Masculinity, Men and Feminism with Daniel J. Layton | Hannah Witton

[@CaitlinPlant]

The problem with quoting the "statistically, men get raped less" bit is that it isn't necessarily true. Men are exponentially less likely to REPORT sexual abuse/rape but it doesn't mean that it happens less. As a woman, I hate that men have been made to feel as though their pain and suffering is less than ours. I have two brothers and if anything ever happened to them and they felt like they needed to just "man up" and get through it on their own I would be furious. This relates to a lot of other things as well, but sexual abuse in particular does need to be a dialogue that exists for everyone, not just women. This was such a great video, though. Thank you to both you, Hannah, and Dan for being so open and honest in this discussion.

[@jenswurm]

Also, men who have conventional intercourse without consent (e.g. near blackout drunk) aren't defined as raped but merely as sexually assaulted. The definition of rape as currently being used in the US requires being passively penetrated. To be intentionally over the top, this means that a woman forcing a man at gunpoint to swallow viagra and to have sex with her does not count as raped but only as sexually assaulted, unless she uses a dildo on him.

[@johanneslidenberg2409]

men certainly get told "they can't get raped" or a "a woman can't rape a man".

[@bigguy2671]

@@johanneslidenberg2409 Yeah, my own mother told me that after I was. So since there was no point in talking about it cause my own mother said "Boys can't be raped" I had no choice but to let it happen for like 5 years.

[@ayushibhanja]

@@bigguy2671 It probably doesn’t mean much coming from a stranger on the internet, 5 years and 7 months late, but I am so sorry that happened to you. You did not deserve to have that happen to you, and you deserved to be believed. I really hope you’re doing okay and I’m so proud of you for being as strong as you have been, I’m only sorry that you had to be.

[@KoasterKing205]

I applaud you for saying this. It's annoys the hell out of me when people say things like that in regards to male victims.

[@eilidhdavidson8678]

Hannah Witton is a real life Hermione Granger

[@EmilyCooper-cf1qj]

Yesss instead of SPEW it's feminism

[@joshuajacobs2306]

No you're wrong.... Hannah is a hufflepuff

[@arminiusofgermania]

Minus 200 pts from griffindor.

[@zak-of-all-trades9638]

WHY has she never done a video with Emma Watson??

[@DanLayton]

Thanks for having me in this video! And thanks for the comments! But...why doesn't anyone care about MY necklace =(

[@DanLayton]

+Hannah Witton People don't seem to realise it's a fashion accessory...

[@swiftieanr9932]

+Daniel J. Layton afraid I only came down to the comments to say what a nice necklace Hannah has. Although I would not advise swapping fashion accessories... :p

[@BathroomJams]

Daniel J. Layton hahahah omg

[@thekillingduck]

yeah. that necklace that Hannah was wearing was pretty nice.

[@walterkirk6616]

dude what's with that beard? it starts on your face and ends on your chest! not being mean here just noticed that's all ; ] about Hanna's necklace seems to be the planets since I saw Saturn in gold there,I saw 8 shouldn't there be 9?

[@theaudiobookaficionado]

Your point about women being more free to experiment without being labeled as gay is kind of a double edged sword though, because it can be a huge problem for women who are ACTUALLY bi/pan/gay/etc. Women in the lgbt+ community have their identities denied by society a L O T.

[@HiThereItssophie]

yes!!! esp when ur a girl and work up the courage to come out as bi, only to be told your confused and bisexuality doesn't exist and/or ur experimenting. there's a lot of bi/pan erasure (I think that's the right word)

[@polkadotsocksable]

I think something that makes it more acceptable is the idea that 2 women being sexual is something that is considered 'hot' by a lot of men who are attracted to females. This is really well displayed by both the porn industry and main stream media. As someone who identifies on the bisexuality spectrum, that idea of my preferences not being taken seriously, as you said, is really frustrating

[@Tahonamaya]

+Meredith .D Exactly, it's like female experimentation is okay as long as women then go back to being straight. It's when you introduce the idea that that experimentation could lead to bisexuality, and society is a lot less comfortable with it because it's not "sexy" - it's actual people and not a porn fantasy.

[@lucyniven4467]

I completely agree!

[@PAJA63]

Yes. Society still values the "good girl" image too much. Only in recent years there's been a cultural opening up, with some role models taking on the "bad girl" image, meaning sending out a message of sexual agency (in contrast of being sexual objects). So women showing they can be horny, not being afraid to brave the risk of slut-shaming, will inch by inch create a larger place for female sexuality in society. And then the individual women (straight or lesbian) will have a better chance of being taken seriously with their identity. My two pence.

[@iLOVEpicklesBRO28]

I'm a trans man and socially, it's very strange. When I identified as female (kinda loosely if I'm being honest) people were completely okay with the fact that I'm a bit emotional and loving (I'm not a cryer, I just care about people and what they have to say. But now that I'm out, I'm fairly judged for it, implying that I'm not "good at being a man" for it. Even people who are otherwise very accepting!!! Also, since you guys mentioned it, another very weird thing to navigate is the fact that before I transitioned, I was sexually assaulted. Before anyone asks, no, my transition wasnt sparked by trauma, I had felt this before my assault. What's weird about it is I associate it as a feminine experience. I actually have trouble calling myself a male sexual assault victim, even though I am, because I was not identifying as male at the time and because my assaulter was a cishet man viewing me as a woman? Like he used very gendered speech towards me. It's strange.

[@natnipp]

Can I ask how you feel about the societal idea that in order to be accepted as the gender they are, trans people kind of have to encompass and personify every possible stereotype about their gender? Also, I'm sorry you had to deal with such a horrific experience :( As a cis woman I don't feel qualified to have an opinion on your internal conflict of "are you a male victim because you were female passing" but I'm sure there are lots of resources for you to talk about it, and I hope your recovery from that experience goes well

[@iLOVEpicklesBRO28]

+natnip the stereotypes are awful. We're held to a standard most cis people aren't put to, and it's really stressful to be me but also to be respected as a social, loving, kinda needy man when those are seen as feminine and thus make me "not really trans" 🙄

[@natnipp]

Nick S Yeah, that's what I thought, but then stereotypes just get ridiculous when you start talking about agender/gender fluid people because they're like.. supposed to be a perfect mixture of masculine and feminine? And just fuck gender norms really

[@natnipp]

***** That's called toxic masculinity Sid, and is caused by the Patriarchy™. You know, the thing which feminism is trying to take down?

[@skulay]

You are bringing logic and reason to argue with a feminist. LOL

[@poundlandvodka]

The whole "I support gay rights but I'm not gay, I support Black Lives Matter but I'm not black" etc thing reminds me of bell hooks' ideas; it doesn't matter how you identify, it's what you believe and what you fight for that constitutes who you are. In feminism, identity is not important - your political commitment is what matters. She basically argues that rather than saying "I am a feminist", it would be more accurate and helpful to say "I advocate feminism".

[@JayFlourishing]

As a trans guy (still in school) I come across these things daily. People always assume that because I am a trans guy, I am super duper "masculine" which is not the case! I like dance, drama, flowers, baking and other things that people assume are female only things. People don't seem to understand that. It is often seen as amazing when cis males try out make up for example, but if trans man do that, we often get asked if we are "going back" or if we "changed our mind" which is completely crazy! My masculinity is something that I think about often, and I often feel pressured not to speak about the things that are seen as feminine in front of people I don't know well! I really liked this video!

[@JayFlourishing]

+Hannah Witton It's okay!

[@haisesasaki3944]

Thank you so much for discussing this. I'm a guy and I always feel like I'm living in a paradox... how do I see myself and how other guys around me are. The thing is... a man is still considered a monster or a predator...like "all men care about is sex" or "men can't be sexually assaulted, they're the culprits" and there a very crimped space to express our feelings... people around us be like "you should do this... you have to that... a man isn't like that.. stop it.. you're a man, aren't you? "... whenever a guy express his feelings more than usual... society refuse it saying "this isn't what a man is". Even when someone's still a young boy, they defile his innocence with the idea "you should be a man, you should become this.. you have to do 1,2,3" I'm a human being... and I want to live.... I need to express my feelings and say what's inside without fearing being judged.. I don't need to try to lie to myself about the fact that I was sexually abused when I was young, pretending "this is what life is". I don't need to pack my feelings inside... and when I want a release I do cuts....

[@jesscostanza9460]

1) I totally didn't even notice this video when it was posted because I was busy with travel but it was so so so good. So super good. It's both settling and inspiring to see people have actual conversations that I myself have had-almost in a solidarity kind of sense. 2) "Sharing your experiences are the only ways that we will know these experiences exist," hit me so profoundly. Like I realize it's incredibly obvious, but even still, it made me think of both the way in which people attempt to discredit others' experiences and the call for diverse representation in both digital and physical media. this was A+ brain food

[@DTT240991]

Please have Dan back to speak about all those other issues! There were some fantastic ones there. So part 2, coming soon?

[@fionawilkes5866]

my parents (even, surprisingly, my mother) constantly put feminism down, i'd love to hear you discuss the older generation's relationship with feminism why they do/don't think it's important or how to handle it or how to make them understand that the new wave is here and it's important!!

[@biolinkstudios]

+Fiona Wilkes Because its not important its a waste of time, we don't have to worry about it, its better to just worry about yourself

[@fionawilkes5866]

i AM worrying about myself, that's why i need feminism

[@biolinkstudios]

Fiona Wilkes Lol but you don't,, why would one need that. its like needing religion

[@fionawilkes5866]

It's about quality of life, I can exist without religion because it neither adds nor detracts from my life (though for some people it does both). However, if I am not receiving the same rights as another human being or if I am expected to adhere to another's expectations of me, then my life is inherently worsened by that. True feminism (the equal rights of the sexes) is the only way to achieve equality and happiness. I'm afraid your opinion is very narrow-minded and I believe you are cutting yourself off from many wonderful experiences that allow everyone to be treated with the same respect that ought to be granted to all human beings. But if you are content with a life that favours one group of people over another, then I wish you well. But I do need feminism and I won't stop fighting for it until everyone has it

[@fionawilkes5866]

***** please tell me you agree!

[@oohcomma]

I feel like the too (in men get raped too) also implies that females shouldn't be talking about it because men deal with it as well, almost implying that the fact that men also struggle with it means it's unimportant. This is such a beautiful and extremely important video.

[@87wxdiaz]

its the fact that feminism says its for equallity of men and women but always brings up womens issues not mens issues and then when mens issues are brought up its usually thrown under the bus like you did just now... oh and its laughed at and sometimes its even looked at like "bro how can a woman rape you" " you gay" when he could have just been trying to be faithful to his wife or girlfriend or just not attracted to her, or maybe shes trying to steal his sperm so hes stuck paying child support for 18 years, which does happen. ahh lets not forget about prison jokes in movies tvs and media ... you say one rape joke about a women and feminist will call for you job but movies make fun of guys who get their teeth knocked out in prison to get raped and every one laughs... a women even claims rape and the mans life is ruined.... at least in usa it is idk about where your from... feminist are very anti male.

[@bananamanasaur]

Not enough videos like this that aren't in your face and make you feel horrible and are shouty. Great job

[@garyc]

Great video, I talked about this (from a gay perspective) in February. Though we often joke "masculinity so fragile" it sometimes really is x

[@StarMintaka]

+WAR KHAN Go away, you stupid himan being

[@imakedoodleslol]

I reallllly love discussions like this - wish there was more videos on it! thank you Hannah and Daniel :)

[@nandy9285]

I think it's important to note the different definitions of feminism. While it may seem obvious that it simply means equality for women, many modern day feminist exemplify their version of "feminism" with forms of vengeance, guilting masculinities, and affirmative action. Therefore, asking what men can gain from feminism might be reasonable given that many women today want to hurt men in addition to making women equal.

[@OhItsJustKim]

this is just all round, a really good video. A+

[@KatieFirthTheDiaryofaGinger]

after researching so I could give an informed view I discovered that international men's day is really awesome. essentially what I understand is it was form as an activist event to change paternity rights (joint/full custody to men that deserve it) and expanded to cover many more men's issues such as mental health, stereotypes etc. xxx

[@KatieFirthTheDiaryofaGinger]

+Russell Speed don't be abusive and ignorant. I meant men who should be govern custody aka most father's who arent abusive towards there children.

[@CooksBooks]

In regards to the lack of services for men, I have to agree. It's something that I see all of the time, websites and support groups such as rape helplines and domestic abuse services often are not targeted towards providing those much needed services towards men. As Dan said the statistic that domestic violence and rape happens less to men is true but that still is not necessarily beneficial to the conversation, regardless of how rare it is, men and women should feel equally able to reach out for support. For example, the national domestic violence helplines webpage does not even have a single page linking towards resources for men who suffer from domestic violence. It doesn't even seem to mention the fact that men can be abused, referring to the victim with female gender pronouns and the perpetrator with male gender pronouns. Clearly, an organisation should have the ability to specialise towards catering for men and women but the fact that they don't even mention it as a possibility seems to be a bit short-sighted. Also, in regards to the debate about the usage of the label feminism, whilst I would consider myself a feminist (because I support gender equality, which is the pure definition of the word), I do still have issues with it as a label. It's not an issue that I've seen many others have, as the majority of the debate of the word is that it doesn't include men, and so I could be misguided but my main issue is that it puts the focus on the male - female divide rather than including other non-binary genders in the same movement. Rights for transgender and non-binary people should also be included in the gender debate as they also suffer from a lot of the same issues but that debate and discussion is usually had separately making it seem like they are somehow different than binary genders.

[@LaytonObserves]

This was much more enjoyable than I thought it was going to be. I found myself answering the questions in my head as the video went along, and I think that's owing to how this discussion felt like just that - a discussion. Seeing more "safe spaces" being made to talk about all types of social issues is great I commend you two :)

[@Jess-uq2zy]

I love your necklace!!

[@lucialvk]

yes!

[@peaceloveandgranola]

Me too! I want it!

[@semicolon.advocate]

+

[@CherryyBombs]

Jess +

[@maddymacdonald2599]

+

[@bierce716]

An important discussion! Some of my experiences may be out of date, my being in excess of twice your age, but some things resonated greatly. Like the discussion of "Men get raped too! Yeah, but we're talking about women, we'll get to you later... and then later never happens." In my generation, when a man was raped- even if he was a boy of six- the response wasn't "Oh, God, how do you feel?", but "You lucky dog, getting laid that young!!". As to the male rates of suicide, I think that's a matter of training- at least here in the US, in my generation, we were introduced to guns in the Boy Scouts, and nearly every male over 18 owned one. So when men wanted to die, they didn't slash their wrists or take an overdose (primary female methods, which are more easily treated in Emergency Rooms), they stuck a gun in their mouths, which is much more effective.

[@arbee1958]

It's tricky as we older ones see that the feminist movement hasn't greatly benefitted families - yes women can now enter the workplace and be the breadwinners and be just as oppressed as men were. And now men can have the wife out working while he stays home and looks after the kids... except ... the flood of women into the workforce, the destruction of Unions and the 'Gig" jobmarklet - has led to a stagnation of wage rates ... so now it takes two working to keep a roof over the family's head. So that women who want to adopt the traditional female roles can no longer afford it and men can no longer easily be the sole breadwinner ... hard to see that everyone came out ahead in this deal

[@emmarsele]

13:05 When you tell a musical theatre joke and you're not sure the other person gets it.

[@nichiteandorina5916]

uhdhpg

[@mayblok]

Which song is it?

[@emmarsele]

+Maria Blok "Aquarius" from HAIR

[@tenhauser]

He's totally gay.

[@mayblok]

GentlemanDaemon Okay, so what? Instead of jumping into conclusions about someone else's sexuality, you could do something far more rewarding like learning physics, or read some Camus or anything. Dude, stop caring about other's sexuality and do something with YOUR life.

[@highlyhp]

I absolutely loved this video. I really needed to see something like this, and what an organic, honest, respectful dialogue. Please keep making content like this. It's informative, helpful, and necessary. Keep up the outstanding work!

[@habbynap]

Feminism is about women rights Egalitarianism is about equal rights Look at the definitions

[@MissStillAlive]

Great conversation, really good thoughts in there!I was going to leave a comment about how sweet it is and how nice that a man talks about feminism in this way, but then I felt like I was kind of diminishing his views because he's a man and men are typically not as involved in feminism and these conversations so it kind of feels like we have to give him a pat, well done. And that wouldve been shitty. So instead I'm going to say: I really enjoyed your conversation and getting a straight white males view on feminism and issues men are facing today, and I think they are very important to help us understand each other better and to work together instead of against each other. I talk with my little brother a lot about feminism and masculinity and it's honestly so insightful and helpful. Open the conversation!

[@emmawilkes7784]

I wish I could show this to some of the guys at my school who think feminism is a load of crap.

[@amyamyamy17]

Do!

[@robyourtime]

I watched this, and am even more convinced that feminism is utter crap.

[@elena-xj4uk]

+rob poynter just out of curiosity, why?

[@sio714]

+elena Just go listen to a couple episodes of +HoneyBadgerRadio (kzbin.info) & you'll be like: OH! YEAH. I get it. Feminism IS Crap. If that doesn't work go check out www.avoiceformen.com/activism/about/ It's this whole idea of "Happy Wife = Happy Life". That's not equality, ladies. That's blackmail.

[@Fridgeworks]

+elena As someone who enjoyed this video and still doesn't like feminism, my main reason is that the movement tries to co-opt things so much more than is necessary. To go by the definition of the word, you need to believe that women have less rights than men or to prioritize women's liberation over men's. For me, I just think that choosing a side is a silly proposition. Yes there are things such as inter-sectional feminism which do cover it, but I find that having a bang-on center political leaning (with a favour towards libertarianism and not liberalism) alot of the ideologies espoused under the banner of feminism are incompatible with some of my core beliefs. As they ask for more government overreach, dismantling of gender roles, equality of outcome and not opportunity, the concept of toxic masculinity basically calling for an end to a fair few of my hobbies (combat sport, hunting, guns), a perpetuation of false/misleading statistics to further an agenda (the wage gap one being a biggy), claiming one gender/race is more oppressed, acting like objectification is always 100% bad in every context and speeches like Emma Watson's (which could be summed up from my perspective as help women first to the detriment of yourself) it just doesn't work for me. I should not be co-opted by a movement because I agree with a single point of the issues it represents, that women should have LEGAL rights equal to men.

[@duckydae]

I feel with the rape conversation that, the two should be separate as experiences are relatively different. And I think for specifically women there is an entirely different conversation that men won’t experience with rape which is pregnancy. Also, men experience doubt from other people in different ways than women do. So, for a woman it’s: “What were you wearing?”, “Were you drunk?”, “Did you lead him on?” Whereas men typically get “Why didn’t you fight back?”. So for a women they question, “Were you asking for it?”

[@Norwaycat91]

I would love for Dan to take this onto his channel and invite another man and discuss these things as well. I think that could help open the conversation even more.

[@nicktaylor8771]

shut up

[@nicktaylor8771]

yes i would love for you to shut up and i know you will call me mysoganist but i just did thesame to a man some minuttes ago

[@yourarchnemesis8453]

go back to Norway.

[@Wisperwynd]

Really interesting video and I think the first one I've ever seen about this topic (at least that open and informative) and I'd love to see a second one! You had more bullet points you and Dan didn't go into, maybe that'd be great for another video? I liked the video a lot :)

[@maxjohnson1758]

Men have MGTOW. And that's all we need to "support" us.

[@LordSantiagor]

Funny how you need a support group to "go your own way". Group-think runs stronger than self reliance these days.

[@ImSupposedToSleep]

Great video! As a young, straight, cis woman, and feminist, I need more videos about this topic. I feel like I've gathered enough information about women's struggles to form my own general opinions etc and now there needs to be a focus on men's struggles because there's so much I need to be informed about. Thanks Hannah and Dan!

[@MySummer97]

this is so interesting! Thank you! Can you make more videos discussing these issues with men? I feel like this was really informative

[@brandonvendryes4917]

wait wait... he was a man?

[@dreamylittlethings]

This is excellent. Thank you two for making such an eloquent, kind and important video.

[@higgypop]

It's an interesting discussion. Masculinity and what it means to be a man has definitely changed while women have been changing. Like Dan in this video saying he cries. In the 1930 a father would hit his son for crying. Men also help around the home and treat women more like equals now, so there has been a shift. It's the same thing as race. There are campaigns like "black lives matter," not because white lives don't matter but because black people have been repressed historically, there's not really a need for white support groups. Women have been repressed in the past which is why they have and need a support network but men don't, or at least men don't feel like they need support groups but as you pointed out with you stats, they really do need support too. I guess one day, however long in to the distant future it might be, men and women won't need different support groups, that would be true equality, but sadly we're not there yet.

[@Chewitt321]

I don't think over masculinity has completely been dealt with, though. I think men would be more willing to deal with their emotions, and their social groups would be more supportive and there would be a greater will to discuss male issues and have men talk about their feelings. But we are still indoctrinated with the idea that men can't cry or show emotions or we're seen as weak. All our heroes seem to be fine in times of stress and that's how we're expected to be too.

[@user-td4do3op2d]

Black lives matter is an evil, racist group. The leader was recently under investigation for terrorist threats to kill white men.

[@higgypop]

+Joe Hewitt Yeah totally agree like, there's still a long way to go for men, and women and their rights.

[@RubyintheSky]

Having this conversation about feminism on all fronts is like we're doing the job of a computer coding. We just go on and on, we sharpen our tools and nuance our definitions and one glorious day we well hopefully be done (in terms of the world will be a wonderful equal place for all). I love how you never forget to point out your privileges and I think the both of you are representing feminism so well. Thank you

[@fredricholiver-bently8781]

I want to talk about female rape victims purely because my girlfriend is one. she was raped by an older man in her life when she was 14. we started dating when she was 21 and I didn't find out about this until about 6 months into us dating and I brought up how how sex wasn't apart of our relationship yet and started asking why that was and if that could change. I recall feeling very guilty for even saying that I wasn't happy with our lack of a sex life after she told me what had happened. I didn't think it fair for me to request something like this from her considering the circumstances. Obviously I understood why this was such a big deal for her and I allowed her to decide when sex would enter our relationship and that took another year after our conversation. That whole year she would apologise for not being able to give me what I wanted and continues to apologise when her PTSD gives her panic attacks because I caught her off guard or at a bad time. I think its important to discuss this because I feel physically ill towards my masculinity and how society has constructed female/male relationships. It makes me sad and angry when she feels the need to apologise as if sex is something she owes me and as if that's the main thing I gain from our relationship. I know she doesn't think those things about me on a personal level but since meeting her I have become acutely aware of what society tells men they are entitled to and it is absolutely shameful that we are taught to think we are entitled to sex.

[@biancayk]

Honestly adding that to the list of the best and most educational videos of yours❤️

[@ben_dark]

This was so fantastic, such a good conversation

[@MileySelenaChristina]

I'm so glad that we're bringing up this discussion!! More videos like this should be put up on the Internet.

[@EisforEvil]

As a non-feminist who watches and follows many anti-feminist, I enjoyed this video.

[@sallybutler9468]

This is a sensational video! To see two young people speaking in such an educated way about SUCH an important topic that is not being spoken about nearly enough! Men need feminising. My husband and I speak of this often. They need to be able to speak about feelings more, they need more health services addressed to them, they need help! You two are just inspiring and restore my faith in our generation. Thank you! Love from Australia!! xx

[@ZoeLeigh01]

I really wish you had talked about custody rights, I love talking about it, but I'm so glad you included what you did! This is another amazing video on feminism and I wish you would make this a series or something. These are the videos I adore seeing on my feed.

[@joshterryplays]

As a man who really enjoys your channel, I think it's awesome and want to confirm your thought that it's important that you address these subjects. I think there's a great potential for good when someone focused on feminism is eager to take the time to address men's issues, not because I think attention should be taken away from the important topics you already address, but because I think the men watching a feminist channel are probably men who are open and eager to grow in their own right. I watch your channel because I'm drawn to learn more about what I don't know. I want to learn about more innovative social thinking. I want to know women's thoughts and fears and strengths and opinions. I don't know that this automatically makes me a more decent fellow, but I do know that it inspires me to be more open to examining myself and it gives me a desire to grow personally, not just in my views towards women. I think I may not be alone in this among your male viewership. So I think providing opportunities for growth on the same platform that can make me more open in the first place is a pretty great thing :) I agree that masculinity needs to be allowed to change as well, for the sake of men and women. If feminism is demanding a particular change in men's behavior (an end to abuse, etc.), then how can that fully and positively happen if men's own view of masculinity doesn't align with the new, healthier feminist ideals? Because let's face it, some pretty evil things have sometimes been considered positive masculine traits by misguided people. Masculine and feminist views need to work together for either to be fully embraced. On the men's side of things, if our view of masculinity doesn't change, we're going to continue struggling with depression, isolation, aggression, and other issues considered typically male. We have an opportunity in our world today to embrace and guide who we are and celebrate it, and allow others to do the same and celebrate with them. I want to see that happen in everyone because that's a world with a potential beyond imagination. I could go on for ages on this, hehe, but I'll leave it at that for now. Exciting times, exciting times :)

[@Sangtrone]

I have to mention, first, my utmost appreciation for this video coming in. There are very few examples of feminists citing issues men face in modern western society. I do hope more feminist will have this conversation publicly, as I think it is a large issue holding your movement back, male support (oh yes I do see irony here). Feminism downplays and ignores men's issues as if there is only enough oxygen in the air to talk about women. Some even go so far as to protest outside of places discussing men's issues. Which scares off the more reasonable attendants leaving a much more radical element to have discussions in their echo chambers. I see way too much of, "Let's address women now, we'll get to the guys later", with no follow through. Therefore there is little motivation beyond idealism to get involved. Bottom line is that if feminism can't make room for any serious discussion of men's issues, then you aren't going to attract male supporters. You have to make that space. The vast majority of people are not going to be moved without an appeal to their direct self-interest, and that has to be much more that lip service and promises of , "Later".

[@veronicamilroy]

This would make a fantastic series Hannah if you can continue it with people from varying backgrounds/experiences. Was also lovely to see you & Dan having a serious conversation! (As much as I love your silly moments!) xo

[@thepowerofcheesecake]

I feel so strange thinking that people don't consider themselves feminists or pro-gay rights or for Black Lives Matter, because even though I'm only just 16 I've learned so much from you and other KZbinrs that it's easy for me to say I am in favour of these things. Having access to these things at a young age is so important, I think, because it gives opportunities to affect more people and to have more people with greater empathy and understanding of victims of oppression as well as greater skills to combat this oppression. It's helpful that while we're figuring ourselves out, we can figure out how we relate to other people as well.

[@j.s.2216]

Yes! We need more people talk about it. It really isn't fair for men in a lot of ways: if they want to be stay at home dad the society will say they are incompetent/lazy, if they're feeling emotional they (a lot of times) can't even tell best friends, because it's not 'manly' to feel sad or cry. If you divorce you pretty much know you'll only see your kids every other weekend. Where is body positivity for men? More and more guys feel pressured to think they need huge muscles in order to be 'manly'. If teenage boy gets sexualy abused by a hot woman, 'lucky him, he probably liked it'. But its hard to talk about this stuff because men are conditioned not to talk about feelings and emotions.

[@NamesEvad]

I think one of the reasons why some people feel the need to reassert the fact that feminism helps men to is because of a form of binary effect. Some people view Feminism as being the antithesis of mens rights. As though the two were on a see-saw and if one is up the other must be forced down. It is not the case, there are rights issues for all genders, its just that feminism is in support of all genders.

[@thatguyfx6311]

I am copying this to all the feminists in the comment section on this video, so please take this into account and if you are still a feminist after reading this than fine- just listen to what I have to say The reason people think feminism isn’t good is because no one has seen any feminist talk about ANY of the issues said in this video (hell, I’ve heard feminists try to inhabit these issues- plus the feminists I’ve heard talk about these issues got spat on and called “not a real feminist”) But they say “it’s about equality” and “it brings both genders together”, if this were true they would talk about these issues and try to change that- for example when lacy green said she wanted to TALK to people who appose feminism feminists universally said she was a traitor (she is one of the pioneers of intersectional feminism and people are getting mad cuz she just wants to TALK to the other side!) Feminists say that women are oppressed when I can’t even find a single domestic abuse shelter that accepts men but I can find hundreds of thousands that accept only women- and there are many more reasons why feminists aren’t for equality like they say they are but I’ll give 1 more example. “The wage gap is a thing that pays women less for men for the same jobs” is simply not true- the statistics for the wage gap say it is the total earnings of men to the total earnings of women, this doesn’t take into account different job levels and jobs at all, it is simply the total of everything- and men tend to work more hours and more overtime than women, which means they get more money, which increases the total number men get paid over women. So the wage gap is not a wage gap- it’s an earnings gap that is completely based on personal choice, and those are the reasons feminism’s isn’t what it says it is. If you want to know more than go watch a guy named Dr. Shaym on KZbin- he makes many more arguments like this and he will show you what feminists want to do

[@mariareugicnad]

I really enjoy this topic and I love the way you two discussed it (I also love you two, maybe that has something to do with it). And Hannah, that necklace is freaking cool!

[@SidheKnight]

I think I may have an answer as to why the need for feminists to try to "justify" the movement to some people: While feminism as a basic set of core values regarding gender equality is obviously a good thing, not all feminists seem to agree in how to achieve this equality, or even what equaliy actually _is_. Thus, a vocal minority of people who idetify as feminists spout ideas or engage in behavior that make people naturally wary of whatever ideology could inspire them. This minority is then used (either because of ignorance or malice) to misrepresent the movement as a whole by some people. Not to mention some people agree with the stated goals of feminism (gender equality) while not agreeing with some of it's theoretical premises (such as, for example, to what degree is gender behaviour determined by biology vs culture and education, the legality of abortion, etc). Also, there is an unmistakeable anti-men rhetoric by *some* (self-proclaimed) 'feminists' that drives some men away for feminism, hence the need to 'reassure' them that _no, these people don't represent us_. Finally, the biggest difference between stuff like the LGBT movement or BLM and feminism is that *some* representatives of the last one actually want to restrict (legally if possible) some of men's rights and freedoms (No, I don't mean stuff like freedom to discriminate or cause harm to other people, I mean basic stuff like the right to a fair trial, or freedom of speech). Of course I know this is not the majority, otherwise I wouldn't be a feminist, but it's something to consider.

[@ramywiles]

I know this is kind of an old comment, but I'm genuinely really curious as to where you've heard/seen that some feminists want to legally restrict men's rights to a fair trial or freedom of speech. I've never heard that expressed in any of the feminist spaces I've been exposed to.

[@SidheKnight]

ramywiles Hi! Yeah it's an old comment, but it's good that you asked all the same. As for an example, the best one I have is from the country I come from, Argentina, where some "feminist" lawyer called Liliana Hendel suggested that in cases of rape and domestic violence (against women ) the burden of proof should be reversed and men should be considered "guilty until proven innocent" since, according to her, "men almost always lie, women rarely do". I have a link with her exact words, but it's obviously in spanish, so you may want to use google translate since it's too long to write the entire translation here: es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borrando_a_pap%C3%A1#Entrevista_a_Liliana_Hendel

[@LordSantiagor]

In Spain, law 1/2004 introduced "discriminación positiva" against men in cases of domestic violence (now rebranded misoginistic violence), violating two important principles in Law: equal treatment and presumption of innocence. I don't know what feminist spaces you frequent, but this "listen and believe" nonsense is everywhere. Aka, "Lynching the negro". No evidence needed as long as the accused is among the second class citicens. So fucking progressive, isn't it?

[@aaduwall1]

I agree. There is a very vocal segment of self-proclaimed feminists who openly and unapologetically hate men ("all men are rapists and that's all they are" "#killallmen" "male tears mugs," etc), and that's why feminists are constantly having to do damage control with men. I would go so far as to say 80-90% of the support for groups that oppose feminism stems from the sadly-justified (in some very vocal cases) idea that feminists hate men.

[@aaduwall1]

ramywiles Part and parcel of the affirmative consent laws here in the USA (which many feminists support) are regulations that force college tribunals to consider a man accused of rape guilty until proven innocent. While these tribunals lack the power to jail defendants, they can still expel them and publicly label them as a condemned rapist, which can ruin a person's life. There have been numerous cases of accusers abusing this system already, including one where a jealous third party successfully got a man expelled and condemned for raping his girlfriend even though the girlfriend was adamant that the sex was consensual.

[@ShaynainShambles]

I'm really so remarkably happy that this video exists. To see content that encourages discussion and contemplation and awareness like this in such an open way is beautiful...Thank you for taking a step to open this conversation.

[@ItsRobinWhoTalks]

Daniel: "I messed around with a guy once" Me: "WHY WAS I NOT THERE?!?!?"

[@gryrabild]

I love you both so much. This video is so levelheaded. Open discussion and no overly aggressive arguments.

[@HazelWoodley]

I'm all about this video and everything but I can't help but be distracted because I really want Hannah's necklace lol

[@HazelWoodley]

THANKS :))))

[@PattMyCat]

I really, really appreciate that you provide such a level-headed, well-spoken voice in the feminist sphere. Thanks for making such great videos and please keep them up. In response to the question you and Daniel were asking, I think the reason that people say things like, "Feminism helps men too!" or, "It could be your sister!" is that it helps to motivate people and personalise the issue for them. There are so many issues grabbing at people's attention (the developing world, domestic and international political turmoil, environmental concerns to name a few) that people just can't be deeply involved in all of them, nobody has the time or the emotional energy for that. So if you want people to care about your issue, a good way to do that is to show them how the issue affects them or people close to them. On a completely unrelated note, as a gay man with depression who identifies as a feminist, I have often felt that the gay rights movement and feminism have similar goals. I think what drew me to feminism in the first place was that I got fed up with the strict, arbitrary definitions of gender in the society I grew up in. My school was similar to Daniel's in that if you weren't interested in a specific set of activities that were deemed masculine, it ostracised and marginalised you as a man. As I've gotten older I've met loads of people (men and women) who are much more open minded and accepting of people's differences, but I always know that there is a specific subset of people who I can never be comfortable around because I don't fit their perception of what it means to be a man. The ridiculous thing is that I'm not even effeminate really, I'm just not masculine enough to fit that standard. I think a lot of the issues feminism discusses today are social issues, that have their roots in people's perception of gender and stereotypes people hold about men and women. And I think that while feminism addresses a lot of those issues, there needs to be a feminism-like movement for issues specific to men that aren't covered by feminism. As you said, there's been a huge push towards broadening the definition of femininity but I don't think there's anyone pushing to broaden the definition of masculinity. Maybe it's just something that will happen naturally over time, I'm not sure.

[@joshsutherland16]

That necklace doesn't have Pluto on it... Unsubscribed

[@MissKittyLilly]

+josh sutherland hahahah

[@zapfanzapfan]

Pluto had it coming :-)

[@CatsCoffeeGuitars]

At that cooking part I paused the video, stood up, baked myself some cookies and laughed in the face of men who are missing on this wonderful experience.

[@genglynn8693]

Loved the video but have been totally distracted by that necklace! Where can I get one?? x Aside from the necklace this video is awesome. SO IMPORTANT!!

[@kateFAIL]

I got you! it's from eclectic eccentricity. All of their jewellery is stunning! x

[@genglynn8693]

thankyou my lovely x

[@jasnoornagpal5976]

This video is so great, I've been looking for these answers for ages and been trying to find a platform where men and women discuss their differences and similarities. I would love to see you talk to someone with opposing opinions to yourself, to see how to engage in those conversations. Thank you for starting something like this, please keep creating more of these videos!

[@tom7979]

I'm a gay teenager (15). I wear eyeliner and occasionally some items of clothing that are categorised as women's. I've also been told by my friends that I'm camp. I feel like society constantly tells me that because of this, I am less of a man. Because I listen to music by female artists such as Lana Del Rey and Beyoncé (who are known for being very feminine), that makes me less of a man. I take Drama and Fine Art, and because these aren't masculine subjects, I am less of a man. I'm quite skinny, and because I do not have a big, muscly body, I am told by society that I'm weak, and less of a man. Everything I do, or wear or think or feel determines whether I'm a real man in the eyes of society. I don't agree with categorising people into Masculine and Feminine. I believe that we should encourage everyone to be who they are, and not to worry about conforming to who society says they should be. Feminist: a person who believes in the social, economic and political equality of the sexes.

[@savannagoldstein3545]

Totally agree. If your gender expression is an important part of who you are, then feel free. But we shouldn't tell anyone that they NEED to make gender expression (especially in the traditional sense) an important part of their lives

[@Jex134]

There are plenty of manly guys who dress scene / metro. There are plenty of manly guys who listen to vagina music. There are plenty of manly guys who appreciate drama & the arts. There are plenty of manly guys who aren't capable of bulking up. Masculinity isn't about how you dress, what music you listen to, what your taste in art is, or what your physique is. Masculinity is about being honorable, dependable, useful, and needed. It's about being capable and able to handle yourself in daily life. It's about being able to manage your emotions in tough situations. It's about being able to adapt and modify your psychology and physiology based on necessity It's about knowing how to solve life's problems as they present themselves. It's about dropping whatever you're doing when family or friends need your help. Your taste in music, fashion, and arts don't prevent you from being a fully capable masculine man, nor does an inability to bulk up the way some guys can. P.S. Feminism as a movement does not strive for equality of the sexes - there are many examples that highlight this.

[@jessseddon1339]

Totally agree with what you said. It's sad for those that still don't understand this. Also if you don't already watch or haven't heard of, I suggest you check out 'Life of Bry and Candice'. Sorry reading your comment you really reminded me of him 😂💕✨

[@nahominieto1110]

so agreee!

[@87wxdiaz]

Nah man thats egalitarian... and i hate to say it bro so ciety does have certain expectation of people but as a man myself I choose to not conform and if society has a problem well they can deal with it... See thats the thing men are not supposed to give a crap about what society expects from them its about them doing what they need to for them and their families...This whole ohhh society isnt helping its oppressing thats not a man thing to do do you think all men took the day off and peacefully marched on germany in 1941 for mans awareness day or cause it was unfair or did they storm the beaches? Storm the beaches dude! if you feel weak pick up some weights, if you feel slow then start running... own up to it. And all this has nothing to do with your sexual orientation you can still like dudes and lift heavy weights bro.

[@whoselauraisitanyway]

Could have listened to you two talk about this for ages! The way you had your conversation seemed to me to be a great example of how we can now go about having these conversations in the comments and/or in our daily lives. Would love to see a follow up to this exploring some of the other topics you mentioned, either with Dan again or with other guests :)

[@Macintosh007]

I really like this video. It is well presented with a nice civil discussion.

[@juliabass6172]

HANNAH you're so great! and give me so much hope for the future and youtube WE NEED MORE HANNAHS

[@andrewhutchinson1400]

Wow this video has completely changed my outlook on feminism. Thanks for that :)

[@gayandtransandproud]

you do realise that he is not a homosexual hmosexual people are attracted to the same sex and he is not and she is more informed than you

[@Ohhidee1228]

I have sometimes hesitated to align myself with the feminist movement bc I felt like everything was always very cis women centered, so its really cool that you did a video like this that begins the conversation about another group of people that would benefit from the movement. I enjoyed hearing Dan's perspective and just the struggles that surround what it means to be a "man" and what happens when you don't fit those norms.

[@Charlotte-bn3hz]

I think with feminism, as with many movements, the fact that there is less discussion about mens issues could be more to do with how hard it is to have discussions about what men face when men seem so much less willing to take part in these discussions. A movement is as good as the people its made up of, and instead of shunning it because you see examples of bad feminists who don't take mens issues seriously, surely it would be more beneficial to try and improve the movement by including your opinions and experiences in the discussion and educating people. People have a tendency to react to hate with more hate, and unfortunately hate seems to be louder than understanding and progress a lot of the time. Most often you'll tend to base opinions on experience, and men don't have the experience of being a woman, and women don't have the experience of being a man, so it's hard to make progress when instead of working together to fix the inequalities where you see them, people try and halt progress being made in areas that they don't have experience of. This might make no sense at all, feel free to ask me to clarify what I mean or challenge any points I've (tried) to make.

[@micamarti8]

Your channel keeps getting better and better, please keep bringing guys to have this kind of conversation because it`s exactly what I talk about with my male friends so I find it very interesting to know what you and your friends think about the topic.

[@NotThatHarrison]

In regards to rights when a woman is pregnant, I agree that a woman has every right to control whether or not she carries a baby and is a parent, but that by the same logic, the biological father should have the right to say he doesn't want the child, or to be a parent, and not be subject to any legal trappings like child support if he ultimately had no decision in whether the baby was born

[@tobiasvazz7071]

I will be so glad earing a podcast from you talking with other people about all this topics

[@Becila2611]

Also, about the whole "men get raped too" bit, I've seen it used quite a bit by men who only wish to use it to silence women rather than wanting to start a conversation about male victims. And if you do want to start a conversation about male victims, it should never be started with "men get abused/raped too." You don't need the too, because as soon as you add the too you are using that discussion to talk over and silence women. Both discussions need to happen, even if they're not necessarily in the same conversation.

[@hallowedfool]

+Becila2611 Well, that's basically what was said in this video. I personally think that the 'too' would be a bad thing if there was this dialogue on male abuse that you and this video mentioned but that isn't a discussion that is really happening. When both discussions are being had, that's when the 'too' truly becomes a dodgy phrasing. Until the, I think it's just a case of 'for lack of a better word'.

[@savfox40]

Yeah I agree with you on that and I think it's a really important point, that the discussion of male rape victims comes up mostly when the person bringing it up doesn't really have an interest in helping male victims, they more just want to overshadow female victims. The types of people who do this give standing up for male rape victims a bad reputation (awful, I know, but true) and it is only talking about this issue seriously that we can fix this problem.

[@savfox40]

***** No, I cannot read minds but many of the people to bring up the subject only do so when there is a conversation of female victims. If these people brought up the topic not just when female victims are being talked about, I would be more convinced of their honest concern for male victims. I completely agree that it is a subject that needs to be brought up more, and as they said in the video, there needs to be more spaces where we talk specifically about male victims. However, in my experience, male victims are rarely brought up when the concern for them is legitimate and is brought up when the conversation is about female victims and the goal is to overshadow them.

[@MrBlancify]

Hannah, thank you for the support of anti-plutoism with your necklace. It's 2016 and people still act like it's a planet.

[@athaliahgrunburg8574]

I haven't cried since I was 5 years old I win the masculinity award also I'm broken inside

[@npwafireball]

+Matty Reymoor *awkward and slightly uncomfortable man hug*

[@jasmineindia1118]

love this comment

[@athaliahgrunburg8574]

+Darren Burgoyne thanks dude bro

[@maja2509]

Woah, this video was just in time. I'm literally writing an essay on patriarchy in my country for class right now. This is great for perspectives, so thanks!

[@SimplyMayaB1994]

I would just like to point out that women have always been in different societal positions in different societies and eras, so the idea of changing gender identity and roles definitely started before the 1960's and 1970's. I think that taking away years of vital gender-related history out of the feminist movement's equation (as well as general gender studies) diminished its importance, though modern history is just as important in its own way - History gives things weight. The modern phrasing and expressions of more progressive gender theories in the west, however, probably started to officially move ahead towards the beginning of the 20th century (for example the sexual liberation of the 20's). History is not actually a strict linear progression. The 60's were, indeed, the beginning of more rebellious and outspoken modern forms of feminism. That's also clearly visible in the fact the feminism takes on different forms especially between cultures. Also, femininity was, for years, defined more than anything as not-masculine, which is now changing in our understanding of the world as we know it. Men are impacted when they do not conform to what is basically default in concepts of strength, invention, heroism and such, femininity still being one of those things that are the not-masculine. They are not in the feminine-centered conversation as much because in more ways than one, they ARE the conversation. Challenging this idea in conversations about masculinity is vital, at least in my opinion. Even though there're plenty of benefits to safe spaces for feminine and masculine people to discuss their identity separately, the discussion itself should be intertwined. Just my lengthy little response. I thought you brought the discussion to the table in a very responsible and non-judgmental light, which is great!

[@samsontoadal9056]

+SimplyMayaB I would actually say that the strongest form of feminism was the suffragette movement in the early 10's and 20's, which focused mostly around universal suffrage and the right to vote. I say that it was the strongest worm because it had to fight the so called cat-and-mouse laws whereby women were moved from prisons to hospitals and back again so that they could be force fed through stomach tubes to break their hunger strikes. I certainly don't see many feminists willing to take that kind of stand for something they believe in today

[@SimplyMayaB1994]

I think that's it's not an exception to the rule in feminist struggles globally historically and now, and it's very euro-centric and historically uninformed to assume that. The fact that many women today can fight for things like bodily autonomy, anti sexual abuse, equal pay and the likes in ways that don't compromise their safety in the same manner is proof of societal progress and doesn't mean their struggle is irrelevant or of any less importance.

[@alexhill1567]

There's someone in my school who is openly a big feminist and the boys at school make sexist jokes to annoy her. When trying to explain this to anyone they just say 'they are just winding you up don't listen' but tbh the jokes they make are being made seriously and are extremely sexist and backwards. I just find it so stupid because if you even try to explain to them what feminism is and that it helps men and not just women they won't listen, They stand by 'masculinity' and that 'statistically' men are better off then women. I think this video addresses all of this brilliantly and I just wish that all people saw things your way and that they encouraged it in schools. Love you and all you stand for xxx

[@Rlh1994]

I think part of the reason that feminism needs to repeat that it helps men too, as where something like gay rights does not, is because the men that it is being repeated to think that feminism not only won't help them, but will hurt them. I hear some people say that by requiring a certain amount of females on a board of directors that hurts a male's chances; by putting extra funding into getting women into science that removes funding and/or places for men. It's similar to how when you speak to someone who, for example, is against gay rights; most of the times they will have reasons relating to how it will effect them, "I don't want to have to see that" "I don't want my kids seeing that" etc. We know not only is that attitude wrong, but also that movement IS unlikely to effect their day to day life. When it comes to feminism I think there is the knowledge that any real progress WILL have some impact of everyone's day to day life regardless of gender, and so men (and even some women) who don't really know what feminism is about might think that it is likely for that impact to be negative. That's just what I've seen anyway, I'm sure the issue is a lot more complicated than that.

[@KiahRaine]

I really enjoyed this conversation hannah & thank you dan for all you input!

[@emilyannette7646]

I'd love to hear you talk about feminism in third world countries!

[@perliva]

+Emily Annette That would be racist! How dare you question their culture. After all it’s the current year. Don’t you know that?

[@BellasLife97]

+perliva I dont understand how that would be racist? I would love to see a video about some countries still not giving the women the right to vote, to drive, to work, to abortions, to the choice to marry who they want and also underage marriage as well. Womens rights in western culture is so advanced compared to some countries but its not as good (equal) as it could be. A video with a girl that wears a hijab or burka and why that is empowering to them would be so interesting and also informative to many. Do you not think ??

[@perliva]

Bellas Life _Do you not think ??_ Yeah, maybe. But that is because I am not a feminist.

[@BellasLife97]

perliva Im not asking you if you actually think, Its an expression like "don't you agree" or "what are your opinions" but considering you said that you are not a feminist in any sense of the word.. maybe that statement i made is correct.

[@BellasLife97]

Russell Speed It is still feminism, just because it isn't "1st world feminism" its still feminism and damn should privileged 1st world feminists be helping these women as much as we can, yes and a lot are because thats what feminist values are.. helping women that need it so they have empowerment and resources and equality that they need and deserve...

[@MelissaKreil]

Love love love. I love this conversation. All of this needs to be talked about so much more.

[@maddygomes8147]

Hi Hannah, I was wondering if you could do a video on the concept of masculinity and femininity and whether you think they are real and justified or more just social constructs. I've been having this discussion a lot with my friends, and the difference between physical gender and the social construct of gender roles. I'd like to know whether you think masculinity and femininity are real things, and if so what do they actually mean sided with what people perceive them as. I would love to hear your thoughts!

[@BASSFZz]

I would like to hear Hannah' thoughts on this too, however I think there's something stranger with what you asked here. "Hi Hannah, I was wondering if you could do a video on the concept of masculinity and femininity and whether you think they are real and justified or more just social constructs." What exactly is the difference between "real and justified" and a social construct? Would a social construct not be real? And what makes in unjustifiable, simply because it's a social construct. It would seem you have an inherently negative view on "social constructs" simply because of what they are. Is that is the case, why? "I'd like to know whether you think masculinity and femininity are real things," Well the mere fact that you even know they exist prove they are real things. What is the nature of what you mean by "Real"?

[@PAJA63]

@@BASSFZz Yes, if we talk about things, they exist, at least in our minds and our conversations. As to the very nature of these concepts, that would be interesting to know better. How close are they, or how distant. In different parts of society. Or in different societies.

[@aristurtle]

This was such a great and important video, thanks Hannah and Dan! I wish you could have talked about the other things on your list as well. Specifically paternity rights and the military. Could you please do a video on those soon? I love your channel so much! :D

[@laurenazusa]

What do you think about women who talk about "hating men", speaking as feminists? How do you think this affects feminism?

[@arbee1958]

In most countries women have had the vote and equal pay for a century - what have they done with over 50% of the vote ? pretty much stuff-all. There should be a party that is only for women and their issues that is always holding the balance of power - but feminism hasn't got a cohesive vision to sell women .The lack of a coherent unifying message from "The Feminist Movement" means that anyone identifying as a feminist is getting tarred with the same brush as the raving men hating nutters. There are so many half truths and rubbish emerging from both the MGTOW/MRA's and the Feminists that those of us in the middle become targets for anyone with a view more extreme than our own. To me the main difference is that many men feel that the playing field was levelled with basic rights to both earn the same money for the same work (1969 here in Australia) and the right to vote (1902) ... after this it was equal rights to University , anti-discrimination laws etc ... Are we all reaping a huge sustained benefits ? I would say that for women 18-29 the world has never seemed so full of possibilities ... parties, travel , career prospects - the problems seem to occur as those same women hit the thirties and attempt to find a guy to settle down with and possibly have kids - they are thin on the ground ... moderately attractive women still want high earning men , in shape who are tall - and are shocked at how commitment -phobic an attractive smart high earning guy can be . So we have lots of women hitting thirty + - clock ticking and no suitable mates willing to settle down - it's a recipe for miserable 18-24 year old low earning men (effectively invisible to women seeking steady relationships) ... and miserable 30-40 year old single women (who meet a narrow group of attractive guys who just "Pump & Dump" ) I think it's a dire time for both sexes at the moment - quite saddening.

[@CheApplewhaite]

Hey Hannah, so happy you've touched on this important conversation. I think it's really good you've made clear that men talking about their experiences is feminist in itself bc it breaks down a lot of the structures of masculinity, or questions them at least. Would really love it if you got more guys on to give their views! There's a Ted talk by Tony Porter that talks more about this and a charity called A Call to Men that does workshops

[@marinab.3304]

this was such an interesting and important video. I feel like we need a part 2. great work guys, I feel kind of proud of both of you💜

[@rosiej1262]

this was such an important video and you guys did a really good job of introducing these topics for a larger conversation - well done!

[@theinternetdweller]

Love this!! I think discussions about masculinity are just as important as femininity. We'll never reach equality if we prioritise one over the other. All the issue were tackled perfectly! Well done guys :)

[@theinternetdweller]

Totally agree that a wider range of male experience needs to be explored with this issue in general but, hey, you have to start somewhere! :D Dan's experience is no less valid than that of a very masculine male, although I agree that a more 'traditionally masculine' man probably would make for a much more challenging and complex discussion. Think it was probably more of a case of Dan being a close friend that she knew would feel comfortable discussing this issue on camera, as opposed to believing this one account offered a comprehensive male perspective on gender and feminism, as they themselves acknowledged in the video :)

[@theinternetdweller]

I do understand your frustration with the video but equally I don't know what response you're looking for. I've agreed that having a more traditionally masculine man would make for an interesting video and that Dan's perspective is just one of many. If you feel strongly then you could maybe ask Hannah to extend the series and have a more masculine guy feature, or perhaps even yourself?! As for your thoughts on abortion, i'm afraid I don't think we're going to see eye to eye :/ Once again I see where you're coming from but I think it's an unfair parallel given that the biological woman has to carry the foetus for 9 months inside her and this has medical and psychological implications. Abortion is a complicated and personal issue and not something I really want to go into detail on in youtube comments. Think we can hopefully just agree to disagree in this one :)

[@entingmat1088]

​@@garrusn7702 it's been 6 years and Hannah Witton *still* hasn't had the discussion you proposed. Sadly we need such a discussion more than ever

[@jamesdawson5169]

I learn more and more from your videos every week, that are very interesting. These problems should definitely be talked about more often so we can all talk about them and try and solve them together.

[@lysandretremblay4221]

I view sexuality like I view colours. I can like shade of blue but not all of the shades in the spectrum of blue. I can suddenly take interest in a certain shade of green, paint my room in this shade and then, realise, maybe I don't like it that much. Would people categorize me as a 'lover of green'? No, not at all. So why do we do it with sexuality? Do we feel pressured to tell our favotite colour whenever someone asks? No, maybe you'll even respond that you're not sure about it. So why all this shaming and pressuring about puting yourself in a box when comes the question about sexual orientation?

[@lunaandalex]

This is so beautiful!!

[@SaroshaByrne]

Please do a part 2, loved hearing both of your thoughts and thought they were really well addressed.

[@ratherbeforgotten8458]

Love the part when you start talking about male abuse victims and Hannahs first input is "there are a lot of male abuse and rape victims, um, statistically women are more likley to be victims", then not a full minute later she rants over how bad it is when someone says "men gets raped too" in a discussion on female rape victims. First of all, usually people don't just throw that in to a conversation strictly about female rape victims for no reason. It's usually when there's some serious collectiv guilt rant and someone says, so a male rape victim is to blame for rape? or when false statistics gets thrown around. Secondly, for how long did you discuss that topic and for how long was it about male victims? If a majority of feminists discussed rape and abuse in a inclusive matter with men, this wouldn't be an issue. This lame attempt to soothe critics just proves the point. It's really hard (if not impossible) for a public feminist to keep the feminist-cred and really discuss male issues. I would applaud you for your effort if it didn't seem so fake. Had a lot of comments on other stuff, but it's really not worht arguing here.

[@ratherbeforgotten8458]

There are sooo many issues that are involved in what "ends" with a rape. Sexism can be one, far from allways, not allways int the male->female direction, and when it is a factor it's not the only factor. So basing the entire global debate on rape, pretty much banning 50% of the population from participating (if not with am approval stamp from the allmighty ideology feminism) and throwing all other explainations and arguments out the window will never ever help any victim and will not prevent it from happening again. Rape is rape. It doesn't matter what gender either victim or perputrator identifies with. This is just a nice hint of the feminist way of discussing important issues. It's never actually about the issue, it's actually allways about sexism. And that's probably why women feel more affraid now that feminism is a big part of every debate. It's not because they're treated worse than men, it's because feminists scare the sht out of them. When it comes to prison rape there's actually statistics that point out that the highest risk is female personell raping male inmates than any other category. This is the kind of numbers you end up with when you don't have an ideological bias when conductin research. The same goes for domestic abuse. Common "knowledge" is that men beat their wives, but genderneutral studies show that it's close to 50/50. Collage male students claims to be sexually harrassed in close to the same extent as female students. Not when looking at police reports, but when conducting gender neutral research avoiding gendered terms such as "rape" or "sexual abuse" (wonder how these terms ever got gendered in the first place). Rape culture is a thing. In prison, in war, and in specific kultural and geographic locations at certain times. Rape culture as feminists use the term just waters out any usefull use of it. Who pushes this idea that men have an uncontrollable secual thirst? Feminists. Who pushes the idea that men are responsible and strong and women are weak and not capable of taking responsibility? Feminists. Every day there's an article in a new paper, someone on tv or a facebook campain with feminists spreading theese messages. When you look at your statistics you need to understand both how statistics work and how the research is conducted. Asking loaded questions, such as "have you been raped" is going to get totally different answers from a man and a woman who both experienced the exact same scenario. Why do you think so many people (probably mostly men) believe that what the researcher discribes as a rape scenario as consentual? Because he would never report it as a rape if it hapened to him. It has probably hapened to him many times and it has probably hapened more to him than he has subjected a woman to it. That idea you've been talking about. That men are supposed to be sexually active all the time and allways be willing to have sex. It kind of means that a man can't really say no to sex the same way a woman can. because of socal preasure. And who's feeding us this information, while making it sooo hard to have a serious discussion about male victims? Feminists. We're on youtube. There are thousands of videos here on events discussing these things that end with a feminist pulling a fire alarm, calling in bomb threats, blocking the doors so people can't (or won't) get in. How many videos can you find of feminist meetings being disturbed by mens rights activists?

[@ratherbeforgotten8458]

Disagreeing with the point is not the same as missing it. And I think you missed MY point. This video is about men’s issues and how feminism is supposed to be the answer. The conversation about abuse/rape is about 2 min. in that time Hannah manages twice to make the conversation about how men disrupt the discussion on female victims (irony?). They never really touch on the subject of how feminism helps men in this issue and Hannah doesn’t really show any interest in the issue since she literally 3 seconds in to the subject makes it about female victims and then makes sure it stays on that subject. And after looking again and listening to what they were saying, they were not at all talking about victims discussing their personal issues or experiences. They’re talking about normal discussions on female victims that anyone can jump into, and as Daniel said, which is so true, “right now we’re talking about female victims, we’ll talk about men later… and then we don’t”. There is no debate on what causes rape in a general fashion, there is no debate on rape victims in a general fashion, there is no debate on what causes women to rape, there is no debate on male rape victims. There is a lot of debates on what causes men to rape. There is a lot of debates on female rape victims. This is true for all media all political debates and social media discussions. I’ve been fooled a couple of times by social media discussions that start in a very neutral fashion, just discussing rape as a social issue. But as soon as I mention men in any other way than as rapists I get my head bashed in for derailing the discussion. It’s just always assumed that when there’s a discussion on rape, it’s male on female rape that’s being discussed. There are no platforms where men’s issues can be discussed. And, if it’s important to have discussions about male on female rape free from male perspective and without any criticism on faulty statistics, maybe public debate isn’t the right platform? Another point: There would be far less “distractions” from people like me if the female-only discussions used facts instead of ideological myths to base their arguments. If the “solutions” didn’t include threatening my kids with psychological child abuse in school etc. If there wasn’t a consensus when it comes to solutions that probably has no, or negative, effect etc. I could launch into a discussion on your definition of “oppression”, but I won’t. What I will do though is to question your collectivistic world view. What powers have I got? What resources and wealth have I got? There is no support what so ever for me. None. And even as a “survivor” my word counts for nothing in any situation. I have three kids. If I don’t put extra effort and try to deprogram them from the feminist crap that is taught in school these days, my daughter will grow up and believe that she has no chance to succeed in life, that society hates her and she will never get a well-paid job and she will be too scared to go out at night. My sons will learn that there’s something wrong with them. How they act and how they feel is wrong. Mostly women will tell this to them since most teachers are women and most male teachers actually understand boys. Feminists keep telling me that it’s my responsibility to make sure my sons grow up with a positive view on women, well you’re not making it easy. But I do my best by teaching them to think for themselves and telling them they’re great just the way they are.

[@guskinmaypho174]

I am really happy to see a self aware feminist. That "too" is one of many reasons why I am not able to call myself a feminist. I would say that both genders have issues that need addressing. And feminism is silent about issues that don't involve women. I will try promoting equality for everyone rather than just for a specific group.

[@selgrosso471]

I undersand where you're coming from, but the biggest misconception about feminism is that it's about women. Feminism is about GENDER EQUALITY. Literally the ONLY reason why feminism is called that, is because of historical reasons. Women have had to fight for their indpendence and it's important to remember those battles. That's all.

[@selgrosso471]

+Selene Grosso also, as Hannah and Daniel said, you shouldn't have to be gay to support gay rights, you shouldn't have to be black to support black rights. It's simply supporting a humanitarian movement. It will ultimately benefit everyone.

[@selgrosso471]

Sorry if I sound preachy! Just wanted to speak out on something I care about :) not directed at you specifically

[@guskinmaypho174]

Selene Grosso I accept you see feminism as movement for equality but I don't see it that way. At least not the third wave feminism. To help you understand me, what I would like you to do is when you talk about inequality and see a situation where you feel that men are oppressing women, try to put yourself in position of a man and think if this situation could actually happen to a man. And how likely it is for a man. And if you would feel equally bad as you did in position of a woman. Or if the only one who can oppress this way is a man. Most feminists don't think this way.

[@selgrosso471]

Guskin Maypho The first thing that springs to mind is sexual harassment, like catcalling. TBH I've never seen a woman catcalling a man, but if I did, I would be pretty grossed out. I'm not a hundred percent sure what you're referring to - do you mean how if a guy slaps a woman it's abuse but if a woman slaps a man it's not? (even though it is from my point of view)

[@DigitalCoffeeBrewer]

10:44 "Why do we have to [tell men that this could be your daughter or mother]?" "Because, as men, we don't go through what you [women] go through." I don't feel like this is relevant. I won't waste time trying to argue that this statement is or is not true. But I will say that you can never experience something, and it could never affect your life directly, and yet you can still care deeply about it. Thus, saying that men who do not experience the same issues as women must be repeatably told that "this could happen to a woman you care about" assumes that all of said men have very limited empathy. And that I will disagree with.

[@AbbieElizabeth13]

This brought up so many wonderful questions! Can't wait to think about all of this more!

[@arianaw3741]

So much here could be debated, even more could be argued that feminism has caused some of the damages discussed more than any patriarchy ever could. I like the direction feminism is slowly beginning to go, but as long as the overwhelming vast majority still hold racist and sexist views built out of even intersectional feminism's talking points, I won't be among them. Terms get shuffled to suit the speakers, but it's still hate or at the very least bigotry and prejudice. Keep fighting for true equality. Not labels.

[@wietskejanse5951]

I love how educational and well thought your videos are, Hannah. I learn something new every time and absolutely love it! Very well done, please keep doing them :)

[@I_Couldnt_Think_Of_A_Username]

I literally stopped calling myself a feminist a few weeks ago... now I'm tempted to go back edit: I'm not going back

[@TheJanaRina]

+Hannah Witton This is totally off topic but I love your necklace. Where is it from?

[@EmilyCooper-cf1qj]

+TheJanaRina it's in one of her recent favourite videos, It's eclecticeccentricity.bigcartel.com/ Amazing jewellery!!

[@TheJanaRina]

+Emily Cooper Thanks :)

[@amanda-cs9xb]

+TheJanaRina on her Instagram she said it was from ee jewellery

[@Cyrielle_H]

+ICouldn'tThinkOfAUsername What prompted you to stop calling yourself a feminist? [Just curious, not trying to be mean]

[@FrancescaGeorgiou]

You did this video really well honestly. So much respect for you

[@Cats1357911]

I think men are emotionally repressed from a young age by society. People assume they like football and violence and assume is the big word here. We don't let people be themselves we think he is a man he must do this... or she is a woman... but actually gender and sexuality in my opinion is a massive spectrum. When I was a boy I loved cats and still do... I remember getting told by a few guys in my class cats are fore girls. Well actually I know of plenty straight men who love cats. I think we should stop putting people in boxes let a woman play rugby without calling her a lesbian or a man like fashion design by calling him gay. Just learn to accept each other and live and let live.

[@airohtheenby]

I think these conversations are really important! Thanks for making a video.