How To Set Your Handlebar Height - With Expert Bike Fitter

[@davekashuba4730]

I think the next bike fit video should just be Neill finally saying to us "Look, you people don't have any idea what you're doing, so just make an appointment already".

[@roadcyclingacademy]

hahaha! I'll get him to script something up. Cam

[@joelsoto1849]

😅

[@diegoeleazar9154]

You're the ONLY bike fitter that I watch that can really explain what's happening. Watching your videos help me diagnose what is wrong with my fit.

[@durianriders]

Great tips. Also remember to mark your set up with a white out pen etc so you know if anything slips during travel, riding etc.

[@simonguard5087]

Because of your videos as a 55 year old cyclist I’ve booked my first bike fit, ashamed to admit that I’ve left it this long but can only thankyou for your expertise, you make it understandable and logical.

[@starlitshadows]

I've been working on my position recently watching these vids. And I shortened my reach and experimented with hood position. I got the neck, shoulder and lower back pain to go away but couldn't for the life of me figure out how to get rid of numbness in the index, middle and thumb. Even seemed to be working its way up further up the median nerve. I gradually dropped a few spacers a couple weeks ago and it worked. Exactly like Neil said your shoulders may want to come back or up. Also, you'll feel excess pressure in the heel of the hand and it will never quite feel right. In a better position I feel a touch more over the bars and the hoods feel nice like they fit perfectly in my hand with weight more distributed across the palm. I may even be able to go a bit lower. Every other vid people say numbness comes from bars too low, no one mentions them being too high as well. Glad you made this video.

[@kaptajnsejersen6303]

Very interesting.. My numbness went away when I lowered the tyre pressure from 80 psi to 60psi as my bike was vibrating to much..

[@Tommi462]

Glad I found this video. I was wondering why it felt so weird riding on the hoods on my new bike. It kinda felt like my bar was too wide when I was on the hoods, but perfectly fine on the drops, which didn't make sense. I also thought that maybe the stem was too long, but again, no problems on the drops. I didn't even think that the bar could be too high. I thought slamming the stem was just something people do for aero gains, and that riding more upright would always be more comfortable. But this makes sense now. My bar is too high. That's what causes my wrists to be in the wrong angle on the hoods, not the width of the bar. And that's why I ride 80% on the drops now.

[@giololucas]

100 percent agree! Some months ago, I lowered my bars from leveled to saddle, to minus 5cm from saddle. My hands fells much lighter, no more neck, hands, and shoulders pain. Riding fells very comfortable and handy. Pelvis rotated forward and pressure is now well distributed in the saddle. Interesting thing it's that, lowering the bars is counter intuitive hahaha. Thank you Neil! PS: watched all of your videos and adjusted the back end first.

[@steveransom8134]

Incredibly well articulated. It's great to encourage riders to be present and pay more attention to how they feel rather than follow rules (We so love to follow the latest trendy rule. ). The body doesn't ever lie. More often, the brain doesn't listen and gets caught up with following cool trends. Thanks for this video. Great stuff.

[@steveransom8134]

I wonder how this translates to mountain bikes. Might be more of a trade off between optimal ergonomics and position for challenging terrain (drop offs, etc). That said, I often find mountain bikers with high bars thinking they need to be farther back for steep downhills and drop offs. I find that it can actually decrease handling. It might be scary to be low, but the bike actually handles better.

[@sepg5084]

The problem with just "listening" to your body is that the body is adaptable. If your body already adapted to a bad posture then you'd find no reason to change it, and will feel worse when you change to a "correct" posture.

[@Naah732]

​@@sepg5084disagree . Rear end adaptation always have simptoms on the saddle or elsewhere . Same with front end: uncomfortable shoulder ,numb hands etc

[@zvl_____h]

I watched a video featuring neil a few months back, he was saying something about the weight is on the wrist when its too high and i tried slamming my stem and it did work, no more pain on my traps and my palms. So credits to Neil, thanks for the tip (and i have a badass looking bike now 🤣)

[@mathewrose2951]

It makes sense when you show it as you're saying it. I just got a new cyclocross bike and there are still several 20mm spacers. The handlebars are definitely higher than my road bike setup. I don't want to get the stem cut before I am sure of the fit. I think I'm going to move one of the spacers to on top of the stem and then cinch everything down and go for a ride with the bars 20 mm lower. I'd like to give it a while before I commit to the fit.

[@10ktube]

Had that EXACT situation with my bars being too high, and my arms being locked out. I kept thinking they were too high, but it turns out my core is actually better than I was giving myself credit for, and my bars are much lower now. Great video, and, FIRST!

[@rolandoinductivo8013]

this was me. now all spacers are gone and not even meaning to slam the stem

[@jmack8274]

I notice you refer to hand pain when the bars are too high but not when they are too low - ive never thought of it that way around always thought too low = too much weight on the hands. I'll give it a go as I suffer from hand pain. Cheers - great vid.

[@Lonewolf54322]

Its truee haha. Because our core is not fully engaged when the bars are to high. Causing our hands to do more of the work on the front weight.

[@latte6878]

I just make sure the handlebar is low or high enough for my back to be flush horizontally when I’m in a 90 degree elbow position on the hoods.

[@richardprice9730]

The Only expert I want to listen to incredible intuition, science almost metaphysics of cycling wow.

[@look5000]

I found I just couldn't get quite comfortable on the hoods but I liked riding in the drops. Lowered my bars by 5mm and all of a sudden I'm perfectly comfortable. It's amazing what a few millimeters difference can make on a road bike.

[@gjBackBone]

I ride pretty much my entire 30 minute commute in the drops. I think I have some tuning to do.... Thanks for the tips!

[@ozzz3365]

Im listening to you my friend, and i enjoy so much!! Every word you say seems so logical. And the fact you dont relay on digital or computer system, but on logic, eyes and experience are so correct in my opinion. Im learning a lot from you Neil, you are a professor! Thanks a lot

[@frx_dasalatpagninilay]

Hope the next video will be how to know it is too long or too short to complemebt this beautiful video

[@The_TURK94]

the best videos Ive ever watched!

[@kimwarner6050]

I recently got an endurance bike and I found it so uncomfortable within 2 minutes. I returned home and lowered the stem. Ultimately I had to slam the stem to feel comfortable. Now everything is all good and I love the bike. But this does raise the question of why endurance bikes have a very high stack height.

[@Karel-B]

Because not everyone is built the same. I have long legs and short arms and torso. If it wasn't for Endurance bikes I wouldn't have anything to ride. "Regular" road bikes are way too long and low for me to fit comfortably on them.

[@ausmartin1]

It depends how your sit bone area sits on the bike seat. I've found for long road bike use handle bars need to be raised 50mm. Not everyone is the same age / flexibility or posture. Adjust one thing, and others need to follow for that individual's perfect, comfortable fit.

[@caseylafran3028]

This is all spot on. Well done

[@lovenottheworld5723]

I saw a picture of Mario Cipollini and his bars were definitely too low, but it was necessary for the sprint. He had the brake hoods rotated back for comfort and it didn't look like he could reach the brakes from the drops. That would be the sprinters solution unless somebody had the Mark Cavendish bend in the upper back to get low even with high bars.

[@sylv_ain]

Great video as usual !

[@pepessz32]

Wow, this video is just spot on. I've been experiencing the sitbones sore and occasional discomfort at the spot between my scapula as you've described. Thank goodness I haven't slammed those stems yet. Lol.

[@jeron1847]

I completely slammed my bar but I still get big neck pains on longer rides. I tried everything. Highest position, lowest position, increase seat height, decrease seat height, default stem length, 20 mm shorter. Luckily I am seeing a very reputable bike fitter in a few weeks because I'm done messing around myself even though these videos give me some kind of indication what might be wrong.

[@bradley5431]

I havent done it because bike fitting is expensive

[@diegoeleazar9154]

Play around with your saddle set back. If you cant lift up your arms in aero position that mean your saddle is way to forward. Make sure your saddle is completely flat.

[@Fetherko]

Great writing, man. You put a lot into it. I have wrist numbness and nerve pain from an unrelated injury. I must keep changing positions and then stopping for breaks. At least I am out there.

[@patrickparisienne1917]

Awesome content as always guys!

[@guppyitsallgood]

There's a channel called Kamaklang that just popped up in my feed, they've posted a copy of one of your earlier bike fit videos "How to perform a simple bike fit at home".

[@matthewtaylor8727]

Nice work, love these videos

[@matthewreeves5843]

Good afternoon, one comment you made regarding low back pain as the pelvis rocks and can’t stabilise… Would a suspension seat post in theory cause the same as the saddle height and position changes constantly with each bump affecting handlebar position too..?

[@ChaulThe]

I have never touched the drops, too uncomfortable, can't hold the position for long. I do lock my hands though. I have numb hands but also lower back pains after the ride and on rear end during the ride. My bike geometry does favor a more upright position. Somehow I manage by changing the position very often but I can't even get into the aero position. I've tried moving the saddle back and forth but this lower back pain is new. I never thought that handlebar height could play a role and have that kind of effect.

[@winds10]

Thank you for the thoughtful and informative contents. Question -- when your hands are on the hoods, what is the ideal position for the elbows, and by extension your shoulders? Meaning, should the elbows be slightly bent so as not to nudge your shoulders up? I guess another way to ask the same question is should you strive to have your shoulder in a relaxed position, as opposed to be in a "shrugging" position?

[@durianriders]

Relaxed position UNLESS you want to develop some gutsy upper cross syndrome hehe.

[@markbarratt8003]

From the issues that I'm getting it would seem that my bars are to low ... and too high!

[@Lets-Bike-EAT]

hi! how do you increase the dropbar height if your steerer tube length is limited?

[@edskippon]

Great video, bars may well be too low

[@kaptajnsejersen6303]

My handlebar is definitely to low as I get upper back pain and my arms are stretched out when I ride. Problem is I can't add more spacers as they would go beyond the fork.. What can I do?

[@christosandreev6392]

I have quite good flexibility in compariso to the general population. However, for some reason everytime I set up a bike, including solo and with a professional bike fitter, always my handlebar height is almost at the same height as my saddle. This is very strange as most people I see have their handlebars much lower than the saddle. Am I doing it wrong? I've been to two bike fitters and I feel okay this way but the bike doesn't look right.

[@jonpoon3896]

Any chance of a video about tri aero bars setup? Both dedicated tri bike and clip on bars on a road bike

[@ankurd2889]

Hey..i did a 8-hour day recently in the saddle..and apart from my broken spirit…i had no pain points…does it mean…I’m alright in my position…!! Is it even a metric…perceived discomfort !!

[@Jakiou]

Hey guys i really hope you can give me an answer on my question. I sometimes get lower back pain. But mostly first comes after 1 hour and 45 minute. Im not sure if it is because of my core is to weak. I Got a bike fit once and they slammed my stem. And i actually made no difference i get the same pain in the same spot. Actually i feel more sore and tired in the lower back than an actual pain. If i do very hard interval’s i get the pain before. If it is very windy and i drop Down to a very aero position and my head all Way Down it is still first comes after 1 hour and 45 minutes. And that why i thought maybe it could be more a problem of my core strenght than a to low stem? Any suggestions?

[@nofascistsonmywatch]

Is your thighs smacking into your chest when down in the drops on a hard effort, a (dis)function of bar height and reach, or is it the exclusive problem of the saddle fore-aft being completely wrong??

[@bobfoster687]

Or saddle height!

[@luisgarcia22]

Used to ride a 60mm stem on my road bike. I corrected seat fore-aft and height using your videos and feels great. Switched to 80mm stem which feels much more comfortable, but I notice medial rotation in my left leg (less on the right but it’s still there) when I assume a lower position, regardless of the reach (tried multiple lengths of stem). Is it my hamstrings that are too tight? Or my femur socket that’s crooked? 😂

[@vzmario]

Hi there! by changing handlebar height, angle of torso to horizontal line is changed, but also the angle of arms to horizontal line. To my experience, I prefer to have much more than 45 degrees ... There is less muscle fatigue in my arms and shoulders. Of course, because of that, I can lower my handlebar. Is there an optimal angle between riders arms and horizontal line?

[@gustavorincon1640]

I can´t help but think about the causation/correlation nd the cost/benefit aspects of bike fitting: some changes can help with confort but be detrimental in performance and the other way around, also, some adjustments are made to compensate muscular inbalances that can be tackled and improved with PT. I think sometimes people get fixated on short term or lower priority goals/issues: for example: someone who isn´t performing at their maximum, does not need to adopt an agressive position, but they´re bothered with the estetics so they try to adopt positions that they don´t require or are able to hold. In the case of handlebar height, I think there´s an issue related to all of this, in that the road bike geometry has a very specific purpose, and it´s performance, so many people would be better of using a MTB geometrywise.

[@pogoking4000]

Or just an endurance type frame instead of full race geometry 🙂

[@leemarcel1919]

Thankyou 🙏🙏 🙏

[@SonnyDarvishzadeh]

I have a question regarding wide feet and wide shoes. It would be nice if Neill could cover this topic. A while ago, I did suspect my feet are wider than usual, but still bought a new regular fit Fizik shoes (known to be narrower than usual, my previous shoes were Scott) and my problem got exaggerated to a point that I realise that my feet are twisting outwards inside the shoes to find the space they need and that's causing lots more pain on the outer feet. On a side note, now I'm not sure if the increased q-factor (with Assioma Shi) had any benefits at all, as it potenatially seems to have been masking the wide feet problem.

[@Pastamistic]

I'd love to know about this too. It's not causing me issues but I hate having my toes pinched and overlapping trying to shove them into a small toe box. I buy shoes that are a size too large just to help alleviate this. My normal shoes are Altra and Lems, both have foot shaped toe boxes. I'd love for someone to make a cycling shoe that's more anatomically correct to a real foot shape.

[@JibbaJabber]

@@Pastamistic Try Lake. They do very good wide fit shoes. Head over to their website, and use the info to compare your feet stats to what the have:)

[@Lonewolf54322]

Adjust your cleat position. I had the same situation before and its was solved by adjusting the cleats by rotating inwards (clockwise on left shoe and counter clockwise on the right) Just make sure you adjust it in small increment until your foot gets comfortable. This was already discussed by neil on one of their old video

[@Pastamistic]

@@JibbaJabber thanks! Great to see a company with multiple lasts to fit different feet! Anything that's in stock in the fit I need it way outside my price range at the moment but I'll check back in a month.

[@JibbaJabber]

@@Pastamistic Yep, fair point. But if you do get the cash, it'll should a great investment. Also, give eBay a look, you might get lucky:)

[@dustyhoods]

Great advice - to film yourself on a trainer! Thanks.

[@brianwendy727]

Hi sir. Can i send you a picture of my side profile and check if my handlebar needs to be lowered? :)

[@Jin_KX]

Thanks for this vid!! Bought into the misleading idea for yearssssss that a higher bar is always gonna be more comfortable and came to realize that low bars may be where your hands naturally wanna be I require quite a fair bit of saddle set back to engage my glutes and that naturally lowered my back as I roll my pelvis forward (176cm tall, 85mm set back). Thought that I'm low enough and my bars should be high but I kept getting hand numbness and neck discomfort for the exact reasons outlined here. Installed a 35 degree stem and slammed it, neck discomfort is completely gone (-17 degree stem slammed still wasn't low enough 😅).

[@andrewdinin4819]

Hey there, I just bought a Canyon Grizl size large. and Yes i have had a bike fit. When out on I ride my triceps start to load up and feel slight numbness in my hands. I plan to flip the stem which will give me a bit more rise. Looking into a pair of handlebars that will give me 30mm of rise as well. Taking one step at a time. What else can I do or look out for? Suggestions welcome.. Thanks

[@DR_1_1]

I think he mentions the triceps hurting in one of the video "saddle too far back" / forward, can't remember which one...

[@davidbidwell250]

A complication to the whole bar height issue is the bar reach (even after the back end is dialed in). Won't a long reach or even too large of a frame result in the same symptoms as a bar height being to low?

[@WCIIIReiniger]

Not all, but most symptoms are shared for both (bar too low and reach too long)

[@Fonkemman]

Waiting for my torque wrench to slam my stem down! The drop bars is my comfort cruising position. So maybe my bars are too high.

[@Cokecanninja]

Ditch the handlebar and hold on to some BMX pegs on the front axle for maximum aero

[@ankurd2889]

I love this guy..!!

[@calebgonsalves2970]

Good video, but I had a question. Being an aero nut, I've raised my bars on purpose to get more parallel arms and to raise my shoulders in exactly as Neil has described. So far, I don't have any discomfort. Is this something I *should* change? Or should I let it slide?

[@Lonewolf54322]

It depends. Maybe your body already used to it. But I think the discomforts mentioned will come out if you’re riding lets say a long ride 80-100km. It also depends on your riding style as well. Specially if you’re doing crits. As they say comfort is speed. Aero is useless if you’re not comfortable holding that position for a long period of time.

[@calebgonsalves2970]

@@Lonewolf54322 hmmmm, I've been doing some base training lately, while I am able to put in multiple hours, it's neither comfortable nor unbearable. I find myself switching contact points often unless I'm going downhill and my back seems to look forward to the few short breaks I take. I'm still flexible enough during riding, I don't load my bars, too much, definitely more than what I did on race day. I should also mention, I don't actually roll my shoulders as agressively on these rides, I try rolling them forward but the reach is a bit high to get a good endurance position, so I'm still forced to hunch and bend my elbows a lot

[@simonderoo9189]

I should stop watching these video's, I'm perfectly comfortable on my bike but now I'm questioning my position every time I ride. Nice video's!

[@bartix5839]

i can ride in drops for 30 minutes with good elbow position (90 degrees bend)

[@bartix5839]

and i lowered my stem by 4cm

[@phoenixaroui8712]

This video make my riding stressing

[@DISCOhooch]

Great video. Thanks.

[@timdixo]

Integrated cockpits mean Neil is set for life for clients riding in chronic pain in poor positions.

[@SamWize.]

I have just slammed my stem today gonna see how it feels on my next ride

[@SamWize.]

It was a bad mistake haha, found it hard to breathe cos my belly got in the way and got upper back and back of neck pains, so gonna put it back to its original height

[@donwinston]

I've significantly increased the length of my rides this year fro 1 1/2 to 3 1/2 hours. As a result I've developed an extremely painful shoulder especially when I reach behind my back to dry my back after a shower or use toilet paper. What could cause this? I've noticed my shoulders are very tense when I'm riding. I have extra narrow 40cm handlebars where my "proper" size is 44cm (to get more "aero"). Could that cause it or do I just need to focus on being more relaxed when riding?

[@JibbaJabber]

Most likely that you've found a weak area in your kinetic chain! Assuming that you've had your fit checked, you probably to step it down a bit and then build up again gently, with some strength and flexibility training. Being patient will allow for adaptation, and doing work off the bike will prep you for the long hours on it:)

[@Gabrielle4870]

A stem 1cm too long caused such issues for me.. 40cm is pretty wide so I'd try a shorter stem and see what happens. PS as posted above, doing other strength work may help if you don't do that already (I go to the gym regularly so it was really just the stem in my case).

[@michaelconway8352]

I think you've answered your own question. Natural width should be 44. Your narrow set up is now overstretching the scapula which fatigues on longer rides and develops pain.

[@Tasha451308]

@@michaelconway8352 good to note thanks I've for years with shoulder/arm fatigue or neck pain and can't for the life of me figure it out but don't want to buy a new bike and have the same issues!

[@livibam]

Slam-bam-thank-you-mam!

[@SandSanta]

Not to be that guy but I watched the seat position video before this and there you said "if everything else is setup correctly, do this." Bit of a chicken and egg no?

[@Thebikewrench]

How about finding a good fitter, ask question. A good bike fitter will answer and explain why they are making changes/adjustments. Ride the position give the new changes time. Follow up with the fitter. No question is a bad question. Self fitting yourself is a mistake.

[@brunospasta]

Always the lowester possible and cut the fork.

[@stewbuds65]

I was riding a medium and i always got numb hands and I could not stand up straight after a long ride. I switched to a large and got a shorter stem and now all my problems are gone. The complete opposite of what he was just saying.

[@Blitzer00979]

Maybe the reach on the medium was too short? Did you try a longer stem?

[@royanderson3478]

30-40 mm max or bike is to large.

[@marvinkamei7007]

I notice all cyclist have this turtle neck posture!!

[@ОлегБулкин-о5л]

This bike was really easy to assemble kzbin.infoUgkxMesz3KOGEmwmvyKQfLfrRSUXLFzfVHZA and required very few adjustments out of the box. The wheels did not require any truing/adjustments. The frame had some small scratches, but nothing major.I did replace the seat though - the seat it came with was very uncomfortable. The tires need to be re-inflated every 4-5 days, but this appears to be quite common for the narrow 700x25 tires.Overall, in my opinion, this bike looks and rides like a much more expensive bike.

[@hugobrown2516]

if bars are too high, your weight will be on seat more. obviously.

[@Morten_B]

"if the bars are too high what you'll find is that you tend to prop more weight onto them" ... I've found excatly that on my aero road bike, and lowering my bars gave me less numb hands. But then for your gravel bike, should you have as low bars as on your roadbike? Or maybe if you go high enough you will stop pushing yourself up like this and again relax? So "half low" is worse than proper low or 'mtb-like' high? Reach also come into play somehow I guess?