Liberal vs Conservative Lesbians | Middle Ground

[@jubilee]

Unreleased prompt only on Patreon: bit.ly/3GrETBy “Pride should be taught in classrooms”

[@OpCzar]

Considering that the topic potentially deals with legislation and therefore could be tipping factor for both liberal and conservative sides, it's a pity that this was the one chosen to be paywalled.

[@WhyWorldWet]

Why is there always one loud outspoken Asshat or Biotch in these things lol. They should get red carded for being too aggressive and outspoken, and ruining the session. It’s low key bullying too.

[@ChristieinFlorida]

NO, pride should not be taught in classrooms. This should be up to the parents to teach them if they want. Children should only be worrying what toy they will play with next. You give these people an inch and they will take 10 miles.

[@aloe704]

Why are you doing this?

[@goodoldfashionedangel]

Yes, it should be taught. So should poc history.

[@ontherize28]

Attention Jubilee: Please work on including a professional moderator in these discussions. I’m tired of individuals dominating the debate and constant interruptions.

[@Indomita506]

It's not her fault some of them are weak spoken

[@andria8279]

@@Indomita506no it’s just about respect

[@lilyoh5780]

yes!

[@velocirizzo1850]

​@@Indomita506dumbest response

[@Indomita506]

@@velocirizzo1850 You can hate her all you want but at least she doesn't play victim card every 5 seconds as argument.

[@baraleguille]

Defining women as the "non-men" is the most misogynistic definition of a woman. Beauvoir already said it.

[@michaeljmyers1995]

correct me if im wrong: Its sexist because it takes their humanity away and individuality

[@viciouzvalentine4993]

its misandry too... want to step into masculine presentation, but hate men so much .... just smh....

[@rachelrobertson6570]

Exactly why is lesbianism now centred around men?

[@impressionare3243]

It also contradicts the entire point of lesbianism and makes 0 sense.

[@erenjaeger1738]

​@viciouzvalentine4993 These women are misogyny to themselves, and the same people complain about patriarchy but practice patriarchy themselves. They don't see the irony and see men always stay winning in sports and politics. These women have failed.

[@mothmustardseed1858]

Two things that would improve this show substantially: 1. Include a moderator who prevents speakers from repeatedly interrupting others. 2. Provide “fact check” notes that appear onscreen so we can see what the speakers are referencing. I double Jubilee will do either, because they are driven by profit rather than a real desire to promote informative conversation.

[@showbizpizzafan66]

Fact checks would be amazing

[@all_corrupt_everything]

I would love it if they also kept the conversation more related to the prompt. Way too many tangents

[@kylieb5213]

They would have to actually produce facts, which is a problem rn

[@Random-sk6hm]

Actually they used to do both of these on older videos. They need to bring them back.

[@missknight9]

@@Random-sk6hmI agree. I think they wanted to keep it more organic, but it often just continues to devolve into chaos

[@AlyssaNunez-kh6wc]

“We don’t care abt labels as much anymore” yet everything has to have a label

[@mrbrightside4u]

Think of it like music genres. It's super helpful to have a lot of different genres and subgenres to be able to really go into detail about what you are talking about. The not caring about the label part doesn't mean not acknowledging the different genres, it just means that you don't say you can only listen to rock if you want to part of our club, and post-rock isn't real rock. The big difference is that there are human emotions and identities involved, so mislabeling can be hurtful, which is why you should use them when you learn about them, whereas not knowing music genres is only hurtful to idiots.

[@Jordan_Givan]

Oh yeah yeah there’s a bunch of new labels.It’s definitely makes sense to say they don’t want traditional labels

[@djgeneralbounce]

​@@mrbrightside4upeople who are hurt because someone doesn't use a label they identify with need therapy. Other people's feelings about their identities are not society's problem.

[@nicktheprickevans]

I was just about to type that in the comments too

[@nicktheprickevans]

for someone that adopts a new label to say that they don't care about labels shows that they don't really have any morals or bases to stand on they just kind of shift with the tide their wishy-washy they go with the flow they do whatever and say whatever pleases those around them instead of what pleases themselves or or doing that itself please them

[@licoriceow7535]

Y'all really need to do one with a group of americans and a group of non americans to confront them with reality outside of their country. It's sooooo necessary!

[@embracelifewithemily]

Yes

[@michaelturley3457]

Just curious, what do you think would come from it? In other words what do you think Americans need to be aware of from the outside perspective? I agree but in curious your perspective.

[@joannas8359]

YES

[@VoiceDivine]

Why? We’re allowed to discuss and fix the problems in our nation with outside affairs going on.

[@rshinsii]

you’d be shocked that we’ve got our OWN damn issues. bad.

[@mage758]

It would be interesting to see a conversation between lesbians and gay men.

[@waratah234]

would love to see a dialogue between lesbian men and gay women

[@felibarrabino7556]

@@waratah234?

[@mage758]

wtf is that@@waratah234

[@Venomenal91]

@@felibarrabino7556 exactly how I’m feeling 😂

[@RJonSaturn]

what would they talk about? they’re complete opposites when it comes to sexuality, lol

[@shannon_w.]

I would love to see a middle ground with these younger lesbian women and older lesbian women. I would love to see what the older women think of where the community is now.

[@sulbamt7622]

SAME

[@thetillerwiller4696]

OMG YES!!!

[@theresas740]

We cannot believe this horseshit.

[@crewxp]

I don't think that would be as interesting as youd think lol. The older generation would probably School the younger

[@steph367]

@@crewxpwhich is why it would be interesting to

[@pb-rw8ot]

I feel like we can disagree without being rude 😭😭😭

[@doctorquib]

WRONG, you BIGOT!!! (this is sarcasm)

[@Exhaustedeveryday_]

Exactly

[@fierybl4de400]

they getting emotional people be heated over politics

[@hexegrams]

why is it bad to get emotional and angry at people who want to invalidate your identity and take away your rights? i think that’s pretty reasonable

[@tylerjrubio]

THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE MEDIATION OVER PEOPLE CONSTANTLY INTERRUPTING OTHERS…. So annoying…

[@Kr1egsmesser]

Yeah I want to see an actual debate without personal feelings involved. And the passive aggression makes this so much harder to watch

[@TeenageDirtbag8]

Yes thank you

[@GenesisBish]

I don't understand why Jubilee keeps inviting back Arielle. They KNOW how she behaves and what she does to the debate. It's definitely intentional at this point, and I want to understand why.

[@ActuallySammy]

So true

[@MrsMockerman1011]

EXACTLY makes it impossible to watch

[@sarsoura8289]

Ngl, I’m absolutely infuriated by the “liberal” lesbians continually referring to women as “non-men.” Respectfully, my existence as a woman is not relative to men, in the same way that men’s existence is not relative to ours as women. I am a woman because I share specific biological, physiological, and social traits with a large group of people, who are all also women. These similarities would still exist even if men had never existed. Extremely misogynistic take on all these women’s part IMO. Shame on you.

[@ba3725]

Liberals started to plunge downhill when people started to not know how to define "woman" tbh, but it was already falling down quickly.

[@daisy1686]

That is disgusting.

[@sarsoura8289]

@@daisy1686 What is, dear?

[@jesusmywholehaschanged]

They're so progressive that they have regressed on so many issues.

[@RichardsGaySon]

Isn’t it misogynistic to suggest that men can “identify” as women

[@moodymullet]

Y’all need to have people reminded to not interrupt eachother

[@willow1698]

Interruptions are part of conversation. Tbh I don't mind it as long as people are able to fight for themselves in the conversation if they want their point heard. Maybe it's based on how each individual grows up.

[@ContrarianConcervativePNW]

My problem is how much they cut to favor their own views. I want middle ground and if it needs to be longer or split in 2 parts to get it, so be it. You will never really get a middle ground with this lazy cut method.

[@SamanthaDean1]

It’s a debate, they are supposed to do that to each other

[@moodymanda6225]

That’s what a debate/ heated topic conversation usually is Grow up

[@sandmonke21]

u need to be reminded to lose weight on the daily ngl

[@lucybellehennessy8160]

As a woman, I find people referring to biological women as 'non-men' offensive and degrading

[@starlit9690]

Why?

[@katrinabee9846]

@@starlit9690 Non-men is saying that men are the default. It's not true, everything has to be a balance, men cannot exist without women, nor women without men. We are our own thing, each worthy of our own definition.

[@lapelucadelacomay8851]

If they can say I want you to call me this, I can say i don’t want you to call me that. That cis naming is disrespectful when I dint ask for it.

[@starlit9690]

@@katrinabee9846 People also say non-women. Non-men was just used in the video because it’s in the point of view of lesbians. If it were gay men, they would have used the term non-women

[@starlit9690]

@@lapelucadelacomay8851 calling someone cis isn’t disrespectful. You are cisgender if your sex assigned at birth aligns with the gender you identify as. You are cisgender and that’s just a fact. There’s really no reason to be upset over it.

[@Hi_Its_LP]

So if lesbian is non men loving non men… what is women loving women? Not all women want to be reduced to being “non men”

[@chung-jenweng6454]

😂eventually you guys would embrace the progress like wearing pants - their logic

[@yolandaponkers1581]

But no one is reducing you to any label you don’t feel comfortable with. The whole point of progress and change and expansion is to include others, not force anything on you. It’s not about you.

[@ChurrosAreSexy]

Including others does not mean you’re being excluded

[@anthonymc8361]

@@yolandaponkers1581 "it's not about you". Do you realize how ironic that sentence is?

[@galikafry8494]

Why does it heppen? Why is the gay community so busy fighting bigotry when it barely exist anymore in America? Being privileged isnt a curse

[@kawehionalani]

As a total outsider, the problem seems to be language. Words are getting re-defined causing chaos.

[@Foob2TheR]

Americans are all very lucky they weren't born in the Middle East. So lucky that they create their own struggles just so other's can feel bad for them.

[@slsthewriter1299]

I HAVE LITERALLY BEEN SAYING THIS FOR YEARS. So much of our issues as a whole is just…it's language. People get confused over what others are trying to say, but they only have their own experiences to fall back on, so it just ends up in this constant loop.

[@endeavor1664]

Language is the root of it for sure, but the problem now is that they’re using these new definitions to justify invading spaces that used to be just for lesbians or just for women

[@LittlestLilly]

But words like "they/them" as singular pronouns have been used for centuries already. That hasn't been redefined - more people are just being exposed to it and don't seek to learn.

[@Tiffany-bd1eb]

I feel like social media has made it worse. Online bubbles aside, never in our history have we been looking at and communicating by written text so much.

[@ItssMarssXoXo]

I don't get why they changed the definition of lesbian. Lesbian is women loving women. Its almost invalidating that they did that. Non-men loving non-men? the lgbtq+ community tries to be inclusive, yet we couldnt create new terms for those that don't identify as women, but love women/non-men

[@will506]

maybe to create confusion to take advantage of open minded, compassionate people that may be oblivious to the contradictions within the ideology

[@vela-6]

Creating new terms and changing definitions is how the entire gender topic exists. They just make things up and change things to get their narrative to work -- even though it doesn't work.

[@MsBlushing24]

It promotes the idea that men are the default.

[@Thereasonyoudontlikeme]

I’m confused asf with this comment

[@Victori.A1]

And there ARE terms for that. Non binary people only attracted to women are *trixic*. I really don't know why they insist that they are lesbians

[@KatherineJohns-er1mu]

Amber was making me so angry with her “privilege” talk 😡

[@Emily-ij1hf]

Everytime she gets proven wrong the other person is just “privileged” lol

[@bridgetspinkwig]

I don’t know why she’s talking about privilege when her dad is literally loaded

[@briacupcake]

Tell me you don't understand nuance or concepts above a 5th grade level without telling me ^^^ Privilege exists on any and all levels of society, existence, and position. People can be privileged in one area of life and then extremely unprivileged in others and it still makes the privilege they do experience valid. Calling out privilege is a call to action to examine someone else's lived experience that is different than your own and understanding that moving forward in any actions. It's not an attack on your character or your identity. It doesn't mean the the person with "privilege" has never struggled. Amber's use of the term privilege was spot on throughout the entire video.

[@mangoloverprincess33]

@@briacupcakethank u so much for saying this. Amber wasn’t arguing “privilege” on the basis of race or wealth or anything of that nature. Flannel shirt’s privilege was due to the fact that she (for whatever reason) was not experiencing the same life as amber when identifying as lesbian, like bigotry for example. Not saying none of the conservatives have been prejudiced for being lesbian, but it’s probably been on a much smaller scale compared to the others. That explains the very reason why they’re conservative, there’s a part of the picture that they haven’t had to see.

[@alexandrul.9910]

​@@briacupcake She was using "privilege" as an argument to why the conservative experience is not valid... I think what Amber needs to understand is that everyone experience struggles at all levels of society, existence and position. You can not call someone privileged for being able to deal with the struggles better than she does. That is the classic victim mentality. She completely failed to give an example on how lesbians have a less rights than straight people and then calls out "privelege" when others are proving her that her view does not represent objective reality.

[@avar5976]

It’s really interesting how you can tell who participates in this to learn from each other and who participates to fight and put the other side down

[@Hoochiemamaxo]

every conservative 😂 just here to yell their ‘truth’ at others

[@frishter]

@@Hoochiemamaxo "My truth" is not a phrase that came from conservatives, sorry to tell you that.

[@emileemay3208]

@@Hoochiemamaxothe only one you could BARELY argue that with us Arielle…and even she was pretty open minded here. the liberal side though? there were two people who literally fought tooth and nail (and made up obscene lies) to prove their “truth”…not sure why you think conservatives were the one who came up with that saying but they’re not.

[@VoVina111]

@@Hoochiemamaxo did .. did you watch the same video that we did? lol

[@michaelstimpfl9814]

@@Hoochiemamaxo Everyone can have opinions, if the liberals can have an opinion, then why can't the conservatives? Every thing about the LGBTQ+ community is about acceptance.

[@maddistories]

i miss the days in which participants hugged each other cause they actually found middle ground. these days it’s just a debate :(

[@tessaelto1472]

fr it's honestly just almost aggressive from the beginning when they should be coming in open to a *middle ground*

[@tanishapark6314]

Yes but for me a very thought provoking debate

[@imabitch222]

That's the whole point dummy, if everyone came to hug each other...we would def know who the lesbians are

[@WhyWorldWet]

Agreed. One Asshat always ruins it for the rest. They should get red carded and booted off after two or three warnings. Everyone looked upset and sad, that she just ruined the whole episode. It would have flowed so much better if they would have removed that one girl.

[@annafrancescachereches754]

sadly the episodes with the screaming matches get the most views more likely.... I wish they would cut out the bits where people interrupt eachother, like thats not what I'm here for...

[@Blueeyesinthesky]

I feel like it’s important to be respecting the “base” sexes. To basically call women “non-men” and making this stuff based around men is def misogynistic.

[@Momo-po5tn]

They dont respect them, thats why

[@danishamcclendon]

That was my thought too like ,why are we centering men with our identity.

[@eritakahashi1765]

Genuinely curious, are men considered anything non women? Just such a crazy way to talk, I really don't understand this and how non binary fits into this

[@nao_directioner]

no because they are some non binary persons who are gay and say that it's non women loving non women

[@katie7513]

@@eritakahashi1765yes men fit into the category of non women

[@blairquinn4768]

The girl with the bandana is just not smart. Bottom line, she wants to be a thinker and it’s not working.

[@FAD4LIFE94]

Yeah she and the loud one are like the worst kinds of people on each side tbh

[@KaylaTrosper-qb1jv]

@@FAD4LIFE94and they used to be best friends 😂

[@mariesindlerova9663]

Amber: Detransitioners are just soo small percentage of people we should not talk about it...also Amber: It does not matter if intersex people are only 1% we should acknowledge it in the topic

[@Bionic_Webb]

That part irritates me so bad she a hypocrite

[@motleyminded85]

Even if 1% of the trans population ends up detransitioners (the number is actually higher), there are thousands upon thousands in the USA alone, and they don't deserve to be invalidated and have their experiences/trauma swept under the rug. We can't fix problems if we refuse to acknowledge them.

[@mikavargas1749]

well 2% of the WORLD population is intersex so like… 13.5 million or smth? and less than 1% of trans people have de transitioned so like… 2 thousand? i feel like that’s a large large different ..

[@reeceassify]

​@@motleyminded85exactly or the numbers will grow. Not to many religious parents were taking their kids to camps to stop being gay but when few did it more and more ended up doing it so yes by not acknowledging the problem only makes it worse.

[@shani5345]

And LGBTQ + is a very small percentage of the population. I guess she is discrediting her community.

[@madisonjolie1224]

I think that they should make sure everyone on the panel gets to talk before people who already spoke do so again.

[@will506]

that’s too restrictive for a productive debate. arielle just needs a little more patience and to avoid interrupting them

[@RorysStory84]

Agreed, if I wanted to know how Ariel felt about everything question I’d go to her channel. It’s unfortunate that we didn’t get to hear as much from the other guests.

[@alice2923]

OR people should learn to speak up.

[@madisonjolie1224]

@@alice2923 💀

[@WhyWorldWet]

100% “You had your turn, STFU”

[@drpineapple41]

Referring to women as "non-men" can be seen as offensive for several reasons: Erasure of identity: The term "non-men" defines women solely in relation to men, rather than recognizing them as individuals with their own unique identities and experiences. It implies that men are the default or norm, while women are simply deviations from this norm. Reductive: Describing women as "non-men" reduces their identity to what they are not, rather than acknowledging their inherent worth and complexity as individuals. Inclusive language: Using terms like "non-men" to refer to women fails to recognize the importance of inclusive language that respects and affirms people's identities. It can make women feel marginalized and excluded from discussions about their own experiences and issues. Historical context: Women have long been marginalized and oppressed in many societies, and using language that reinforces this marginalization can be deeply hurtful and offensive.

[@delonjohnson5907]

That's the thing most men would agree with you, the issue is modern feminist are attacking the wrong men. We're with you guys on the betas infiltrating your spaces and sports. If the larger portion of feminists would work with us we can keep the inmates from running the asylum. The "toxic masculinity" people are probably your biggest supporters.

[@anotherinternetidiot6300]

Yes - "gender inclusivity" INCLUDES gender, not erases it.

[@Dagkadns]

I think the point is that the term 'non men' is referring to everyone other than MEN. Like, we aren't solely referring to women as 'non men', we're referring to people who identify as women, NB, genderfluid, etc. so it's literally people who are not men (hence 'non men') who love other people who aren't men

[@soulvmins4874]

thanks for a whole lot of nothing !

[@selintuncer5430]

@@Dagkadns why don't we define gays as non-women being into non-women then?

[@silverrr_]

Does she think saying “privilege” should automatically win her the argument? Get real lmao

[@bobbiedonald2977]

EXACTLY...she isn't arguing for equality, she is LITERALLY arguing for LGBTQ PRIVILEGES...bc there are ZERO rights that straight ppl have that the LGBTQ don't have! If anything every single LGBTQ person has MORE rights and MORE PRIVILEGES!

[@dragondiva306]

Lesbian privilege. I was dying

[@Wiggityways]

I love how calm and polite Becky is while talking about heavy issues. Very accepting but still firm in her beliefs.

[@thecamillarose9806]

I loved her

[@Freenow-i6o]

Critical! PaleXXXXn Hummus strongly opposes the LGBT community and homosexuals. Reports include instances of torture, arrests, and threats against community members.There are videos showing that Palestinians have hanged homosexuals in the street. You are invited to watch, though it is not easy watch. "LGBTQ+ community persecuted by Hamas in Gaza " On Balance NewsNation and "i24NEWS: 'When I was 17, Hamas caught me with my boyfriend'

[@anitaraggini7695]

Opposed to ariel who is straight up mean

[@sophienathaniel2089]

Yes and she was actually open to listening and understanding a different perspective as opposed to Sasha and Arielle

[@degviela]

​@@sophienathaniel2089I dont blame Sasha why she was hostile with Amber if somebody would come after me like that i would snap back like Sasha did and rigtfully so.

[@gracieshelly5908]

“I believe in freedom of speech” then proceeds to cut off or interrupt any person who disagrees with her 😭

[@JamesJones-tl4yy]

You don't understand freedom of speech

[@rams812]

How are those things related?. She's not telling them they can't say things. She's just rude. So again, how are they related?

[@JamesJones-tl4yy]

@rams812 lol use your critical thinking skills. Put yourself in another's shoes.

[@rams812]

@@JamesJones-tl4yy maybe find a brain first and actually answer my question. Interrupting and cutting off doesnt counter believing in freedom of speech. Just means your rude and carry an inability to wait. Doesnt take too much critical thinking to see that, but maybe you lack any level of thinking

[@nicolemarlin6900]

That’s the conservative way!

[@sanae2796]

How can you possibly be a lesbian if you don’t even classify yourself as a woman???!!!

[@mattiestewart8371]

THIS!

[@Uncannyreindeer]

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 wholeheartedly agree as a lesbian

[@Aging_Casually_Late_Gamer]

Because it gives them more oppression points from wokies

[@chung-jenweng6454]

😂by changing the definition of lesbian as well. Duh

[@shenanigans-jn9kr]

Because they’re so “open minded” that their brains are falling out

[@twinmamatam1947]

It is difficult to focus on anything else besides the passive aggressive, disrespectful, condescending, immature, blatantly rude interruptions and remarks. What a great way to make sure nobody wants to hear anything you have to say

[@Jordan_Givan]

Yeah lady in the flannel was doing a lot in the dating transwomen part.I’m pretty sure she got up there just to show she can look open minded.Very weird comments on the genital conversation😬

[@braydendukes6633]

Also, Becky at <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1440">24:00</a> did something I literally have seen hardly no one do, understand someone else's point. This how you know Becky is being humble and genuine in this conversation. She was actually willing to think through someone else's point and say she understands their point

[@RalvA101]

thats what I was thinking too, I definitely dont agree with her but at least she was willing to listen to what the others had to say lmao

[@ChampionShogo]

Beckys the only person here that speaks with any coherence whatsoever.

[@courtneymcphilbin1484]

Becky is a Queen. Love her points of view and her empathy and understanding!

[@ananananumumumumu3706]

bare minimum

[@sad_vegan507]

I like Becky she’s got swag 👏🏼

[@wumbo277]

It's so crazy growing up watching Amber and Arielle on KZbin back in the OG lesbian KZbinr days seeing them go on so many trips together, filming videos together, and having the same friend group, to becoming so distant and not on speaking terms anymore.

[@katecollins2471]

Was Arielle always so annoying?

[@dafnev3643]

@@katecollins2471 As far as i know yes, she was unhinged and not for beign conservative, its that she took it so far that it become what she criticize (irony)

[@angelazsz]

@@katecollins2471yea she was in a past video and was very annoying too lol

[@babsywoman4212]

​@@katecollins2471I like her. She is just passionate.

[@JakobTennisMB]

I think they're both at fault. As a moderate, some of Arielle's positions are a little extreme and her behavior is sometimes a little hostile and erratic, but Amber's opinions are also totally unhinged sometimes. They both just changed for the worse, I think.

[@hhall7193]

“Non-men”. How are you going to make the definition of woman completely androcentric? 😂 I can’t believe I’m alive to watch lesbians and likely self-proclaimed feminists essentially asserting that men and the default, and women are ‘other’.

[@misspiscesdreamz]

It's ridiculous!

[@dudeorduuude5211]

They are undoing all the hard work of the generations before them.

[@ameyorin]

Simone de Beauvoir is rolling in her grave!

[@switzjon8405]

You don't have to in this community to know ANY human walking the planet knows women are non men

[@MsAussieSheila]

whilst claiming "patriarchy".. um these "non men" are the patriarchy, not actual men.

[@rookzie]

This was incredibly interesting. It’s very clear who wants to communicate their thought for understanding versus who wants to win. There was also a clear divide on what appears to be intelligence.

[@katara9]

I love that Pamela spoke up about language being the main divider in these topics. It points out, in my opinion, that we may be more similar in our thoughts than we think, but that language is what divides us. It's often what divides generations, it's what makes it hard for us to understand each other.

[@cel.2263]

yeah, but i feel like they were wrong to dismiss to "it's just language" that divides them. language is HUGE. my main issue with the liberals is how they fail to explain how being inclusive on languages can translate to being inclusive on rights and acceptance. if you don't explain how those are related, than it becomes a discussion without any impact.

[@summermoore7707]

Great point. The laws vs acceptance conversation was a big takeaway from this video. It seems they found middle ground on need for acceptance, but not legislature. Excellent mention of a forgotten conversation from the leftists that may have connected the two for the conservatives. I think there was an attempt when protection was brought up. I'd love to see this group react to the LGBTQIA+ Christian middle ground from last month. Religious freedom/our country being based on christian ideals being the cause of lack of protection/laws would have been an interesting prompt here.@@cel.2263

[@animezae]

@@cel.2263and it’s really not JUST language. It’s the actions that stems from and influences the language that also poses issue.

[@THEalishahnator3000]

​@@animezaewho was pamela thoo??

[@angelazsz]

@@cel.2263great reply!

[@babybecz]

I think its wild that some people want to say they dont like labels yet all they seem to do is label themselves

[@SuperKat1100]

Best comment

[@Night_Sirenn]

Yea bc there’s more fluidity and openness to express oneself nowadays

[@r-ex2945]

And Label people who do not follow their ideas :p.

[@shani5345]

Exactly what I said!

[@Night_Sirenn]

@@r-ex2945 does not negate the fact that it’s a net positive for people to have the language to express themselves lol

[@destinymanns4890]

I don’t think Arielle is always necessarily wrong but her delivery is… like you can get your point across without being aggressive and rude

[@Indomita506]

Compare to Amber who doesn't have any arguments

[@cindybarretto]

I think sometimes there need to be aggressive conservatives just like there are so many aggressive liberals that have caused people to lose jobs and worry about their lives.

[@biasantos1405]

I mostly strongly agreed with what she said and I thought the same, her delivery comes as aggressive even though that may not be the intention.

[@earfgoddess]

yea. same thing with Blaire White. The mean girl attitude can be entertaining for videos where you're on your own. but in a real life setting, the whole 'gotcha' thing is so insufferable and counterproductive.

[@01neveroddoreven10]

@@LalaDepala00This is Middle Ground though, the whole point is to be open minded and hear the other side out, not to do gotcha's and be aggressive about your viewpoints. There is a way to express your opinions and facts respectfully like pretty much everybody but those two did.

[@TurboBass]

Gay and Homosexual are both terms that mean the same thing, and are used as such. Lesbian is a gender specific term for FEMALES who are sexually/romantically interested in FEMALES exclusively. If you're non-binary then you are not gay or lesbian, you're something else.

[@RaineSolosMud]

aanddd what is that something else???

[@caitcupples]

@@RaineSolosMudI feel like that’s just Queer

[@jordanngomezz1448]

you contradicted yourself in your own definition. if it’s a gender specific term then it is for WOMEN sexually/romantically interested in WOMEN. any defintion of lesbianism will use women instead of female specifically because women corresponds to GENDER not SEX

[@kiowah231]

@@RaineSolosMud A puddle of nonsense.

[@alexandrul.9910]

@@jordanngomezz1448 that's because gender is what is promoted, the real definition uses female\woman referring to sex in every other country but US.

[@I-SpeakHuman]

People come to these “debates” unprepared. If you want an honest debate, come with facts, data, and stats.

[@kayhaich]

Stats and "facts" can be challenged...I don't think anyone tunes into Jubilee that anyway, sounds really boring.

[@Isa-vi5hh]

Yes, that's basically arguing

[@anonymousbo0318]

​@kayhaich 😂 🤡. Just admit, you're outclassed, and you're discussing things you don't even understand, child.

[@lemax4277]

Assuming this is supposed to be a debate and not just what can you both agree upon to count as middle ground. If this is supposed to be a debate then I agree people should start using their own sources to back themselves up even if it’s going to be challenged. Problem is no matter what statistics you show others will claim that their personal experiences outweighs the statistics sometimes.

[@Strange9952]

It's very difficult to do that because then someone would not have read those facts and data and had not come to their conclusions on it facts are facts, what you conclude from those facts is not decided yet, especially in social sciences and whatnot

[@Keziah2447178]

The intersex topic gets thrown around a lot in debates like these and it’s frustrating because being trans and being intersex are so different. Gender dysphoria is literally recognized in the DSCM and the treatment for it is social transition, medical transition or both. Trans people take hormones to “fix” the disconnect between their brain and body. Intersex individuals are born biologically diverse. Meaning they could be born with a variety of both male/female characteristics (chromosomes, genitalia, etc). Intersex people would possible take hormones or have surgeries to literally biologically balance out hormones I see the similarities but comparing them is really like apples to oranges in my opinion.

[@jessycag1341]

I think the reason it gets brought up so often is to illustrate that people naturally exist outside the gender binary because a lot of anti-trans arguments center around "what you're born as" or, like in this video, whether or not you need to take hormones or undergo medical procedures to match how you identify. I agree that trans and intersex are 2 different categories, but they aren't entirely mutually exclusive because some intersex people identify as trans. Trans means you do not identify or match the gender you were assigned at birth, and if someone finds out they are intersex, they may find they no longer identify with their assigned gender.

[@user-mb4li5fq9f]

I agree, it's sad that intersex people are used as a golden example of the trans community when they aren't even trans. They are people born with physical deformities

[@TingTingalingy]

Using intersexuals is only for using them as a pawn. They do not care about them and only aim to exploit them for their own gain .

[@tristacarter2894]

​@jessycag1341 people with intersex conditions are still either going to be male or female. Medical anomalies shouldn't be brought up when arguing for something that's an ideology and not scientific at ALL

[@scottandrews3452]

Thank you for saying this

[@omnium_gatherum]

When someone brings up intersex like it's some kind of gender identity instead of a biological reality for those individuals, it's just so incredibly disrespectful and ignorant 🤦🏻‍♀️

[@alisonmercer5946]

the amount of destranstioners or unhappy with their transition is more than one percent. Those one percent are warped

[@alisonmercer5946]

idk why i said that under your comment because it has nothing to do with what u said

[@omnium_gatherum]

@@alisonmercer5946 😂 no worries

[@endeavor1664]

@@alisonmercer5946 it is somewhat related because Amber tried to claim there are more intersex people than detransitioners which is simply not true! She was just using them as a pawn for her nonsensical argument

[@ItsAstie]

​@@endeavor1664 Nope, there are about 5.6 million intersex people in the US alone which is more than total people who identify as trans in the US which is around 1.6 million, according to some studies up to 8% of that are detransitioners, combined by 3% of people who detransitioned at the time of the survey and 5% of people who had done so in the past, safe to assume that detransitioning numbers are not only low, but also most people who detransition continue transitioning later on. Source: google

[@LuagoNosLivros]

Bro came to a debate and said "if you want to talk to me after".... lol

[@RuffDiesel]

😂

[@sydney2833]

i wish jubilee would start platforming every day ppl instead of influencers/ socialites

[@emoyunho]

no literally arielle has been on here before and shes so infuriating

[@ElKnoppers]

​@@emoyunho why?

[@urmomsbas3ment]

@@emoyunhowho is that??

[@LimitedEditioneo]

I don’t think non-influencers are ready to take on the backlash that comes from this.

[@jinx724]

I'd love it tbh, I would love to write an essay or do a video anything so they could start picking ppl who are more based and don't have a platform

[@Spoolingturbski]

Amber: You are privileged….. Sasha: How we have the same rights… Amber: I have a list of things Sasha: Share them now Amber: You’re not listening Umm what? Lol

[@ItsPlaytimeVR]

I took it as she just wants her to agree with her in that moment

[@heatherkate93]

@callmebyyourname2015there are no examples.

[@JeyC_]

​@callmebyyourname2015 with how "liberals"(which is far leftists in reality, not really liberal anymore) are today now, Jubilee not finding the "best liberal" is inevitable

[@oo7tease]

The NEVER provide examples they just make these spurious claims, then check out, amp up the anger , become abusive

[@deega6285]

Who is The?

[@letstalkaboutit3195]

Funny how the ones who talked less (from both sides) are the ones who convinced me more

[@samariam3043]

That says more about you than them tbh

[@solareclipsebetch7652]

​@@samariam3043doesnt really matter

[@dakota9336]

@@samariam3043 how so?

[@datacolord]

Sounds like you were already on the liberal side to begin with. No problem there, everyone has their opinions, but don't act like you were on the fence and only chose your side from the video

[@happylilbookworm6513]

​@@datacolordI'm on the conservative side and I agree?

[@antoniusgrave1348]

I think the goal of the lgbt community is to no longer have to segregate themselves as a community and be accepted as a social norm that people no longer argue for or against. Basically the community is fighting to no longer have to justify their existence.

[@sophiataylor215]

i’m not sure if i agree with this. don’t u feel like their pride is in being different? don’t you feel like they love having their own spaces?

[@rebeccasirstad4919]

Absolutely not. People don’t want to be murdered. Or imprisoned. Or fired. Would like to be able to purchase a cake for their wedding. It has nothing do to with wanting to be the cool kids. That’s ridiculous. It’s actually about not wanting to be discriminated against based off what humans we are attracted to and want to love publicly.

[@djgeneralbounce]

​@@rebeccasirstad4919if thats the case then whats the point in Pride month?

[@jp6846]

okay, someone help me understand: - your name does not define your gender - your clothes/hair/makeup does not define your gender - your pronouns do not define your gender but - gender is expression??? Then how can someone referring to you as a different name or pronouns, or categorizing you differently based on their understanding of gender, invalidate your gender? What makes your gender valid? Does your entire identity hinge on other people's validation and approval of your expression without question? That seems...unhealthy.

[@arashf6094]

They wont admit it but essentially they believe very hardly on gender stereotypes to validate their gender.

[@miaseb9009]

This is a really great question, here’s just my point of view on the topic: gender expression and gender validity are all about the individual person. Someone’s personal name, pronouns, or clothing choices do not define THIER specific gender, but rather their own gender identity is how they personally determine it to be through self discovery, and it is up to the people around them to decide whether or not they will respect how that person wishes to be viewed and referred to as. I hope this made sense and provided some clarity. Overall, I personally have come to an understanding that if people are not harming anyone else, then do things like clothing, pronouns, gender, or sexuality labels really matter THAT much just to release more negative energy towards people? If we all are just living side by side with respect for one another then I think we are doing pretty okay :)

[@TCakes]

It is unhealthy. The reason this nonsense even gained so much traction is social media. I guarantee you that it never would have been a thing if constant external validation wasn’t at your fingertips 24/7

[@kn7833]

The answer is its different for everyone. And the more we realize that there are so many variations and combinations of humans maybe you and others will explore (and accept) your own variations.

[@taechimyoonkookie8647]

Bingo!

[@jennam8401]

'would you date someone with male genitals?' 'I am progressive so I am open-,minded' - to be 'progressive' now do we need to be open to all people sexually? Why can't we just be attracted to who we want to be? Wasn't that the mantra of the LGBT community in the first place? Feels we have come full circle.

[@shacharrachmany1102]

That's because a lot of people nowadays got rid of the idea of borders completely to the degree that you're not allowed to make definitions because if the definition of something is X that means you "exclude" anything that isn't X. Men SHOULD be excluded from women spaces tho for example. There is a great book about that and more by Thomas Sowell called 'Discrimination and Disparities'.

[@DasRaetsel]

Listen to Julia at 17:21. She addresses exactly what you are saying in that you can be progressive while also having a preference. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

[@dudeorduuude5211]

"Progressive" is sneaky, false advertising. These people aren't progressive, they are religious. They preach, shame, try to annoyingly convert, pearl clutch, and have a limited dogma they follow. It isn't moving forward, it is too culty for that.

[@LeviShawando]

@@DasRaetsel Disagree. If you say you're a lesbo but then date guys, by definition you're not a lesbo but bisexual. Being open-minded doesn't give you license to contradict.

[@6thgraderfriends]

@@LeviShawandoRight? There are already words and definitions for the stuff they're doing. It's not new to be bisexual or pansexual, just say you're that if that's what you are.

[@leviolson3977]

I didn’t like Ambers “you’re privileged” attacks. Her statements were being questioned and she immediately dismissed it as not being able to understand/privileged. It came across as some sort of superiority complex.

[@danielled.2169]

it's a defense mechanism to try and "check" the other person. In order to have an opinion, one must first humble themselves and go through some struggle session.

[@jayterra2060]

@@danielled.2169it’s rehashing CRT theory. Not a test. Intersectionalism is a hallmark of what kids are learning now.

[@TheVerucAssault]

Also she's not underprivileged if her father was an American football player. Just checking out her mom looks white, not Hispanic which makes the whole "you present differently than me" thing laughable. Here's hoping people like her that still fling this word around see the error in their mental gymnastics and put more of their time into something that logically makes sense instead of participating in Oppression Olympics.

[@15jewjew]

The problem is she has a darker skin complexion and a course texture. She's gonna be more of a target than someone who looks white at first glance. Things are a bit more complicated, but at it's core I think that's what she was getting at.

[@racheljane_]

It is. This whole worldview doesn’t deal with actual arguments, it focuses on deflecting and diminishing people depending on what class they are in.

[@RB2013-jj7kq]

"there are So mAnY lAwS aGainSt Us!" "ok show Me" " I cAn'T "😂😂😂

[@daveh9941]

“I have a list for you” then proceeds to not even mention one law

[@ellixrose2650]

I consider myself progressive, but I think we're going in the wrong direction when words stop having meanings.

[@FatalCroissant]

What do you mean?

[@meganw-w3725]

100%!!!

[@yvonnecorvette777]

.

[@youtubeposter3814]

@@FatalCroissantThat the word woman has no inherent meaning, being defined only as people who identify as it. That extreme of inclusivity causes the word to lose virtually all of its descriptive power.

[@kn7833]

​@youtubeposter3814 are you scared people won't know your gender ? Or are you scared that people who don't look like you identify as the same gender as you? If so how does that negatively impact you ?

[@Yungkingstonn]

Amber talking about "privilege" when her father is a literal millionaire LOL

[@eat.food.not.friends]

But she doesn't have "white privilege"! In my case "white privilege" means that I grow up with an alcoholic father, and literally no money, in a very small flat. But somehow I have more privilege than her because she's black!?

[@edricducusin8993]

Damn

[@jordanweber3381]

You're allowed to have privilege and also acknowledge privilege. We also don't know what was edited out.

[@mcwompwomp]

@@jordanweber3381mental gymnastics

[@Yungkingstonn]

@@jordanweber3381 She didn't acknowledge her own privilege, she played victim and acted like everyone else in the room had more privilege than her. She's out of touch.

[@britneygehrts722]

I absolutely love Becky! She seemed genuinely interested in trying to have those conversations and truly wanting to reach that middle ground. She spoke her truth, asked questions, and didn't speak on things that she didn't have adequate information on.

[@kriswatson932]

She was fantastic. Concise, articulate, and did not speak emotionally. I also agree with her on every point (I think).

[@Whynot-xi7mu]

​@@kriswatson932i don't agree with her on every point, but she was in fact amazing at this debate

[@Faolan42]

"She spoke her truth"? what is true is true for everyone. Becky knows nothing about biology and spouted her ignorance as though what she thought was a fact.

[@leeto5920]

As a straight male that’s into only woman,Becky seems like a dope and informative friend...would love to converse with her one day ...pretty dope

[@Aubrey2004-j4k]

@@leeto5920exactly she doesn’t have a victim mentality, she is well informed and she doesn’t interrupt.

[@Heliaenglish]

That pink hair girl is not lesbian ,now she has boy friend with a huge age gap

[@sunsetblossomart629]

Fr?

[@karolshayan5421]

No way. Im in shock. Actually no.

[@Heliaenglish]

@@sunsetblossomart629 yes

[@julia-ex7im]

@@sunsetblossomart629 her previous wife was at 30 years+ older than her too

[@sevroaubarca8678]

plus another participant of this video commented of reddit that she was allegedly already seeing her new boyfriend when they shot this

[@cieronore]

I don't understand the logic of classifying yourself as something, but also thinking that the term should be so inclusive that it doesn't exclude anything. Isn't the point of categorisation to exclude things outside its boundaries?

[@吹息-x9h]

I think fundamentally it stems from the idea that category is unimportant (thus think there is no concrete boundaries to any category), but at the same time want to distinguish oneself from those one dislikes or want to be separate from.

[@B_Bodziak]

As kids they feel alone and knowing there are others like you, brings some normalcy.

[@trustkibou]

​@@吹息-x9h I find it contradictory to say "categorization is unimportant" and then categorize for a purpose.

[@boogie0413]

I’m so confused because the comment was made “labels don’t matter as much anymore” but they will also call people “phobic” if they’re accidentally misgendered? I’m so confused 😵‍💫

[@melaniegarrett8625]

That's too much logic lol 😅

[@ClaireSamuelsVA]

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="2441">40:41</a> If pronouns don’t equal your gender, how does using the wrong pronouns misgender someone?

[@ana..a.]

thats what im saying bro these people dont even know what theyre talking abt yet say how theyre more educated in all these topics 💀😭😭

[@Momo-po5tn]

Girl the delussssion

[@ebbypetes]

Confusion of the highest order 😂😂😂😂😂

[@ShaawtyB]

Yo 💯😂😂😂

[@El-iw6xn]

Pronouns don’t have to equal your gender, they’re just words, misgendering is based on the meaning behind the word you use. Sounds like a paradox but that’s just how all language is, it’s the meaning behind it that can make it misgendering or not. Hope that’s clear.

[@Christa.steiner7]

“My sexuality has nothing to do with the way I believe our government should be spending our taxes.” This I LOVE

[@catheroni]

I loved this. I'm not particularly conservative but this idea that because of our sexuality we should have a rigid set of beliefs and act in a certain way, is absolutely ridiculous.

[@ELmayberry]

yesss 👏🏽👏🏽

[@gingerelle1]

It does if those tax dollars are spent creating legislation for hate groups to masquerade their tirade against queer people (see: Florida and its Don't Say Gay legislation".

[@mojochay]

But it does when it directly funds things that harm us and/or does not fund to help us whatsoever even when we need it

[@Kiidomaru]

Wait when was this? Timestamp?

[@PumaSchatz07]

Someone needs to make a chart to visualise how much speaking time this one person takes up

[@Popartastic]

I'm a tired lesbian. (tired of terfs)

[@sagen06]

So quit?

[@Heejinsbiggestfan]

real

[@Heejinsbiggestfan]

@@sagen06 quit what?

[@kleomarx8390]

ask @Jessica Kirson

[@yourlocallesbian6448]

I'm a tired lesbian too tried of the LGBTQ

[@nonmorto3563]

I’ve followed a few of these women online for some years from both sides, that being said none of them came across as very politically literate. I think a problem in a lot of these jubilees is they always choose influencers and content creators instead of people that actually know what they are talking about.

[@djgeneralbounce]

I understand why they choose content creators because its a KZbin show and content creators are essential to bring in the viewers. But they choose far too many that have barely lived a life outside the online and/or activist space.

[@harley656]

yeah it’s true. i’ve tried to go onto one a couple years ago and you had to have a minimum follower amount on instagram lol

[@once.upon.a.time.]

@@harley656 that's nuts!

[@muffinszss]

Julia was probably the most level-headed and respectful person here.

[@Sunshine-is_here_to_stay]

She wasn't the most level headed. But she was definitely respectful.

[@a.cdiamonds8370]

Nah Becky was the most level headed

[@gomoestas]

Loved her❤

[@marvinmiller2983]

I think Becky and Pamela were more level-headed and respectful than her, but she was the most respectful on the liberal side.

[@romanistagio6991]

I didn't understand her point when she said that men have it harder because is misogyny and the expectation to be "more butch" ? If someone who understood can explain what she meant ?

[@radishmoomoo2471]

Ariellle is so arguementative and Amber is a proffessional victim. Nazreen is deluded, you cant be non binary and a lesbian. The rest of them we’re respectful and handled disagreement maturely

[@Olivia-bl8ez]

Regarding single lesbians being able to adopt... the same is true for single straight women. If you are a single mom to one child and want to adopt another child so they can be siblings, it is nearly impossible. Typically adoption agencies only adopt to couples whether straight or gay.

[@Random-sk6hm]

Interesting I was wondering this

[@Bella-qu5pf]

Single women can foster though! Just to atleast put that out there so people know they can still be involved in improving a childs life.

[@Mosie926]

My straight aunt adopted 2 children with no problem 3 years apart(she decided she wanted another child), the process only took a couple of months. My female cousin was 15 months and the male cousin was 16 months. It took me 5 years to be able to adopt my youngest son(I have 3 biochildren) as a Lesbian.

[@Olivia-bl8ez]

@@Mosie926 interesting my husbands mom was a single mom and tried for years to adopt him a sibling with no success. His sister went through the same thing. She tried before 10 years before giving up as a single woman. They both have great careers so it’s nothing with that

[@xoxo-k2z]

@@Olivia-bl8ez Yeah, It depends on the agency. Some do prefer married couples, especially international agencies but some don't. However some agencies do like to see that you have a village, like grandparents and adult siblings.

[@Kirsty_Leanne]

Amber screaming about privilege whilst having a multimillionaire father is sending me Edit: YES there are different forms of privilege. NO she is not a victim of them.

[@JULSIEK]

who is her father?

[@JR_Donofrio]

@@JULSIEKthat’s what I want to know

[@nicola19cola100]

Omg does she lmao

[@Kirsty_Leanne]

She’s the daughter of a professional football player.

[@themichiganderlesbians]

having privilege doesn’t mean you don’t experience bad things, having privilege means you aren’t disadvantaged by what you’re not. amber is the only person in the room who is a black and masc, all of the other women have a privilege that they don’t face oppression for that. amber has privilege bc she’s rich, they’re all privilege bc they’re able bodied, and attractive. but all of them do not have the privilege of being heterosexual. you get it now?

[@sweetlolitaChii]

The term "non-men" needs to go out the back door. Somebody escort it, please.

[@Gchildwarrior]

Take it behind the shed too

[@sambatra6162]

frr

[@NuurKal]

Why should it? a lesbian is a non men loving a non men.

[@Amatureb]

No way I'm 'escorting' it. That term doesn't deserve that respect. I'm grabbing it by the collar and chucking it outside.

[@sevenheavens-gj9qq]

Agreed.

[@jennclose4604]

Everything after the B is ideology... not sexuality.

[@tuffcookie100]

🎉 yes.

[@cathcath1324]

Exactly what they used to say about the LGB

[@tuffcookie100]

@@cathcath1324 the lack of education is showing. Troll somewhere else.

[@cathcath1324]

@@tuffcookie100 sorry you think facts is trolling.

[@tuffcookie100]

​@@cathcath1324give me proof of what you're saying so that you can say you're not a troll because trust me sweetheart that was my minor in University do not get me started all of you guys and yes it's a blanket statement are crazy when we present facts you go against it

[@thinkhaven7902]

‘Non men liking non men’. Wow. The amount of hate you have to feel to erase the term woman from the definition of lesbians.

[@_______5345]

I mean gay folk would just be considered non women liking non women. How exactly is that hateful and who twords?

[@LibraTransitioned]

I don't think that's hate. From a non-binary lesbian here.

[@awoooga5857]

​@@_______5345I would slap anyone that refers to me as a nonwoman.

[@pyrettablaze4325]

@@_______5345 because it’s typically just women who have their vocabulary erased

[@Earth2ash311]

@@_______5345since when is “gay folk” a non woman

[@steve-hp3uq]

Becky is one of the most well spoken people ive ever seen come on this show. Props to her, she has a gift.

[@capkronos00]

She has a great gift for throwing other LGBT+ under the bus because she's self-interested and greedy.

[@McKaRm3L]

Agreed 👏🏽

[@DeadboltDame]

I thought the same of Sarah on the trans conservatives vs trans liberals video.

[@tricialemon]

@@DeadboltDameyes! Loved Sarah!

[@jessicagillLasVegas]

Amber : "You Can't use a small % of Detransitioners as an example of a community" Also Amber: " What about the small % of intersex people" This "Cherry picking" is why society is pushing back against this New progressive movement.

[@russellsprout7480]

Oh it's because people try to say "Transitioning is unsafe, look at how many people detransition" when the percentage is actually quite small. So saying "Hey, that percentage is actually quite small" is relevant to the conversation. Whereas "What about the small percentage of intersex people" is meant to point out that gender, as we know it, isn't 100% black and white and there are inbetweens. :) So saying "Hey, that percentage is actually quite small" is irrelevant to the conversation, because the point isn't the amount, it's the fact that they exist. You could say "the point isn't the amount, it's the fact that they exist" about detransitioners, but the problem is every surgery has risks, and talking about detransitioning as if it's a common thing is dishonest. (At least this is as far as I understand it, let me know your thoughts. Also I'm sorry I don't know how to make this more concise :,))

[@jessicagillLasVegas]

@@russellsprout7480 You Totally Made your point just fine. I just want people to understand that there are A lot more Detransitioners than 1% Latest numbers that are being reported is 8%. And I can tell for sure that the Reddit community of Detransitioners is over 51,000 people. And many more that are DEtransitioning quietly Because of the Backlash And fear of being Treated even worse. I'm also pointing out that Amber is a Bad representation of the Liberals, her Overuse of word "Privilege" Is why Society is Losing Acceptance of the LGBT community.

[@Vitasaurus]

​@@jessicagillLasVegas but a lot of people have to detransition because they're not accepted so even people who would stay in their transition if they were accepted by the people around them are still factured into that statistic of detransitioners (sorry if i worded this in a weird way that's hard to comprehend, i can see that it's quite a wordy explanation)

[@jessicagillLasVegas]

@@Vitasaurus I wouldn’t deny that what you said has happened, I can tell you it’s my experience that no outside force would ever be responsible for causing me to “Detransition” So you saying that really affirms my belief that a majority of the people who are claiming that they are “Trans” where not trans but merely following the trans trend that is sweeping the world currently.

[@elenawilliams32]

The number of detransitioners is vastly underestimated as there's no community lists or tracking of how many used to identify as trans then changed their mind. Also, they are more often excluded and ridiculed by the trans community. And from the people I've heard speak it's not often rejection of family or lack of support. Some simply grow up and think differently.

[@raihanmahajana3579]

"labels dont matter as much" if this isn't the most ironic line i've ever heard, i dont know what is 😂😂😂

[@ginismoja2459]

Never in a millions years did I ever thought I'd one day be a "conservative". Mind you, my views have hardly changed much. The world has gone bonkers. I've watched both Arielle and Julia for years and years and it's weird to see this now. Also, "NON-MEN"? Seriously? That has to be one of the most misogynistic things I've heard.

[@maximilian6829]

I’m with you. The non men thing is crazy, it’s bizarre how you never hear “non woman” when referring to men.

[@trexpanda]

And the people who use "non-men" are usually the ones screaming about how oppressed women are.

[@Momo-po5tn]

Saying nonmen is so misogynistic

[@lilyoh5780]

if your views stay the same while the world is changing and evolving, than you are, in fact, a conservative. that's literally what that word means. Also, how could Arielle possibly be not referred to as a conservative? She checks all the boxes?

[@Momo-po5tn]

@@lilyoh5780 claiming women are "nonmen" isnt progressive its REGRESSIVE

[@kiwikatzkey]

I’d like to see a panel with pansexuals and bisexuals

[@yumisokks]

yessss i'd love to see that but at the same time i'm afraid of what may come out of it 😭

[@michaelregis1015]

Have you ever seen that meme where different spidermen are pointing at each other? That would be hilarious I'm not going to lie.

[@kiwikatzkey]

@@michaelregis1015 you know damn well with the people jubilee brings this is NOT going to happen 😭

[@violetluverie]

Pansexuality doesn’t exist

[@Lindsay--uh8zo]

@@yumisokks frr omggg

[@dorasegall8645]

Amber saying "I am the friend of yours that can no longer support you" and happening to know the conservative lady is the most Lesbian thing I've ever seen.

[@yoop4322]

why the most lesbian thing

[@joilisch]

@@yoop4322 it's the whole "small community" thing, people know eachother and have drama.

[@wbbb1256]

I’ve watched the gay liberals vs gay conservatives before this and one of the topics were “should the lgb and tq+ be separated” and this video is a perfect example of why they should be separated because 90% of the video they aren’t talking about lesbian issues, they’re talking about trans issues.

[@Michael-kf7gm]

Becky is a boss! She explains her side so eloquently and respectfully.

[@lilitboyadjian9019]

no fr

[@arashf6094]

Becky was well spoken for sure

[@LimitedEditioneo]

She’s the only one on the conservative side with a brain.

[@yolandaponkers1581]

I liked Becky way more Arielle. She was too obnoxious and she wasn’t at all listening.

[@briesullivan883]

And Arielle!

[@autumngeorge3255]

I love how Nazreen and Becky present themselves throughout this discussion. Though they clearly disagree with the opposite side, they always managed to maintain their composure and to be polite, without raising their voice or interrupting. It's really beautiful to see.

[@forestwizard1483]

There is nothing wrong with being passionate about your views. Being a soft little mouse isn't something to worship. It is something that shows weakness.

[@tima2553]

@@forestwizard1483no actually. You think you should be loud and assertive so ppl wouldn’t think you’re weak? You never will win an argument like that. Being calm & kind is what ultimately touched people’s heart & wins. Also, no one is worshiping no one here.

[@jessicamarcus5158]

They did speak respectfully, and it felt like they listened with open ears. They both made direct points and didn't talk in circles. I'm all for being passionate but when it's not backed with facts and listening to just react, that is not helping to keep an open dialog.

[@UmbraFox6]

@@forestwizard1483 From my understanding, them practicing proper conversational skills is no less passionate than the others who are being disrespectful by interrupting and raising voices lol.

[@matthewmcalister2165]

I can’t stand Nazreen because identifying as both a lesbian and non-binary is contradictory

[@laphroniarose6141]

As a woman wth PCOS, who produces more testosterone than the average woman, we are not inherently intersex, like Amber claims, some women may experience a more androgynous appearance, but we are not intersex.

[@zen-zen191]

Totally agree!!

[@atlas89]

Amber absolutely did NOT claim that women with PCOS are intersex. She even brought up that she herself has a large amount of testosterone compared to most women. Point being, that doesn’t make you or her any less of a woman. Her entire agenda revolves around accepting trans women, intersex woman, masculine women, etc. as women. Regardless of whether you agree with that, you have some severe comprehension problems if you genuinely thought THAT was the point she was making...

[@laphroniarose6141]

​@atlas89 anyway she's comparing women who are masculine or have PCOS with trans women, which is a dumbass argument lmao. Evaluate your own comprehension skills first babe 👌

[@Nikkeishajk]

​@@atlas89trans women ARE NOY WOMEN. They ate pseudowomen at best

[@hopebahr13]

Sex, gender and sexuality are all on a binary. But not many realize that. Especially when they don't know how to research genetics, etc. Or do research in general on how that body may or may not work.

[@maryclairefoley8675]

As a masc presenting older Gen Z lesbian who was openly a lesbian at the age of 12/13, I have NEVER experienced discrimination. Maybe I’ve heard some rude comments online, but that’s it. I’m a masculine, lesbian woman, in a male dominated field (engineering) and my colleagues and peers have never made me feel any different. I wasn’t even ridiculed in 8th grade! No one batted an eye.

[@grapepanta96]

That's great for you, but someone could have a different experience based on where they live. For example a more conservative area with more religious people.

[@sunsetblossomart629]

That’s amazing, but we have to remember that peoples experiences differ based on the environment that they are in, as well as intersectionality and how it leads to discrimination (the experience of a white lesbian woman is different than a disabled brown lesbian woman).

[@jzen1455]

@@grapepanta96 True we all have different lived experiences, but you can still step outside yourself and deduce trends and probabilities.On the whole, gay men are more likely to experience discrimination, bullying, and physical attacks than lesbians.

[@emmayates9309]

If you are being denied rights, you better know what they are.

[@daligogh1]

This is the one

[@Momo-po5tn]

💯

[@renny6151]

Lesbianism has never been criminalized in the UK and many other parts of the world, while gay men were illegal and punished with death. Lesbians are the most privileged in LGBT.

[@abcelu]

Arielle is the type of person who comes for a debate and thinks she's gonna win rather than trying to reach a middle ground

[@Sunshine-is_here_to_stay]

She seemed very reasonable & level headed.

[@1love847]

Her tone of voice is completely grating on my nerves.

[@symuelleleones]

She's fed up to all these new rules and nonsensical ideas.

[@meowy4720]

Who even cares about a "middle ground"? That's not the point of debating.

[@AmalSaidi123]

@@Sunshine-is_here_to_staynot when she brought up palestine

[@cblynn8295]

Calling women "non-men" is so offensive

[@evepoole3966]

No it's not

[@ahogesupremacy]

but they're not men. is the english not clicking for you?

[@xanander4693]

@@evepoole3966💀

[@kenburns4017]

so you’re saying women are men ?

[@chatminou4058]

exactly. Im a woman. We don't call men non-women for the same reason unless were all just non-men and non-women. @@ahogesupremacy

[@joshuahorne8220]

Losing brain cells on a daily basis

[@aaronmargerum5745]

Christians, Jews, and Muslims. I’d love to see a Middle Ground with all the Abrahamic religions

[@secularbabe]

That’s gonna be one crazy video lol

[@faeezparkar9731]

We are done with abhramic religions, want to see more eastern religions now

[@hair4571]

@@faeezparkar9731 eastern religions aren’t really controversial so there won’t be much drama there

[@erenjaeger1738]

They did like few years ago

[@camm8642]

Oh dear....

[@paigeangel2172]

Would be interesting to see non-religious pro-life vs. Christian pro-choice.

[@ughhhmcrbinch5583]

whats the point of that. the pro lifers wouldnt use religion as an argument and the christians might or might not. what argument will there really be other than heartbeats and brains.

[@GothixTV]

There is no such thing as Christian pro-choice.

[@littlelemon1783]

id love to see this

[@Elisarouyt]

one would be following the bible and one wouldnt so theyre hardly Christians lol

[@isenfirecat]

@@ughhhmcrbinch5583 maybe a philosophical argument on pain/sentience. i mean it's always interesting to less-usual combinations of values in a debate, and they'll probably be able to find folks from both sides

[@mikasasukasa4479]

The rich daughter is bored and wanting to play victim while the rest of these ladies have real struggles. I'm glad she was there, so we can see how ridiculous these loudmouths are.

[@irocss85]

As is every person in America screaming about oppression. We are all born with American privilege. Her privilege is pretending she is oppressed. People who are actually oppressed don't have the freedom to cry about it.

[@mikasasukasa4479]

@@irocss85 i love when someone is non-white, gay, and female telling me how oppressed they are when they have many privileges in their life. im american with mexican blood and ive had my fair share of encounters of people telling me too much of their business like they want special attention or something. im technically a minority but im not here whining about oppression lol.

[@EdgarRavenTransmedTranssexual]

Everyone in the Jubilee debate has privilige

[@arigoodfriend1762]

that one conservative woman was so openly rude, Jubilee be better at choosing your candidates plz

[@jordanbeau7348]

"nonman loving nonman" made my blood boil as a lesbian. Can you imagine if we did this to gay men? "Nonwoman loving a nonwoman" there would be actual teeth and claws. This is why i just say im same-sx-attracted and leave it at that. 🤷‍♀️

[@cyncblt]

We do do this to gay men! Hope this helps!

[@luna3delrey]

lesbians are women attracted to women point blank period

[@goodbye6676]

Why are you making this a gendee thing women need to tell the lgbt community to knock it off

[@Yungkingstonn]

@@cyncblt nonbinaries cannot be Iesbians

[@izmyster763]

@@cyncbltno y’all don’t lmao never in my life have i seen that compared to the millions of ppl referring to lesbians as non men loving non men lmaoo now stfu

[@aml___3918]

"I personally would date a transwoman, but I don't think it's transphobic not to want to." (<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1040">17:20</a>)

[@steminist4517]

She is so well spoken

[@TeenageDirtbag8]

Cool

[@user-kv1zf6jp8q]

@NotVille_ this was funny because it wasn’t funny

[@erenjaeger1738]

Cause that makes u bi if u then XDlike bruh

[@SeraphinaRivera]

As a trans person myself, I will never attack anyone or be upset if they dont want to date a trans person. You are not transphobic for not wanting to.

[@bree9549]

Really wish in the last prompt they dived into how gay men are more socially accepted because of the fact that they’re attracted to MEN! attraction to men is taken seriously while women ONLY liking women? oh baby men will try and say they can ‘change’ you. bisexual women are seen a straight & bisexual men are seen a gay. common denominator is attraction towards men. lesbians are seen as somebody who can possibly still change and like men. its gross.

[@yesplatinum7956]

They’re more socially accepted in that sense but they also face more judgement as their sexuality usually is seen as a bigger part of their life and because men have a lot more pressure to fit into what is considered manly

[@yesplatinum7956]

But I don’t think it’s because their attracted to men I think it’s because they’re men and female sexuality is not takes as seriously as mens

[@yesplatinum7956]

And also because women are a lot more accepting and willing to identify as lgbt

[@yesplatinum7956]

I mean the neo pronouns uses are almost always afab

[@gie3973]

This is so false. Socially speaking? Lesbians are way more accepted.

[@allisonfagan3835]

Really didn’t like how Arielle was immediately combative. I felt like that really set the tone for the whole discussion and took it from an opportunity to learn to a long argument

[@andiman44]

She doesn’t really seem that interested in finding a middle ground.

[@averytalton6789]

​@andijackson3311 she's not. Never has been, she's been on social media for years doing "debates" and always refuses to accept new information or opinions

[@rpm7997]

No she's not interested in being combative, she's telling as it is. I strongly disagree that she's being combative. I watch her KZbin channels and she's telling it as it is.

[@erenjaeger1738]

*Lesbian when they finally talk to each other*

[@impressionare3243]

@@erenjaeger1738 You're obsessed w lesbians in these comments 💀. Your crush must have been gay and you're mad you got no chance.

[@kaileys3462]

I loved Becky. She articulated her thoughts so well and always remained super calm and respectful.

[@mandolindavenport1737]

Yeah she actually spoke slowly. I was impressed.

[@Right_Direction_]

I love her. She really came across so well and balanced.

[@DKsilverghost]

Remember when middleground was about two groups of people actually finding common ground and not just dramatic debates with people talking over each other and being aggresive.

[@SP-mf9sh]

Not with women and lesbians. Gay men are more civil.

[@JayOkok]

What I've learned, use the word privledge as defense and answer to anything and everything that disagrees with you

[@bobbiedonald2977]

Amber and her buzz word "privilege" is disgusting tbh. How she can fail to see that LGBTQ ppl have MORE PRIVILEGES than straight ppl??

[@kennarose2133]

Leave it to Jubilee to find the one person that ruins the conversation 🥸

[@homeslice4551]

Who was it in your opinion?

[@deancontiwriter13]

they had to go and find Arielle didn't they

[@amirrhodesve791]

​@@deancontiwriter13becuass you think freedom of speech shouldn't be a thing I guess??? You think everyone must agree with what you're saying. Lmao.

[@kennarose2133]

@@homeslice4551 IMO, I made the comment in regards to Arielle. The way she spoke made it feel as though she was combative from the start, despite her being “open minded.” She calmed down throughout the conversation which should be appreciated! As the video progressed, it could also be Amber as she explained with nuance thinking. IMO she was not well spoken with the ideas she was trying to convey. While we’re discussing it, I think Julia should receive more praise for her level-headedness during this conversation and her ability to articulate her ideas while maintaining the conversation. 😁

[@kennarose2133]

@@amirrhodesve791 I don’t think they meant it in that way. Despite being called Middle Ground, Jubilee loves to find extremists on both sides (probably for views) that love to derail the conversation. The point isn’t to make the other side *fully* understand, it’s to find a middle ground both sides can agree on. It defeats the purpose when someone isn’t looking to agree or is just using the platform to push their views/gain views for their platform.

[@societaldecay]

Every time Amber starts losing an argument, she calls it privilege as a cop out.

[@gracegriffith4740]

It’s infuriating

[@martynaarmycaratengene7216]

Every single time Sasha opens her mouth to say literally anything - Amber starts using the world "privilege" in every sentence

[@maryhostern1439]

I was looking for this comment, finally someone else sees it!

[@Warlock12347]

because conservatives have 0 concept of what that means and how it applies to them, especially within the conversation they were having.

[@lanaxrey]

@halloweenallyearround4889she is tho lmao

[@MarissaCastanedaOfficial]

Just because Sasha didn't agree with Amber, Sasha was immediately called "privileged." Sasha literally is a minority too.

[@tylerfarr5959]

The way that Sasha responds does give off that maybe she is privileged. IMO she’s like the only one on that side who wasn’t really trying to have a conversation and just repeat her views which kind of goes against what this is about.

[@cherrypandas]

i’ve literally agreed with everything the girl with purple hair has said and done in this video, she’s so real

[@nataliefletcher]

Amber answering everything with “you haven’t lived like I’ve lived”, “you don’t present like I do” and “for you to say that is a privilege” completely discounts everyone else’s opinions and experiences and centres it fully on her own. All of their experiences are valid and this “it’s a privilege” retort is so overused and tiring

[@amde8554]

Amber is so involved in her own identity she refuses to actually listen to anyone with a differing view

[@jmix504]

Agreed that all experiences are valid. However, Amber did not have a chance to elaborate on why she called Sasha “privileged.” That word was triggering enough to Sasha, Arielle, etc. that they didn’t let her speak after that. They talked over her. Didn’t give her a fighting chance to explain.

[@nataliefletcher]

@@jmix504 yeah people need to let each other speak but this was Amber’s only defence - throughout the whole video. She was discounting their experiences

[@jmix504]

@@nataliefletcher that was her only response that you know of. Remember that this is a well edited conversation that probably went on another 30 min - hour. Who’s to say this wasn’t edited meticulously so that folks who aren’t aware of what privilege actually entails would comment 1000x on how Amber used privilege more than once to describe Sasha’s experience as a lesbian.

[@EKSforlife]

@@The1Waiter-gk4sz respectfully Blossom is in a class of her own.

[@HeyMatthewBK]

They really need more mediation in these debates. There was so much discussion, arguing, and back and forth between the other people that Pamela did not get to even say a word (that we saw) until like half-way through the debate. It got to a point where I was wondering if she was even going to say anything.

[@THEalishahnator3000]

Which one is pamela tho??

[@haysfut]

@@THEalishahnator3000she was in the red black and white shirt with the short hair

[@Chadceeka]

"What they EDITED OUT: when we called out Amber on the privilege talk. Did you know Ambers dad was in the NFL and she went to private school her whole life? Nope, because they edited out to help her continue being a victim."

[@AJ-lm5dl]

Oof

[@theapex1762]

She was saying not being able to see another persons point of view and empathize with that is privilege cause it is you’ve been sheltered to the point where you believe someone else’s reality is just an anomaly or just straight up not real

[@Chadceeka]

@@theapex1762 No, she was saying the other people she was arguing with were privileged solely due to their skin color whilst being more privileged herself. The average dipshit lefty tactic

[@mitrigash3519]

wait who said that?

[@uwishuknewnunya7845]

FACTS

Arielle is very rude and disrespectful. Interrupts instead of listening.