidgrzybowski9148]

There appears to be a strong parallel between Ned's vision in the black cells and one of Aeron's visions in The Forsaken sample chapter. In both, the character has been imprisoned in darkness for an extended period--an experience which brings out latent telepathic abilities--before receiving visions. In both, the vision is initially of a deceased loved one, someone for whose death the recipient blames himself--Robert for Ned, Urrigon for Aeron. This loved one proclaims something the recipient would otherwise violently reject--to Ned that he should cast aside his honor, to Aeron that no glorious afterlife with the Drowned God awaits him. After making this proclamation, the loved one dissolves into a character the recipient despises--Littlefinger, Euron--the presumable sender of the vision.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Great pull

[@jakemcclelland3114]

This actually helps for me to confirm Little-finger being involved with the 3-eyed Crow. I've been skeptical of both him and Euron...but always thought the Name 'Euron Crows Eye' was too blatant not to have the correlation. And there was a lot of sketchy deaths surrounding his rise to power , as well as some swayed voters at the Kingsmoot...even the way both of his Brothers subdued to his lawful reign, despite preferring him dead.

[@mozart7820]

2 years, time flys quicker than an armored knight out the moon door!

[@sporadicmusings5822]

RIP Ser Vardis Egen

[@bouboubibila979]

The manipulation of minds through telepathy is one of the major theme in this story. It would make sense that Littlefinger, the master manipulator, would be some kind of telepath. Ned's scene in the black cells is also very similar to that of the Damphair's in the TWOW preview chapter, where it's clear that Aeron is being manipulated telepathically by Euron. Btw, I was wondering whether Varys has telepathic powers too. His little birds are mutes, just like Euron's crew of sailors. It's pretty clear that losing one or more of your senses awakens telepathic powers (which is also what Arya has had to experience during her training with with the faceless men). Varys is also repeatedly called "a sorcerer" or "a magician". Could this mean he is actually a telepath?

[@houseflan2505]

Is it possible that Littlefinger is a greenseer? He did have an ear death experience at the hands of Brandon years ago. It seems near death experiences can open the third eye. That way Littlefinger can whisper in people’s dreams. I’m writing this as I listen and you guys might be going that direction. LoL

[@keithcrisman5119]

I'm glad to hear someone else say it if one in a thousand is a warg and one in one thousand wargs is a greenseer then there should be at least one greenseer in Kings Landing... also could one in a thousand greenseers be a superseer able to live their second life over and over but be in control.. peace be with you and yours

[@BlankEmporium]

I'd hardly call losing a finger a near death experience.

[@houseflan2505]

@@BlankEmporium Yeah...Littlefinger didn't lose a finger. Brandon Stark cut him pretty deeply along his chest and left him bedridden. The name Littlefinger comes from his family lands being on a tract called the Fingers.

[@BiteThis]

I've been waiting so long for the new littlefinger. He interests me more than any other character

[@dx3cannons]

A Mockingbird mimics the voice of others. There’s a reason it’s Baelish’s sigil.

[@AsoiafLoreandHistory]

So true!

[@TheJimmyswe150]

Then why is there a mockingbird in season 8 trailers

[@subarnosinha8042]

You see a video from OOTGH, you watch it the first thing. Everything else takes a back seat.

[@9trevor9]

Littlefinger is the intellectual version of Chuck Norris. When Littlefinger whispers even deaf people hear him.

[@austinroyce256]

You videos( the Littlefinger series in particular) have helped me formulate a big meta theory. Bran, Sansa and Arya are all being manipulated by “champions” of Ice. It’s a mockery of the hero’s journey. Brans teacher= 3eye crow= Night king=Ice Aryas teacher= kindly man=working with children= death Sansa’s teacher= Littlefinger= visited by crow after duel=Chaos Google Yin and Yang.... Yin= Ice/Death/Chaos

[@SaneMillennial]

Very nice!

[@Ignisan_66]

It seems that there is a great power and potential in these 3 Stark children. Both Bran and Arya are powerful wargs plus Bran is a greenseer and Arya a faceless man, while Sansa is on the path to be Littlefinger's successor as Great Other's pawn in the politics of Westeros. I think Sansa is also a warg and greenseer capable of entering people's dreams. I believe the Great Other wants to use the potential of these children against humanity in the war to come.

[@CalmNoises]

Two years late but I gotta ask: What about Robb, Rickon and Jon, then? Assuming Jon really is Ned's true born son, wouldn't it be interesting if he (as the hero) had to fight against his other (half) siblings? I think the Order of the Green Hand even mentioned that Stoneheart was afraid that Jon's children would make claim upon Winterfell (or something like that). So all of Stoneheart's children either die or become villains (the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree) and Jon, the apparent hero of the story, will have to defeat them all. Bran, Arya, and Sansa are becoming these champions; Robb is dead and Rickon is already vicious. Side-note: What role does Euron play then? I thought he was the harbinger of doom.

[@austinroyce256]

@@CalmNoises Yeah no worries, just glad I saw this in my feed. I’m not sure Rob and Ricken have false mentors, but I also think their stories dead end. In Rickons case you might call it a “shaggy-dog story”. Jon I feel is R+L=J, but if not that would make sense. Tho I tend to see him as the answer to the riddle of the story. He IS the song of ice and fire, ment to bring balance. This will likely be done by a marriage, bringing peace between the humans and the others. He’s the only character in the story with both Fire and ice symbolism. The next book is likely going to pick up wit him living in ghost only to be resurrected by fire magic, so it goes beyond his lineage. But yeah the stark children are basically going to become the 3 eyed crow (Future Bran), Littlefinger with a vagina and a psychopathic murderer. Quite the fall’s from grace. Euron is one of the main champions of the 3 eyed crow. I assume you have watched the order of the green hands video on the difference between crows and ravens? Short version is when we see ravens, assume that’s BR. When we see Crows, assume it’s the big bad. I believe Bran is manipulating events from the future (see Hodor) to insure things work out to his design. Euron being the big bad is to similar to a “Sauron” from the lord of the rings. An all powerful bad guy who’s just evil for the sake of it. He’s a pawn, a horrible one, but he’s not in control as much as he projects. I think the 2 main “villains” of the story were introduced right away and we have been watching their decent. Brans a sweet and innocent child who becomes a time manipulating hive mind (champion of ice). Dany is a sweet and innocent child who becomes an all powerful tyrant with a god complex that rules with fire and blood (champion of fire).

[@emilystaal4024]

What a cool theory! Ned’s fever dream is so quick and innocuous that I don’t think I’ve ever given it a second thought. I didn’t even remember that particular dream!

[@4URFullDisclosure]

I loved how you tied Ned's fever dream into the theory, job well done!

[@thebovineavenger]

Damn it I had yard work to do. Well I guess that is being put off for a bit. Time to grab some wine and settle in. I always watch these at least 2 or 3 times. So i can get all the info and absorb it all correctly.

[@danjordan1]

I played with my Valyrian steel longsword while I watched this in the caves on Dragonstone...

[@user-ii8od4wu5p]

"Well, I have 30 mins to spend until X..." Logs on YT and got a bell, oh thank the Old Gods!

[@seakaybaduza7085]

Hey again guys... After watching your video... particularly the part about Neds dream, it got me thinking about Davos 1 in aSoS... where he has a dream and “the Mother” speaks to him... something which leads him wanting to kill Melisandre... then I remembered that something similar also happens to Cressen... who mentions in ACOK Prologue that he’s been having nightmares and that they are about Melisandre... and he also resolves to kill her. I think that there’s someone who can use this power and they want Melisandre dead... my money was on Marwyn since he has a glass candle but I don’t know what the motive would be yet.

[@CharlesZane_]

Are you saying, Littelfinger has a glass candle?

[@emilystaal4024]

It actually reminds me so much of Aemon dreaming that he’s with Egg getting drunk in Oldtown

[@bryanm4016]

Maybe LF is a greenseer

[@brendanfechter4889]

He's got something

[@hypatiakovalevskayasklodow9195]

@@honkeykong4049 hahahaha brilliant!

[@tehn3085]

Finally! Love this. I did not expect that of all things. But as always I'm convinced! Ugh y'all are too good.

[@vanguardian2864]

As far as The Game of Thrones is concerned within ASoIaF, Littlefinger is by far the main antagonist of this series. The show runners didn’t even come close to portraying him for what he really was (season 7).

[@SpyTrader1988]

Yup. Almost everything that happens in game of thrones is because of Littlefinger

[@Baratheon.]

it still blows my mind that Joff seemingly gave some random thug a valyrian steel dagger, when not even Tywin himself could get a hold of a VS sword.

[@Ana-lp9qb]

This is one of the best asoiaf theories I've ever seen. Great job👏🏽

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Thank you

[@PBRStreetgang]

Ahh...back to our regularly scheduled programming : ) A new Greenhand video is a lovely nightcap. Been waiting for more Littlefinger analysis ever since you pointed out the probable connection to Doran Martell.

[@DrLetMeBFrank]

Littlefinger is one of my favorite characters. I loved how he was used in the first few seasons of the show and the scenes with Varys was amazing. Hated how he was treated in the later seasons, but so glad he's still manipulating in the books. I like your theory about him being some type of literal monster, but no matter what, we know he was an evil man.

[@josephsmith6777]

Hes not so much a monster but a god w booth

[@SpyTrader1988]

I don’t see him as evil. More as Machiavellian. He’s a realist.

[@fuzzydunlop7928]

Alright, I've finally gotten around to part four and I've approached it with an open mind. My first question is - why would Littlefinger tell King Shit to use a dagger that could be traced back to himself? Why not any other of the many daggers his father owned but never used? So that he can pull a 'It's mine but wait - listen to me I can be trusted!' on Cat and then Ned? He could do that anyway, sans the dagger actually being his. He could spin any lie at that point. What if Arn Santagar decided to spill the beans at that point? That aside - what of the rules as outlined in the earlier videos? Littlefinger's 'rules' - if you want someone to do what you want, you need to know what they want? Get someone to do what you want, but make them think they came up with it? All of that sounds like perfectly valid and practical ways for Baelish to beguile and manipulate Joffrey - the only obstacle is the physical obstacle as noted in the video but it's described earlier that under King Bobby, Baelish was the guy who was called on to basically dole out cash for Roberto's expenses - why would that not be the case with Joffrey? Sure - Joff was nuts, but he was nuts in predictable ways. Vain, arrogant - easy to butter up if you only fellate his ego and we know Bae-Bae is the king of fellating. You say that Joff hearing and acting on his father's off-hand comment is 'a little much' but later on that he's so out-there unpredictable that one could not even trust him to keep his mouth shut? I feel like you're going off of an unreliable characterization of Joffrey as a character. He's not 'wearing underwear on his head' crazy - he's a sadistic shithead and sadistic shitheads can (and in the books most definitely ARE) manipulated by their betters into doing all sorts of things by perfectly practical means. So - Ned is in his cell going Stark-raving mad and Baelish invades his dreams, to mock him - why mock him? Why not probe Ned in his weakened state for secrets before his (eventual) execution? Something to help him with Cat, something to use for his own means - but instead he mocks him. Why not probe Cat's dreams and make her fall in love with him to begin with? He will get no other chance to dream-fuck Ned so why is he wasting his time mocking him? To get him to confess? He's to be executed either way as far as super-finger knows - he's been making sure by also dream-diddling Joffrey on the side. This is my absolute biggest issue with Littlefinger if he has this ability - it actually makes him seem pretty dumb because he's using this supernatural ability to go about his schemes in ass-backwards and convoluted ways. What does he want most in the world? Well, thus far we know he has a thing for power and a thing for Cat/Sansa - if he has this power, why has it taken him this long to really set his plan in motion? He dreamed his way into success in Gull Town and got noticed by Jon Arryn - got taken to King's Landing and became Master of Coin and then waited? It actually seems like it kills his character a little bit - instead of a conniving and ambitious schemer who's gotten by from being under-estimated and using guile, charm, and manipulation to get his way he's low-key Freddy Kruger. It's not the craziest thing I've heard - as someone stated before it brings yet ANOTHER hidden meaning to the Mockingbird - but what's Ole' Grimmy's master plan if this is the case? And how does this revelation recontextualize what we know of the character in ways which improve the narrative? I'm not someone who's turned off by the magic in these books - I like it a lot - so don't get me wrong, I appreciate the thought put into this and I don't think it can be outright disproved but I just don't see the point of it all. I mean by the end of AGoT Baelish comes out looking like an evil mastermind. Additionally - if we take the SSM quote at the end, attributing Baelish's prowess of manipulation due to magic actually seems like putting too much spice into the 'magic' pot - we already have the Others and Wights and Giants and DireDoggos, Red Priests who can commune with flames and raise the dead, a magical old lady who can tell the future on High Heart, Dragons, Quiathe, Black Candles, Faceless Bois, magical steel that requires spells, magical genetics, magical incest, a sword made from the heart of a fallen star, prophecies upon prophecies, a man who lives in a tree and can talk with paraplegics, fucking wood elves, curses, magical radiation, LOVECRAFT RIP-OFFS EVERYWHERE, two kinds of magical black stone - both oily and fused, a BIG OLE' MAGIC WALL, Jamie's Abs, a door that talks back, Squishie-bois, fucking *EVERYTHING TO DO WITH EURON* (and also at least two kinds of magical drugs). You see what I mean? This isn't even half of it this is just off the top of my head - there's actually a LOT of magic in this world already.

[@elrojales9083]

Love him or hate him, you have to admit that Littlefinger is one hell of a player (if not the best).

[@lupusanthro5021]

Ok, another one for you Greenhanders. Was reading the scene in Storm of Swords where Littlefinger is helping Sansa build the Winterfell snowcastle. She has a hard time making the window to the glass gardens and LF weaves some twigs together and makes a 'latticework of twigs very like the one that roofed the glass gardens of Winterfell'. How did he know how it looked like if he had never been there?

[@perspii2808]

This theory is really interesting, but how exactly does Littlefinger obtain the ability to go into people’s fever dreams in the first place?

[@crazyscotsman9327]

It is explained in the first couple ones. But the three eyed crow may have given him the ability to do this.

[@Amaterasu_Rivers]

Crazyscotsman Or did Doran Martel (3 Eyed Raven) give Littlefinger a glass candle after teaching him to use it, and thus become his agent in kings landing? It would explain all of Littlefinger’s risky moves if he had Doran as his backer.

[@Jockeylotforfun]

@@Amaterasu_Rivers LF is most likely far more powerful than Doran Martel. The 3 eyed raven is definitely not Doran Martel. In the books there's a lot to indicate that its Brynden Rivers, a one eyed, Targaryen bastard. He sees with a thousand eyes and one. In the show its Bran.

[@Amaterasu_Rivers]

The Lady Olenna Tyrell You should watch/review OTGH’s Bloodraven video’s b/c they pick up on hints that Brynden Rivers was NOT the 3 Eyed Raven in Bran’s dreams. Doran on the other hand is a deceptively wealthy slave owning master manipulator/tactician, who has ties to Oldtown/Norvos/Volantis and has been planning his vengeance on the Lannisters since the fall of King’s Landing. If Littlefinger were to tell him what he saw at the Crossroads Inn, that Rhaegar had taken Lyanna as a paramour and the cause of the war was a lie, who would Doran blame for Elia’s death? The Starks.

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

@@crazyscotsman9327 But that leaves the question who or what is the three eyed crow ?

[@melissaisloud7404]

Speaking of dreams: about Dani’s visions at the House of the Undying- Could Rhaegar have seen Dani as Aegon was being born. It seemed to me that he looked at her direction and immediately began speaking about needing to have the third child. Could he have somehow seen Dani through Targaryen blood ties during her vision (like Young Ned ‘heard’ Bran at the Tower of Joy) misinterpreting his sister as the soul of the daughter he had yet to sire? Could seeing Dani during the birth of his son be the catalyst that thrust him towards Lyanna with true purpose. It’s all a circle! I’d love to hear your thoughts on this.

[@yensid4294]

Wow, it would be interesting if LF had gained insights/ powers similar to Bran when he was mortally wounded as a boy too & like Euron Greyjoy went dark or rogue. Either that, or he has magic users in his employ. I read that paragraph totally differently on first read. I thought it was Ned figuring out he'd been played & deciding to do whatever he had to in order to protect his family & prevent war. Basically wrestling with his concious whilst delirious.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

We were on the verge of saying he’s the three eyed crow in both this video and part three

[@henkbaas6892]

@@TheOrderoftheGreenhandLF planted the seed in joffs head to assasinate Bran and the three eyed crow visited Bran in his dream so he fly's instead of dies. wouldn't this indicate they aren't the same.

[@brendanfechter4889]

LF could drop hints that mercy for Stark would make him look weak. He could remind Joff about Robb and their tiff at WF. They live in the same place its not weird they'd have conversations. KG is sworn to keep secrets anyway and LF is slick enough to plant these seeds in Joffs mind without being blatant about it. Joff is very prideful and LF could exaggerate the Northern army and talk about how Stannis and Renly will come down hard if he looks weak and merciful

[@mickdundee364]

thank the GODS we have more OotGH content! thank you guys so much for all your hard work. absolutely fantastic stuff here you guys, as always.

[@Sinewmire]

What if it wasn't a dream? Jaqen H'gar was in those cellars too.

[@SammyRaiGuy]

I have bought the series both in paperback and on audiobook and the fact that I have to pause and read the little hints and quotes (seeing as i'm a completely obsessed) is the reason i subscribe. You guys really do your work.

[@chrisph9910]

Varys did suspect Littlefinger. as his speech to Tyrion about where power resides and who the free sword kill between the King, Priest and Merchant threw major shade at Littlefinger.

[@KingOfWinter]

So he has a glass candle then right? For sure

[@jarretmcmillan5665]

The glass candle is a possibility, but I believe they are implying that he possesses a supernatural ability

[@ivanbluecool]

I always wondering what will happen if someone whacked little finger. Every one thinks its a good thing. I feel it will be a horrible thing. Same with ned and tywin dying. Little finger dying will lead to many loans holders and all his secret deals to go off as almost nobody knows he did anything besides Tyrion or a few others. Its gonna be pretty bad

[@sydludovico3495]

Cheers, and thanks for this! I noticed a terribly similar instance of magical dream manipulation, involving Bran and the three-eyed crow. I finally discovered that the "crow" was quite a trickster, taking on the guise of a crow in order to con Bran into trusting it. Afterall, Bran had thought of the nesting crows atop the broken tower as special friends, ranking second in importance only to Summer. Speaking of whispers in the darkness, Mellisandra eluded to a similar concept, that dreams are the whisperings of the Great Other, dragging people into darkness. BTW, do you think there's any connection between the Petyr Baelish and Bael the Bard? I think Bael the Bard may have gone by an alias that meant deceiver.

[@sydludovico3495]

BTW, there seems to be a correlation between the sharp voice of the three-eyed crow and the sharp voice of the Others when you compare these two passages from the first two books: "...and from its branches the three-eyed crow came flapping, pecking at his face and crying his name in a voice as sharp as swords." -Bran 2, ACOK. "The watchers moved together, as if some signal had been given. Swords rose and fell, all in a deathly silence. It was cold butchery. The pale blades sliced through ringmail as if it were silk. Will closed his eyes. Far beneath him, he heard their voices and laughter sharp as icicles." Prologue AGOT

[@Lenoreific]

Every time you upload a new video it's like mini-christmas! Hands down, my favorite channel on youtube!

[@hareemmalik1046]

Littlefinger is alive SurprisSeeeeeee Stabbing the.NK murmuring "chaos is a ladder" or " I told you not to trust me" would be the best ending ever

[@cristiansaucedo4707]

No, it would not but it would be trolley :)

[@McBasterson]

Everyone always brags on your videos and rightfully so! But the timing for the intro music’s drop is impeccable as always. Nice little touch. Love you guys.

[@veritasinvicta8128]

Great to see you back with a new ASOIAF video!

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Its definitely what we enjoy doing most...we tried to make a couple show videos, but we found ourselves really dragging ourselves through it because we just don't care that much about the show...we're just planning on getting through it, because it being on means we have to do show stuff, but I think this year we're just going to do some livestreams regarding the show so we can use the rest of our time making book theory videos

[@veritasinvicta8128]

@@TheOrderoftheGreenhand Your vids on the show bring much needed comic relief (Santa Bran!) but the books are the real deal and we really need TWOW to come out. Thanks again for all you both do.

[@tulkas42o22]

I just checked on your channel and realised that I've been down with you since the begining almost, like a video or two into it. I know when something's up,I heard it in M'ladys voice in this video,kick ass video by the way!!! Whatever it is...we love and support you and appreciate the hard work,sacrifice and time you take to share with "us" these marvelous videos. We're here for you now as we were here for you in the beginning. I bend the knee👑and pledge my sword

[@corbinskywalker]

Littlefinger planned it all !!!

[@forloveofthepage2361]

Wolf's Den FTW! Lets do this. I always felt one of the Kingsguard was in Littlefinger's pocket. I haven't read the books in a bit, but I remember having that distinct impression. Didn't start entertaining the idea of Littlefinger having the gift until you guys made a video pointing out clues in that vein.

[@theM4R4T]

Mandon Moore and Kettleblack

[@dratheart]

I vote that the Green Hands say Petry's name as "Pet-ARRRR" like Roy Dotrice does for the audiobook! Pretty please? ;;-)

[@Jockeylotforfun]

Just when I think that the quality of your content has reached its zenith, you somehow raise the bar even higher! Thanks. It's got to be blood magic! LF mentioned that he had a relative from Bravos, so I did wonder about the possibility that he has connections to the faceless men. When i reread areas about the old black tom cat, I wondered if he or someone else was warging it. Then LF had knowledge of the secret meeting between Varys and Ilirio in the dungeons, and Varys meeting with Ned. Syrio tells Arya to catch the cats from the red keep as if he suspects something too. Do you think LF is a warg and/ or a faceless man? And how on earth would he have access to a glass candle and the abilities to use it? Love Qot 🌹

[@zachh1513]

Petyr Baelish IS THE Mockingbird in dreams, a Three-Eyed Crow, of sorts. Could he possibly even have this ability because of his willingness or eagerness for power (and thus showing himself to be influence-able and usable by the Three-Eyed Crow in furthering the Children of the Forest's goals that "All Men Must Die"? A realm in chaos and at war with one another will not be likely able to stand against the coming of the White Walkers in the Final Battle for the Dawn...) I LOVE YOUR CHANNEL! This is great stuff! COMPELLING AND RICH!

[@zachh1513]

And if all that were the case, he could play a part similar to the old rulers of Ghis or the Bloodstone Emperor and be "King the ashes" left behind after the Final Battle of the Dawn if he's successful in manipulating things so that the "Old Powers" can finally defeat men.

[@JoniukasVader]

Back is Green Hand...

[@namewastaken360]

Joffery was kind and Little Finger was on his small council, of course he has access to the king. Petyr is also a master manipulator, and joffery a fool, he wouldn't have told joffery to take Ned's head, he would have just told him some stories about Meagor the Cruel, or appealed to his mysoginistic tendencies with a joke that women are week and forgiveness is for women. Little finger would have no problem influencing joff without joff realising he is being manipulated. Also joffery is a psychopath so he may not have understood that his father wouldn't have appreciated him killing his best friends son, although I am suspicious about little fingers involvement with brans assassination attempt.

[@namewastaken360]

That should be king not kind, stupid phone.

[@namewastaken360]

Weak, not week

[@thisguy8106]

This video is perfect! Thank y'all very much!

[@HoofHearted88]

If Littlefinger does indeed have the power to invade dreams and plant seeds like an Inception character, that would explain his rapid ascend on the ladder in King's Landing. By having won the heart of Lysa he gained influence of Jon Arryn who was the de facto ruler of the realm. As with all of these magical powers I wonder when the user learned how to use it, how often he's used it and who else has used it. To start with that last question: Do you think the madness of The Mad King was also (partially) caused by dream invaders? Littlefinger clearly was not present at court during his reign, so it must have been someone else, surely. Who would have taught him is an other interesting question. So go on a path here: King Aerys II had a conflict with the Iron Bank of Braavos in 267 AC, Littlefinger was born in 268 AC. Petyrs great-grandfather was a Braavosi sellsword who took the head of the Titan of Braavos as his sigil. Do you think it's possible Petyr was literally bred from birth to serve the interests of Braavos in Westeros, manipulating his way to the top so that Braavos can take over the lands. Littlefinger is multiple times talked about as if he's two different people, so in theory it's possible he's a role played by a faceless man... who are also from Braavos. So your last statement, that Littlefinger is the faceless man of dreams makes a lot of sense given all this.

[@LL-xp2jb]

What a terrific video, guys. And I love your Littlefinger playbook. I can see his prints in in nearly the whole series of unfortunate events. But you've vindicated the theory I've been espousing for years on GoT websites about LF insinuating the idea to Joffrey. And last year on re-watch I noticed LF down the steps from the platform standing still and smirking while everyone begged Joff not to do it. But your GRRM quote is even better. I just can't see the dream thing--LF must have had ways to contact Joffrey without anyone knowing and planted the idea. It had perfect appeal to Joff--look a hero, satisfy the crowd, show those women who's boss, etc. And analyzing Ned's words, I think LF wrote the speech for maximum humiliation. Who knows. But he sure had means, opportunity and motive (including making Catelyn a grieving widow!). BTW, since LF is massively rich (though he lives fairly modestly), do you think he hired the Faceless Man to murder Ned in case Joff didn't come through? I do. And if so, it's clear he'd take an interest in Ned's daughter. Anyway, this is a GREAT video!!!!

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

you're not buying the Ned dream example? we noticed that a few months ago and read it, re-read it, and re-read it, etc..., and couldn't think of anything other than it being LF posing as Robert...the things "Robert" said to him were pure LF...twisting the knife by asking Ned if he could eat price while Ned starved and planting the notion that he will have to forsake his honor to save his daughters...we already thought LF could do this when we made part three about exactly that, but we made the mistake of trying to figure out how he did it and the point of the video was lost on most everyone as a result...that catspaw trying to kill Bran feels like it had to have been LF's doing, but he was too far away to get Joffrey to do it any other way

[@girlnettles]

As far as Ned's fever dream. I'm a bit skeptical in believing that Littlefinger has any "powers" instead, I am more willing to believe that it is the Old gods warning/showing Ned. Ned is weak, alone, and in the dark. That is when the old gods like to talk to people. They are showing him how Littlefinger can use people like King Robert like a puppet.

[@alanpennie8013]

Girl Nettles It's a stretch indeed. Was Cersei also using a glass candle when she appeared to Ned in a vision just before Littlefinger did?

[@alexanderz3556]

Yes! My fav ASOIAF channel, talking about my fav ASOIAF character! Let's do this!

[@MrFirextinguisher]

Alexander Zarathustra gotta appreciate the baddies

[@Canuovea]

Littlefinger actually touching Joffy is a very interesting point. Though I doubt very much that if Littlefinger got Joffy to kill Ned that he did it by outright telling Joffy to kill the guy. If he did, he'd most likely hint at it, make Joffy think it was his own idea. The idea that Baelish would ever presume it a good idea to straight up tell Joffy to do something would be, indeed, ridiculous. But Littlefinger subtly influencing anyone indirectly does not require magic. I figure that it may not be wise to put too much stock in the dreams of feverish men. Furthermore, are you saying that Ned ripped the mask from the Not-Robert's face to reveal Baelish? I dispute that, for it seems to me the pronoun grammar suggests that it is Not-Robert himself ripping the mask from his face, not Ned. Cracks and fissures on his face, and he reached up. Same sentence, same "he", so presumably it is Not-Robert doing the ripping. You've got good theory crafting, but this one seems a little bit weak. The fact is, Ned's fever dream makes plenty of sense if it is just, well, a natural fever dream. He was betrayed by Baelish, he knew he was betrayed by Baelish, why wouldn't his fevered subconscious not make the man a focal point of Ned's dream? It makes sense to me. It also makes sense that he would be worried about his children. I also find the idea of Baelish being, essentially, magical, something that would undermine the character as a whole. He's a consummate conniver, Machiavelli's Fox perhaps, but him being all that while still just being a regular human feels right to me. It becomes suddenly less impressive to me if he is also magically powerful. It would be, I'm sorry, boring. I don't normally think your theories being correct would make the book worse, sometimes a little crazy sure, but in this case? I hope it isn't true.

[@JB.27_]

Awesome job guys. Once again.

[@thisguy8106]

Is there any possibility of a video digging further into this?.. because I've always felt that GRRM's use of the phrase "hidden influence over Joffery" is meant literally. And not just "hidden from other people's knowledge" but an influence hidden to even Joffrey. I would love to dig in on how Littlefinger is doing this and who taught him, etc..

[@ewanmacdonald8466]

I love you both, sometimes I think you’re drinking Sade of the Evening by the gallon, but I’m still entertained!

[@estherqholland4923]

Master of wisperers Loved it. Thanks❤️

[@TheCosplayInsanity]

Whoa, I would not have made the connection there. Nice one, Greenhand!

[@Indubitably14]

I'm applying occum's razor. He simply met with Joffrey and made subtle suggestions about how "treachery must be punished" and "don't listen to women". It was a risk but as Littlefinger says in the show, "So many men, they risk so little. They spend their lives avoiding danger. And then they die." He does not have the ability to enter men's dreams. He simply visited Ned Stark to rub salt in his wounds, and Ned happened to be dreaming. It was artistic writing, not magical powers. As for GRRM's reply, he is simply admitting to the fan that they are half-right. Littlefinger does have a hidden influence over Joffrey but in this particular instance, Littelfinger wasn't there. That has to be remembered because in this case, Joff was acting out of his own stupidity.

[@peteperkins3859]

I believe Catelyn was one of those "loose ends" Littlefinger needed to take care of by using the cats paw in Winterfell.

[@ptptpt123]

I was skeptical first, but this Baelish video convinced me of his supernatural "whispering" abilities. It is very deliberate by GRRM in the text, and it makes complete sense.

[@patrickpilkington6241]

This was fantastic. Well done.

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Thank you

[@childofpersia1213]

Wait...I agree Ned’s fever dream is about LF ...but who says it’s sent by LF? There’s nothing to suggest he has those powers, let alone how he’d accomplish that. There’s no weirwood tree at LF’s disposal, and if you think he has a glass candle, that’s crackpot

[@vringi3725]

He have green-gray eyes... Maybe he is greenseer

[@sirarthurofwinterfell282]

YES THIS IS MY FAVORITE SERIES THANK YOU

[@thisguy8106]

Little devils... little details..

[@alanpennie8013]

Neat Lovecraft reference.

[@dainironfoot2581]

Awesome video. Have you guys seen the theory on reddit that lem lemoncloak and bronn are actually rodrick and maron greyjoy? It's a very good read and makes some great points

[@prajaktadande7053]

This is so wonderful

[@shellzzz23]

You just made my night!

[@christopherbrewer222]

Order of the Green Hand is absolutely amazing. When that music came in at the end after you’ve made your conclusion to the video it blew my fucking mind. 😲

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

Thank you Ser

[@bradwolf07]

I'm all on board that "Stupid, Vicious Jeffrey" was influenced to that monumentally stupid act of cutting Ned's head off

[@johnathanwalker8395]

My co workers called me Littlefinger mainly because I look a tiny bit like him and had the political reins both front and back of the house.

[@AzaleaJane]

So what you're saying is Littlefinger is the impersonator guy in Inception. I dig it.

[@migukmoonpark4312]

That's why Holster Tully keeps saying "tansy"; Littlefinger is torturing him in his dreams.

[@chrisjanney9411]

Any chance that we can link the dream ability to night walking? Or the glass candles?

[@daniell1483]

I think the idea that Baelish is magic undercuts much of the reason Baelish is such an intriguing character. He has been the underdog his whole life, and it was his intellect and manipulative skills that make him so formidable. Introducing magic to his character takes away a lot of that appreciation. Besides, you never really justify this hypothesis at all. Ned had a badly infected leg and was having fever dreams while in the Black Cells. It makes much more sense that Ned was quite bitter at being played by Littlefinger than Littlefinger having the ability to influence dreams. But let's say you are right, Baelish influenced this dream. How? He has no demonstrated connection to either of the two methods in the books by which dreams can be influenced.

[@b0therme]

I totally buy into the theory that Little Finger learned from the Three Eyed Crow, but now it seems they are at odds. The TEC needed Bran to get him into the Winterfell crypts (An event I'm sure we'll later learn to be a catastrophe.), to lure Jojen to free the "Winged Wolf"(catastrophe!), and send Bran North (catastrophe? Not good for Jojen.). If Petyr had had his way, none of that would have happened.

[@aseasyas8936]

I thought it was little finger, but that he had planted a seed in joffery’s head that made him think it was his idea.

[@Lotschi]

I think it is way to easy to just assume that Littlefinger can influence dreams. Except for the fever-dream itself there are no clues, that Littlefinger has some magicalof mystical powers.

[@andycropp7114]

This is your best theory to date food for thought

[@houseflan2505]

423 views in like 20 minutes...add mine to the tally. You guys are great.

[@kedar52]

Littlefinger! Finaly ! i was waiting for this

[@samuel.stelzer]

So in short: Littlefinger uses glass candles. We know this is a thing, we know it works and it looks so much like Littlefinger to keep that power secret and abuse it for his own ends. He is using whatever tool he can get a hold on, be it worldly power and manipulation or magic. And for him it's simply that: a tool for power. I'm not completely sold, but GRRMs comment on him "no being in Winterfell" really indicates in this direction. On the other hand: how does he have so much detailed information on what is going on elsewhere. It's not like glass candles are palantíri.

[@seakaybaduza7085]

2 part question guys In ASOS JON VI ... Jon has the ff dream: “when his dreams took him, he found himself back home once more, splashing in the hot pools beneath a huge white weirwood that has his father’s face. Ygritte was with him,... trying to kiss him, but he couldn’t, not with his father watching. He was the blood of Winterfell, a man of the Night’s Watch. I will not Father a bastard, he told her. I will not. I will not. “You know nothing Jon Snow,” she whispered, her skin dissolving in the hot water, the flesh beneath sloughing off her bones until only skull and skeleton remained, and the pool bubbled thick and red.”... Jon has this dream while recovering from a stab word on the leg just like Ned was. N the exact same thing happens except instead of Littlefingers face, it’s Blood Raven (the skull n skeleton)... it kinda seems like Blood Raven wants Jon to desert... What do you think? N is it possible that when Ned died he could have gone in the weirwood net

[@christopherbrewer222]

Once again bringing clarity to ASOIAF!

[@CaptCKernel]

I think its pretty standard that LF did those things, but the real question is "What is LFs end game?" and we dont have an answer. Is he the Larys Strong of our story?

[@TheOrderoftheGreenhand]

He’s the devil and he’s paving the way for the Others invasion

[@dariodenny3096]

For little finger to have touched crazy king Joff clearly tells us that they had sum kind of relationship

[@rincewindXIV]

I wasn't convinced of Magic Littlefinger at first, but this has convinced me of him having influence over dreams. I still doubt that it was Joffrey hiring the catspaw though, refering to the preston videos on that subject. I have a different explenation for Littlefinger orchestrating that event. Winterfell, like Storms End, is built on magic blocking foundations and wards, making magical influence impossible on any target not severely weakened or already under full influence. Littlefinger required a man on the inside for his influence there. A man with whom he could communicate over the course of 8 days. A man whom had known him since childhood and treated his wounds after the duel with Brandon Stark. A man who tried to get Catlyn to leave Bran alone twice, once by himself, and once by influencing Rob, on the night of Bran's attack. A man who would tell the catspaw that no-one would be in Brans room but Bran, convincing him that Catlyn (who hadn't left that room for 8 days straight, something that would be known in the entire keep) would not be there.

[@heartsbane907]

Hello! Ever since your series I have been totally on board that LF influenced Joffrey to kill Ned. It just made so much sense. Although when I re-read it, to me, it seemed that when Littlefinger says he took Joffrey by the shoulder and whispered his words, it was a hint of evidence that they had a more intimate relationship. As you say, there is no way Joffrey would let anyone take him by the shoulder and Littlefinger certainly would not be that stupid, unless, they did have a closer relationship and it points to some sort of familiarity he had with him. Joffrey was desperate for a male role model and Littlefinger could have capitalized on that. When questioned, Rule #3, “You always make the target think it was their own idea”? So in Joffery’s mind Littlefinger really had nothing to do with his decision. I do agree with Mormont that magical ability would cheapen his character. As much as I hate him, I’m in awe of how LF works. Your idea is so compelling though, especially using Roberts image in both instances and the issue of LF access to Joffrey without anyone noticing. I’m gonna have to think about this! Thanks for another mind blow!

[@11101983omega]

Also how did Joffrey know about nearly all of Robert's bastards, the one chasing Gendry knew he had a bulls horn and surely only Vary's would be that much accurate. Do you think he offered his life to the faceless men in exchange for revenge?

[@peterwalls-qf7ii]

FINE! Little finger has magic powers , varys has magic powers , everyone has magic powers. When did this turn to a Howard saga?

[@treehouse318]

always excellent. thank you!😊

[@sinjun1973]

Chaos is a ladder. He wanted them all out of the way. Whisper cruelty, just the idea. And Joffrey would be dumb enough to take the bait. Being Joffrey he would never give credit to anyone when he was proud of his actions. It would be his idea alone or at least he would think it was. Littlefinger hates all of them! He's been stealing from the crown for years. He thought of Herrehall as garbage. Unwanted and he left it unclaimed by never going there. He really threw it in their faces or someones if I remember right. He wanted to tear the kingdom apart then swoop in as it's savior! He wanted the throne as his own and in the books he still does. He killed Lysa to tie up a loose end and uses Sansa as a bartering chip. Behind the scene he turn up everywhere but it's always a place he wanted to get sent to. Littlefinger is a master at manipulation. Probably a sociopath. He knows that he can never attain the crown in a normal way. He has no army, no real home, he's definitely not good at fighting. So he's manipulated everyone into doing it for him. The kingdom was already like a house of cards. He just kept pulling one card out at a time until the kingdom fell in to ruin and war. He plans on being the last man standing by staying out of battle as would be expected of such a useless man when it come to weapons. He has no strengths in combat. So he plays to what he is good at. Getting people to think they have no choice but the one he wants them to have. Verys won't rat him out. No one else sees what Littlefinger is actually doing. So he gets away with it. Just as he did siphoning money away because everyone knew of Roberts largesse. He probably encouraged the king even. I honestly see no redeeming factors with Littlefinger. He's just as sick and twisted a Joffrey is but he's much more clever and hides his evil well. It all about the Game of Thrones. Whose left standing to take it! He plans on it being his.

[@thisguy8106]

Btw, thanks for bringing up Ned tearing off Robert's face. Its the only time, that I know of so far, where someone saw through the magic. Like Syrio explains to Arya.. People may ask HOW does LittleFinger do this.. and that's where this 3 eye crow thing gets weird for me..

[@conniesuper9892]

So does Littlefinger have a glass candle? If he's in KL and Joffreys in WF,how would he have been able to sway him so far away? Does he have powers similar to 3 eyed raven? Was he tested after the duel with Brandon Stark,and didn't pass,like Euron? He was laid up after that duel,and probably on poppy milk,and heavily sedated...is this why he has Sweetrobin so sedated,because he senses powers in HIM,and hopes to help or hinder him from developing them,and interfere with Petyrs plans? Doesn't want Sweetrobin realizing he killed his mother? Sneaky faceless man talents,but keeping his hands clean,and mockingbirding others voices🤔does he have a bag of faces? I'm tumbling down the rabbit hole aaaaaaaaaaahhhhh!!!🐇great video!!!!!

[@josiem1681]

How does little finger enter everyone’s dreams ???

[@sooziemc8324]

It’s possible a long bow you are pulling but I remembered that Perry’s family are from Braavos

[@ivanbluecool]

The title made me have song flashbacks.