The Problem With Wanda's Story in Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness | ScreenCrush Rewind

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Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness returned Wanda Maximoff to the bog screen, in all of her Scarlet Witch glory. But did the story in her return work, or did it squander all the careful character work in WandaVision?
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Featuring
Matt Singer: ( / mattsinger )
Adam Lance Garcia ( / adamlancegarcia )
Written and Hosted by Ryan Arey ( / ryanarey )
Edited by Harriet Lengel-Enright, Randolf Nombrado, and Ella Danyluk
#DrStrange #WandaMaximoff #ScarletWitch
0:00 Wanda's Story Was a Failure
16:40 Where Was Vision
22:28 No Big Monster Fight (Thank Goodness!)
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Now we’ve already made videos praising this movie. The visuals, the actions, the character arc-and the fun Raimi violence. But one part of the movie was very disappointing-the villain, Wanda Maximoff. I wasn’t cool with this, because it betrayed her arc in WandaVision, and her motivations were pretty dumb and inconsistent.
In other words, they did her dirty, and I’m going to explain why.
First, I gotta say-while I didn’t like how the movie portrayed Wanda, Elizabeth Olsen was great. She is fantastic in this role, and one of the best actors in the MCU. She brought it.
Now, leading into the movie, it was surprising how they were able to keep the villain a secret. From the trailers, you think they’re going to be fighting a monster, or an evil Stephen, and that maybe wanda heel turns toward the end. But the heel turn happened in her very first scene, and she only gets more ruthless from there.
The problem is, WandaVision did not leave this character in a place where she was ready to immediately turn evil. Well..they kind of did, but I’ll talk about that in a second.
Some fans have seized on this quote from Sam Raimi, where he admits that he hadn't seen all of WandaVision before making this movie-he only saw scenes that were key to her character.
Doug: Yes, so he would not have been aware of Wanda’s character arc.
I don’t think that’s fair. As a director, Raimi wouldn’t need to see every second of the show, just the parts that informed Elizabeth Olsen’s acting in this movie. But, screenwriter Michael Waldron, I’m sure, saw the show multiple times. Which make s it even more baffling that
Wanda’s character arc from the show is so severely undercut by the movie.
So let’s talk about WandaVison
The show is structured around the five stages of grief. There are specific episodes that deal with Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, and Acceptance.
Creating the hex was a form of denial, as she lived in a 50s fantasy world [clip]. Because frankly, 50s sitcoms were denying all of the world’s social ills. Anger was when Wanda decided to expel Monica, and how she threatened the Sword agents [clip]. Bargaining was the introduction of her brother Pietro, just after he fought with Vision Like maybe she can’t have her brother and her perfect life with Vision, but she can have a fake brother.
Depression is from the direct address episode [clip]. And acceptance is where she ends up, finally understanding that her fantasy is hurting others and she has to learn to let go of Vision and her boys [clip, saying goodbye to kids]. That is stellar writing. A mother having to sacrifice her kids for the good of others is the ultimate act of love. Which makes it even more frustrating that, in this movie, she is willing to sacrifice hundreds of lives to be with any version of her children.
That last episode of WandaVision gets dumped on by fans, but I loved it. We got the big action scene, Wamda realizing her destiny as a witch, and then doing the right thing. This is the most complex emotional arc we’ve ever seen in the MCU. Over about 7 or 8 hours, Wanda goes from being enveloped in her grief, to being a stronger person who is able to face reality. There are so many life lessons about grief in this show that are inspiring to people who have gone through loss.
And nine of this character journey is present in Multiverse of Madness. They took this nuanced character study and gave it the Game of Thrones season 8 treatment.
The dragon lady go bad because the screenplay says so. And in this movie, the witch lady go bad because the screenplay said so.

[@ScreenCrush]

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[@GrumpyJerk]

Wanda's got 99 problems but Dr Strange ain't one of them.

[@younganthony7084]

if u dont stop saying bad things about her story IT WONT BE WANDA WHOS COMING FOR U

[@GrumpyJerk]

@@younganthony7084 Do you need a Sneakers?

[@liltimeeh8512]

I don’t wanna say it because marvel but I’d imagine this would be a completely different movie if Sam raimi didn’t have to cut 40 minutes of the movie out

[@celondelon351]

@@GrumpyJerk I want this on a tshirt

[@TaylorFalk21]

I think they introduced her as a villain too early in the film. It would have been so much better if we thought for the first half that she was helping, just to have the big reveal be that she’s been playing them this whole time

[@wil6064]

Or maybe introduce another villain at first searching for America and then Wanda tries to help Strange FOR REAL but finds out that she could use America's power to search for her kids because the darkhold is making her believe that the children are in danger in some other universe. Being able to see her change her mind learning about America's powers would have been good for the plot.

[@jjstarrprod]

Exactly !

[@HybridVybz]

That would make sense if her being taken over b the dark holds wasnt built up in her show. A lot of people skipped Wanda vision and now they are confused and complaining

[@jjstarrprod]

@@wil6064 Yes, I was also thinking about that. Make her change gradual throughout the movie and show how the Darkhold was slowly but surely corrupting her through each use would have made for a much more coherent character switch. But that would also probably meant a 3 hours movie (which, to be honest, I wouldn't have any trouble with it, as long as the story is good)

[@caboseBvR]

that would have brought the level of convoluted to untold levels and would have made this such a shittier movie by doing so. Its barely so so as is.

[@chasenovak122]

I agree that Wanda’s writing in this movie could have been better; but god, the execution, from both Raimi and Elizabeth Olsen, was SO ON POINT! They really made her into a horror movie monster, the camerawork, the lighting, the acting!

[@sadieyegads]

Yes! So true. It was a great spectacle and the acting was amazing. I really loved Dr. Strange's arc of learning to let other people hold the knife. Wanda's motivation was a weak point in an otherwise great movie.

[@parabellum4622]

Stop, this wasn't supposed to be that kind of movie and you're crediting the wrong things... braindead because of a damn director what the hell is wrong with you.

[@parabellum4622]

@@sadieyegads What arc of learning, do you even know what you're talking about...

[@tejasmurali1656]

@@parabellum4622 Strange always is in control of the situation. In infinity war, in endgame, in his own movie, in Ragnarok. But here he sees other versions of himself who stuck to trusting very big decisions to only himself, illuminati strange using the darkhold to save the world from Thanos, dark strange losing his mind to the darkhold and possibly causing the end of his world, defender strange trying to sacrifice America. So strange at the end of the film nearns to trust others. That's why he gives America the final fight

[@davidalicea6007]

What more do u want she was perfect

[@GaiaPapaya]

That was my big issue with this movie. They kinda irredeemably make her evil with it. Yes it was all the Darkhold, but still, which hero would cooperate with her now, after she killed so many people? She's gone from the good side now. And I will still always love her because there IS good in her, she's just too mentally fragile to handle the amount of power she has. But I agree with the Daenerys comparison - this just went too quickly.

[@KillingMachine56656]

not really. If loki can be "good" and redeemed after all the shit he's done out of his own god dam free will I'm pretty sure Wanda that was being corrupted by a book can as well lol

[@divin3nightmar339]

@@KillingMachine56656 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@Bettervibesforever]

@@KillingMachine56656 at the same time though we haven’t seen loki slaughter mainstream characters from the comics that are actually a lot more tactical and powerful. Kinda made it way too plot based

[@kyliebaker4986]

She was always evil in the original comics. It was only a matter of time that MCU showed that side of her. I actually like the way they did it. And if you have lost everything that Wanda went through and lost, I’m sure it would change you too

[@Bettervibesforever]

@@kyliebaker4986 a lot of people have lost more than Wanda myself included and I didn’t kill 6 people 💀💀. Whole comments invalid. Our past doesn’t define us and our mistakes don’t, it’s how we react that’s what defines us. Also, in the original comics Wanda wasn’t evil she questioned magneto constantly

[@Mighty-VizioN]

When the boys were screaming "mom please help!!" at the end of wandavision. The villain at that point in time was actually Wanda herself. And the scene was played out when the Scarlet witch attacked Wanda, and was going for the kids. So the mom they were asking for was the Wanda from the multiverse and not the Scarlet witch from our universe. And thats whenshe finally realized she was the monster in the entire story

[@Behrens2001]

That’s actually such a good theory !

[@sadhanavijay636]

Damn I did not think of that 👀

[@Littlescienceguy]

Excellent point! I didn’t even think of it that way.

[@liamjaezzemangubat191]

Exactly and how on earth these 3 dont know about it.

[@toddfluhr4655]

That was exactly how I interpreted it

[@alexprado3704]

I think when she hears her kids call out to her for help she’s actually hearing the FUTURE, she’s hearing her kids cry out for help to their mom Wanda being scared of the Scarlet Witch after America sends her to their reality

[@stevef6870]

You have to tell people everything nowadays smh

[@vedantpanse3620]

That's a smart explanation

[@pranshul131]

Forgot about that.But again that should've been implied in the movie. Whenever there was a chance for Wanda to tell what's the motivation of her to do all this it was always "I just want ny kids back" The problem is not the movie doesn't make sense but the whole corruption happens off screen. She was a villain in WV but she was never this evil until Darkhold corrupted her. And even a 3-4 min in starting to show this and her motivation would've been way better.

[@heyyou193]

I dont think the screams match, but would have been interesting!

[@MichelleL98]

I thought that was the beginning of the datkhold corrupting her.

[@luiegiii]

“What is grief but love persevering” is the best line in the whole MCU and something I might remember forever. It’s too good.

[@upthescorelive9981]

TOO GOT DAMN GOOD MAN this movie delivered some of the best one liners

[@sjzafrani]

I love you 3000.

[@jaym8988]

Ya'll don't think you're overrating this quote?

[@nova547]

Can someone explain to me what this line means ?

[@mindlandscape5767]

I cried

[@eddie1793]

I think they had a chance to include the new Vision and make it even more of a divide for Wanda. That Vision didn't experience their kids, and Vision is very logical. He could've taken Strange's side about the children not being real, and that could have severed the Wanda and Vision relationship- confirming that White Vision can't be what Vision was to her and making her feel even more isolated.

[@rhiannongreen2642]

Agreed! It would have been brutal but that's comic accurate, White Vision rejects Wanda after his resurrection.

[@xbloodkiss.]

Eddie... go write movies

[@benjaminjackboot6409]

Then bring Hawkeye trying to calm her down… just so she can kill him and take it as a “What have I done? moment” and officially get released from Darkhold's influence.

[@kidkatanatv]

@@benjaminjackboot6409 HISHE's Doctor Strange and The MoM video made a joke about this

[@spacecadet9852]

This was my interpretation. Wanda created the hex to deal with her grief for Vision. By the end of Wandavision she dealt with her grief and sacrificed everything she had made again. The kids, however, were an unfortunate casualty in that whole situation. She brought Billy and Tommy into existence, and she had to take them out. The guilt a mother must feel for essentially killing her sons must've been so easy for the Darkhold to manipulate. All it had to do was plant the idea in Wanda's head that those kids that she made weren't gone, but transported into another universe. Of course deep down she knew they were gone, but she couldn't accept that.

[@existingintensifies]

I agree with the video and wanted to share what I thought of: At the end of WandaVision, Wanda hears her kids calling for help. Wanda, using the Darkhold to try and get to them finds out she can't and needs America Chavez's power. At first, Wanda doesn't want to steal Chavez's powers, she just asks Chavez to help her get to her kids. Chavez can't control her power willingly and because of that maybe they seek Dr. Strange for some assistance. However, this is taking too long as Wanda is constantly being taunted by the Darkhold of voices of her boys suffering in a different universe. After some arguments and corruption, Wanda resorts to taking Chavez's powers to save her kids herself and thus the conflict begins. I think this justifies her actions more because in the Universe where her kids are suffering, the Wanda of that universe wasn't strong enough to protect them and thus they suffered. This would make our Wanda more driven to take the kids herself.

[@seanwarner9893]

Love this.. To combine this with another comment, once she finally makes it there she realizes that she was the one scaring her kids all along and she could never be a part of their lives.

[@topnetworkersgroup]

@@seanwarner9893 that is what I felt too. The cries for help were the kids seeing "the witch" ... they wanted saving From Wanda

[@247sikvideo]

At the end of wandavision… the scarlet witch was discovered… Wanda had gone through and faced her grief… as the scarlet witch however, she’s basically just beginning… esp after being taken over by the darkhold… this seemed more of a redemption movie for the scarlet witch. Also 616 Dr strange had to go through what he went thru in no way home to understand that killing America was not the way for the scarlet witch to experience “redemption”

[@coffiebreak2236]

@@seanwarner9893 yeah but that infers time travel and looking in the future, which wouldn't make sense. I think it should be she saves them when they're actual mom couldn't and she learns that she needs to let go of her past to care for their future. But for the audience the sympisize more you'd have ro turn down her malice...

[@Kait2478]

this would be a big improvement on the current plot

[@osz.winkelmann]

It seems to me that Darkhold acts like a drug and when you start using it you end up forgetting why you started using it. Wanda may have started by listening to her children's cry for help, but during her dream walks she doesn't discover the source of the danger that afflicts them and ends up just wanting them back. She doesn't know that the Vision has regained his memories and the Darkhold, perhaps, completely isolates her from contacts with other people that can pull her out of the mental confusion she finds herself in. She is alone and only the sight of terror reflected in her 'children's' eyes, and not the speech of strangers about the morality and ethics of her actions, could bring her to reality. It takes an inner perception to change our perspective of what is right and wrong. Only the decision of the addict, realizing how drugs have changed him, can make him decide to give up on them.

[@BiologyIsHot]

The problem is that the Darkhold is like an afterthought to an extent in the plot. Keep in mind that MoM is the shortest film of this phase so far. Black Widow and Shang Chi both had longer runtimes.

[@topnetworkersgroup]

exactly; and the movie talks about how the darkhold was corrupting Dr. Strange too; People who watched Agents of Shield know how bad that book is; how dangerous it is;

[@michaelneenan4983]

Funny you use a drug analogy, cause I personally felt maybe it was a metaphor for social media. How when we see what other people have and give in to that jealousy we can go a little crazy… she went big time crazy but you get what I mean😂

[@Oskrrrrt]

This is how I feel too. Like the addict metaphor, the darkhold got her in a very vulnerable time and took hold of her. I think with that kinda context, it makes the ending of WandaVision more tragic in hindsight. She never really healed and the ending was more ominous than anything. In terms of her character arch after MoM, I think we have more to see between Wanda, her kids, and Vision.

[@lmtlsak1829]

@@topnetworkersgroup yeah the darkhold corrupted a robot.

[@mitchmorrison791]

I thought the "mom, please help" she heard at the end of WV was the same one when Scarlett Witch showed up in their living room (MoM). I just thought it was the dark hold messing around... she ended up being the thing that scared her kids. Like a self fulfilled prophecy.

[@brihannabrown5024]

i totally agree with this

[@synth3662]

if they made her intentions saving her children, this theory would make it understandable while strange tells her its not true while she goes crazy and her crazy actions/risk causes the boys to scream for help, now that would make the movie better except they made her intentions more "i want" then a "i need to save". this movie kinda just fell flat with that theory having no support with her character intentions thats why her character felt lack of empathetic cause her reasons are basically selfish

[@jamangel]

Oh....

[@DaudRotama]

The way people go through gymnastics just to defend Wanda's broken characterization in the comment section, I can't. For those who correctly call out Michael Waldron's bullshit, thank you. All it needed was simply an extended intro about what happened with Wanda after she heard her kids calling out for her help. What made her summon some demons to get America Chavez? How did she even know about America? Make Wanda actually complex. Don't turn her to be a supervillain WITHOUT respecting her lore a.k.a. Chthon the elder god. If she's corrupted by Chthon, then show it. Show the corruption! Show her initial resistance against the evil influence while actually doing what Chthon wants her to do anyway. Show, don't make Wong and everybody else tell us "Chthon bad, Darkhold bad, etc." SHOW!

[@aleck1739]

Yes thank you - the writing in this movie was such crap. Waldron is a hack - he’s super lucky Raimi saved this movie. A kindergartner could have wrote a better plot and it makes me sad cause I thought he was better than this. I had a lot of rise of skywalker vibes with this plot.

[@aresmurphy436]

@@aleck1739 Is Sam Raimi also responsible on the fight scenes or he’s just there to direct what the actors are supposed to do during fight scenes? The fight scenes are so.. fast? There’s not really much of a memorable fight scene that showed both Scarlet Witch and Doctor Strange powers.

[@aleck1739]

@@aresmurphy436 agree maybe I’m not critical enough of Raimi.

[@MrJackfaire]

You call it gymnastics I call it not needing my handheld. Dr. Strange 838, Sinister Strange, Wanda and Agatha all had the corruption from the Darkhold visible on their hands. I didn't need a movie prior to this one to show me that the Darkhold she was reading through in the end of Wandavision was going to corrupt her. We already knew it was a corrupting influence from Wandavision.

[@blitzer9981]

@@MrJackfaire And what about the people that haven’t/are unable to see WandaVision? Not everyone has a Disney+ account or the means to watch it elsewhere, or perhaps they just want to stick with the films as it’s more their preference. We might know about how screwy the Darkhold is because of Agnes in WandaVision, but the average viewer won’t, and they shouldn’t be punished for not having seen a tv series that, frankly, wasn’t advertised as important to this one. Sure, Wanda is in the film, but this is a Doctor Strange movie, Wanda/Scarlet Witch isn’t anywhere in the title, the only movie the average viewer should be concerned about is the first Doctor Strange movie. For instance, let’s take Spider-Man No Way Home. Doctor Strange is in the movie, he’s very important to the movie, but aside from his presence in Infinity War/End Game, you don’t need his backstory to enjoy him. All you need to know is that he’s a super powerful mage that Peter knows and asks for help. How does he know him? Oh, they saved the world together, as they bring up in the movie, no more context needed. Context may help their interactions be more meaningful, but it’s not necessary to understand either of them. Now take Wanda and the Darkhold. The last time we saw her was in Endgame, after she was very much grieving for Vision, she was still squarely on the good guys side of things. All we know of Wanda are from the films she’s appeared in, which clearly show that while she does struggle to control her powers and occasionally hurts others, she’s never intentionally tried to kill anyone beyond her stint as a bad guy being manipulated by Ultron (and even then it was only the avengers whom she blamed for her parents death, she didn’t go on mass killing sprees to achieve her goal). Cut to here, where she is ready to kill everyone who gets in her way to get a little girl who’s crime is… nothing. She’s trying to steal her power to find her kids…. When did Wanda have kids? Why not just ask the girl to take her to them? Wanda’s never been power hungry or unsympathetic, so why is she going power mad? Oh it’s the Darkhold’s fault, it’s corrupting her and twisting her desires. Great, where did she get that book? Why is it taking over her so quickly? Why is she so willing to go this far for kids we’ve never met prior to now. Has she stopped caring about Vision? It doesn’t work, not without context. They try to explain some things but they barely touch on anything that happened in WandaVision, and that’s somehow the viewers fault when it wasn’t even noted to be important to the movie? Most of the trailers I saw only have her mentioning Vision’s theories on the multiverse and a brief mention of the Westview incident, nothing on the kids, nothing on the Darkhold or Agnes. While those of us who have seen WandaVision can make justifications for her actions (which I still think needed further exploring, at least show her struggling to justify her actions to herself or some hesitancy), everyone else who hasn’t seen it can’t, all they can see is Wanda suddenly deciding murder is a good hobby and rolling with it.

[@joevarner9447]

The nerds are missing out on the fact here that while Vision has his memories back, he (as per comics) doesn't have his EMOTIONS. He has all the data, none of the feelings. It would have been nice to have Strange go find him, only for him to reject helping because he doesn't have any emotional attachment to her at this time.

[@wiinterflowers4277]

I'm a nerd and I don't buy White Vision as the real Vision!

[@Lemon_Push]

@@wiinterflowers4277 all the duse lacks are emotions and the mind stone

[@Wankirby]

for the very last part that Adam said he couldn’t understand, i think it was the fact that her own kids were scared of her and actively trying to get away from her is what clicked in her mind that maybe she’s gone too far. nothing else mattered but the kids. so when the kids shunned her she broke

[@v.t.3064]

That’s what I wanted to say.

[@MrJackfaire]

Exactly they were the only people in the multiverse that could truly break through the fog in her mind to make her see herself as she really was.

[@MatthewChowns]

It also would have been nice if WandaVision emphasized her starting to doubt reality a little more. Like you said, she is supposed to start questioning what is real, since her powers can unconciously create anything she wants or even make others do or say anything she wants. There were parts where people started breaking character and asking if she wants to do a retake, but Wanda blew it off too easily. Vision was questioning it, but it should have been Wanda, with Vision or someone else who was under the spell pull her back to the illusion.

[@tkm1875]

Wanda IS NOT a thinker, lol. She leads with her emotions, so why should she ponder anything? This woman caused global genocide in the comics because she couldn't have her way, lol. Wanda is a messy, irrational character and the MCU reflected that.

[@blancavelasquez9859]

@@tkm1875 we need MORE, loved her in the movie

[@ewokpants4891]

Here's a question, HOW did she even know about Chavez?! Is Chavez in the Darkhold? IF so why? how? The movie just starts off with her hunting this girl across a multiverse she can influence only tangentially despite having reality warping powers.

[@RK-ck6pl]

She could see across the multi verse. It was pretty well explained. She was looking for them by using the book. And if your next question is why is she evil now? Again the f****** book. It was all explained. This is a kid's movie it's not that hard to understand just put your laundry down and pay attention ppl.

[@floresscecil]

Use your ability to inference. I’m sure as she was exploring the Darkhold…she felt the presence of Chavez jumping through the “nexus point.”

[@tonybs03]

if you pay more attention, the book of Vishanti has a star in the page.. meaning Chavez must have some sort of connections with Cthon

[@flygandejacob]

Isn't america a nexus being? They are Kinda immune to reality warping

[@ShatteredGlass916]

The whole thing would have been better if we actually see Wanda's descent into madness and become more obsessed about the book and by extension her quest to find her 'children'. What we got instead is an already mad and determined Wanda who will stopped at nothing to get her hand on Chavez. Which personally should be in the middle of the film. Wanda (while still studying the Darkhold) probably still able to resist the book, but accidently travels alongside with both Chavez ans Strange into the Illuminati universe while they have a small chat. Here, she's separated from Strange and Chavez. While Strange and Chavez got captured, Wanda could look out of her own version in this universe. Surprise surprise, she was denied by both herself and the children (i mean, they're not her children so duh). This immediately upsets Wanda so much, she's willing to accept the Darkhold completely. Darkhold on the other hand (Wanda have it on her waist or somthing), took the chance and 'completes' Wanda into a full-fledged Scarlet Witch. And the bloodbath begins

[@aubreyricher9827]

This was my thought too, I feel like the writers wanted the reveal of Wanda being the main Villain was prioritized to how she got there.. maybe now that it's out there.....I wonder if a secret short on Disney + that chronicles this time in between would be in the works, or thought about now.

[@SallyWilliams]

yes, but this was a DOCTOR STRANGE movie, so there wasn't time for a long intro. And the Darkhold was already introduced in Agents of Shield, which is almost forgotten. I got it about the Darkhold and the otherworldly influences

[@paperfigure9438]

@@SallyWilliams agents of shield isn't canon, wanda vision did establish that the darkhold corrupts those who use it

[@dominiquejones3805]

I thought WandaVision ended abruptly, maybe 1 or 2 more episodes

[@DriftingDCal]

Wanda was a brilliant villain. The movie failed to accurately or even remotely visually depict how the Darkhold had corrupted her. Had that been conveyed visually versus as a toss away exposition most audiences would have accepted her turn to a villain much more. I think Marvel should have shown this when Professor X entered her mind. The Astral Dimension would have been a perfect way to show the corruption the Darkhold was having on Wanda and even showcase her attempting to fight its evil influence.

[@Black2bProud]

Absolutely agree with your point here , I honestly felt like that scene with her and Professor X was missing something , I think that part would have been the perfect time for us to see how the dark hold is corrupting her thoughts similar to when Prof X used his telekinesis to reason with Jean Grey before she became the Phoenix .

[@user-cg3vr1dd2q]

Literally an extra 15 minutes of this would have been excellenttt. I still enjoyed it tho

[@DriftingDCal]

@@user-cg3vr1dd2q I enjoyed it too! Definitely think it would be been a great addition to the scene though! Hopefully it's in the extended cut!

[@MrJackfaire]

Visually? You mean like darkening the fingertips of every single person corrupted by the Darkhold and doing close shots of those hands to make it clear it's the same kind of corruption? Good idea.

[@DriftingDCal]

@@MrJackfaire I mean actually showing it’s influence when Professor X is within her mind. But sure be sassy 😂

[@TotalTennisGeek]

I believe what you guys are missing is that 1) Vision convinced her that she MUST let go of him and 2) therefore the kids are her only physical and existent connection to the love they shared. Also, Wanda dreamed the kids, even in Wandavision, which means the kids already existed in other universes and she manifested them in her version of reality in Wandavision.

[@vance2020]

Great point she dreamed them even before the Darkhold. And what we think people who have mental illness breakthroughs never backslide? This video misses the history (especially repeatedly on Agents of SHIELD) that the very purpose of the Darkhold is to remove agency and to seduce and deceive anyone who reads it. This was further shown by Agatha's family uniting to kill her and the end scene where Wanda is compulsively using the Darkhold instead of sleeping until hearing deceptive and tempting voices) and her fingers and Agatha's fingers and variant Strange's. The reason the Darkhold used her kids as temptation instead of Vision is simply because most versions of him would sacrifice himself and advise her to stop and using the kids was enough to tempt to evil and it was working. The reason Chthon did not appear is he needed Wanda to become even more seduced to summon him and instead America snapped her out of it resulting in the Darkhold's destruction.

[@leeperez6691]

Marvel’s challenge has always been writing villains. Mostly giving them hollow motives which mainly fuel the protagonist’s journey. Despite Wanda being a hero in the past or having any personal growth, here she “needed” to become evil immediately to serve as a tool for Strange’s journey and further setup the big idea of the multiverse.

[@floresscecil]

I understand your opinion but I believe it to be faulty. Most of Marvel’s villains reasons for evil are usually simple & straightforward. They’re never complex because evil is easy. A lot of them suffer from obsessive thoughts & they wait to strike. It makes sense if you humanize the villains instead of seeing them as “fantastical” heroes.

[@floresscecil]

Their reason for evil is usually rooted in a specific hurts that slowly eats at them & forces them to a point of desperation. Try seeing them as desperate people who feel powerless.

[@saltycerealTTV]

I really hated her motives, but to be honest I came out the theatre thinking wanda CARRIED this movie. Literally every scene she was in was the best scenes. I feel like most of the other scenes were kinda boring and pretty dead. For me, the best scene was the chase scene under the river. Liz did an amazing job at acting as wanda and the story ruined it

[@upthescorelive9981]

Bodies this movie, she’s up there with dafoe for me

[@bluiii]

I see what you did there “Carrie”

[@ikeeditz2012]

@@kjh4112 EXACTLY

[@ChrisxStyleZ]

that was such a creepy scene

[@Batman1998-]

@@upthescorelive9981 up there with dafoe? The delusion In that comment

[@jonathanm5894]

Agreed on Vision. Story doesn’t work with him, but you don’t get to pretend key characters don’t exist to solve that kind of challenge.

[@BrokeredHeart]

I was so disappointed with the ending of Wanda's arc. Yes, she was a boss villain, Elizabeth Olsen played it so well, and I could see how they were leading into that for this film, but they put it in the first act, instead of hanging onto it for the second or third, when that progression made more sense. Considering the great lengths they went to making her a sympathetic character in Wandavision, they abandoned it pretty quickly to make her the antagonist of this film by using the Darkhold as the catalyst for her corruption, but all of that takes place after Wandavision ends, and before Multiverse of Madness begins. The storyline they were trying to emphasize was how love for family can transcend alternate universes, that your true soulmate will find you in any universe, and that was the driving force for all three of the main characters: Dr Strange is obviously devastated that he missed his chance with Christine Palmer, but you can see she is involved in his life in other universes; also they mention Strange's reason for pursuing medicine and always wanting to have control - the death of his sister which he still feels guilty for; then there's America Chavez who is startled into realizing her power, and her fear not only flings her out of her own reality, but it also sucks her parents into the multiverse as well, and she's now on a mad hunt to try and find them to bring them home, as she discovers there are no alternate versions of her mothers in the multiverse; and Wanda, who had an entire separate show explaining her grief over losing her parents, her brother, her home country, the love of her life (three times!), and now her two boys, is desperate to try and find them to become a happy family again. But there's an obvious dissonance here, because instead of Wanda seeing America's own plight to rediscover her parents and empathizing with her, she's not only willing to kill America to absorb her ability to star punch into other realities, she's willing to collapse ALL realities into one another in order to keep her children which makes ZERO sense. How can she keep her boys alive if all of reality keeps folding together in multiple incursions? I wish they could have held off on revealing Wanda as the "big baddie" until after some relationship had been established with Strange and America. They could have come to Wanda looking for help in trying to get America back to her universe and explained how her mothers were sucked into that interdimensional portal, separating them from one another - something I know Wanda would empathize with. She tells them of the Darkhold, Wong could warn them of the dangers of using those spells, they ignore him and decide to use the spellbook anyway, and once they discover Earth 838, and Wanda sees her perfect family version there, she is determined to keep that reality for herself, which draws the attention of the Illuminati, and they try to trap all three of them to prevent another incursion. Wanda escapes, kills their heroes (far more impactful in this version because it would be far less expected by the audience), and realizes that even in this reality, her one shot at happiness could be taken from her by any number of external threats, which is when she (under the influence of the Darkhold) decides to harness America's power to safeguard her boys in every conceivable universe. And all of this could have been done in roughly the same run time, and had the same ultimate result of Dr Strange using another version of the Darkhold to combat Wanda and save America from her. They wouldn't have needed to throw Vision in there either, because frankly, if he had been included, there's a good chance his presence and rationality would have prevented Wanda from becoming the Scarlett Witch. But we didn't get that kind of movie, we got an irrational woman with unfathomable power going on a rampage to steal her children from other versions of herself, ignoring all the collateral damage in her wake, despite seeing her remorse and guilt in the aftermath of Westview. It doesn't work, and that's why this movie is such a flub for me. Stunning visuals, great character actors, lots of avenues for them to continue exploring the multiverse idea, but without a compelling villain at the heart of it all, the movie just feels like a letdown.

[@jjstarrprod]

Damn, that's quite the alternate scenario ! Well done !

[@agafigna9117]

Yes, that's a much better version than the movie.

[@kmrskates]

Honestly, having her introduced as an unexpected villain so early was refreshing! I was trying to figure out where the story would go because of that. Even better, Strange gave Wanda a green light to kidnap America without realizing it. The events after realizing she was the villain became this fascinating recent against the clock and conflict with a supposed ally. The movie felt pretty dynamic with how it played out.

[@geavonm.6882]

i’m not reading all that

[@kishabrown9977]

@@geavonm.6882 Read more read 📚 more!!

[@lollies91]

Thank you so much for this video! I agree with everything you say. It's disheartening that so many people fail to see how badly Wanda and WandaVision have been let down.

[@MrJackfaire]

This movie was exactly what I expected after Wandavision. She kept the Darkhold and was using it. I fully expected it to corrupt her like it had Agatha.

[@Byronic19134]

@@MrJackfaire Exactly like I am so confused as to why people are confused. The end of WV she turned into the Scarlet Witch. Agatha warns her, and yet people somehow thought it was going to be all peachy.

[@hannahdaly9774]

I think we needed a prelude to show how she’s been corrupted, and to give her more nuance. I agree with everything you have said in the video 🙌🏻

[@ken5040]

So wandavision never happened in your universe?

[@hannahdaly9774]

@@ken5040 it didn’t show enough, the show left her beginning to use the dark hold, not giving us enough to see it’s influence.

[@RK-ck6pl]

It was in the show. People just aren't very perceptive.

[@jacobsampsonis7782]

@@hannahdaly9774 that IS literally all we need to know. She has a book of infinitely evil dark power where she was told its her destiny to destroy our rule the world. You people are just legit simpletons if you need any more context than that...

[@JohnDowson100]

I agree it would massively help showing the corruption take hold. Hints are there true, but they have not enough narrative weight to justify the unlearning of the lesson from WV.

[@40ozAk]

She spent WandaVision grieving over Viz, but at the end she lost the kids... The loss of the kids and the Darkhold's corruption was enough to push her to extremes. Made sense to me.

[@jeremiahramirez8915]

She never had kids she made them up and enslaved a whole town of people because of her grief and never got told off for it, in fact she was thanked at the end because "they will never know what you had to sacrifice for them".

[@40ozAk]

@@jeremiahramirez8915 she "had" them. Hell, she even gave birth to them, even though they weren't "real". They exist still in the other realities, so they are real in the fiction. You make a great point that she never had to pay for what she did to Westview. Unpunished she then went on her crusade to 'get them back'.

[@Spidervenom23]

@@jeremiahramirez8915 for the last time, The Kids are real just like Monica's Clothes in episode 3 were real.

[@bgcm1995]

I felt like there was so much missing from the movie idk how to feel about it

[@scarletbtch7069]

@@jeremiahramirez8915 Doesn't matter they were still *kids* She released the town at the end and she didn't cause the hex she just rolled with it. She went into self exile and isolated herself from everyone else anyone who's been through quarantine knows how that feels. "They will never know what u sacrificed for them" she watched her family break down molecule by molecule in front of her eyes especially us the viewers who watched her character growth from episode one with vision and later her kids I was very upset. Perhaps actually watch the series instead of watching clips on KZbin and reading discussion threads. Thank god I'm antisocial alot of people would p*ss me off.

[@Kiki-xd3sn]

Ending it on Adam's confusion is a bit weird. The thing that makes that moment Wanda's a-ha is that her kids are petrified of her. They for the first time see the Scarlett witch - not the Mother, and she's able to see herself through them, probably realising that this version of her could never be a good mother to them.

[@RottenAppleBoBA]

And then the mother version of Wanda forgives her. So she ends up forgiving herself.

[@DrecoSupply]

13:20 Marvel should have taken the end of Wanda Vision and added it into M.O.M. During the scene where the star portal opens and she finds her sons in another universe and tries to take them. she should hear her kids say “mom, please help.” Like they did at the end of Wanda Vision. And frame it as if the kids were crying for their mother (Wanda) from their universe that M.O.M Wanda threw across the room. It would have been a perfect opportunity for continuity. It seems like if they did have a plan, that would be the easiest way to make the story full circle. The kids she heard while looking for them in the darkhold were the ones she was trying to steal from her other self in M.O.M.

[@Byronic19134]

Listening to that guy talk made me dumb. Yes as the Scarlett Witch, she heard her kids screaming for help, and we jump to MOM where the story continues. He says it cancels out, like how when the story is about the Scarlet Witch dream-walking to find her kids?

[@DrecoSupply]

@@Byronic19134 I edited the comment. Try to re-read it and see if my proposition makes sense.

[@juand.g.2602]

The arc wasn't changed or forgotten. It followed the last scene in WandaVision. The darkhold tricked her by using her kids asking for help, same as The Mandarin was manipulated with his wife's voice in Shang Chi. Yes, she could have dedicated to find her kids rather than kidnapping them but she was influenced by the darkhold and she didn't see the difference between kidanpping and finding her kids. She realizes that once her kids see her and become completely afraid of her. Now Strange doesn't need the physical book, he remembered it when he read it to dreamwalk.

[@FireJach]

No. You are a theorist here

[@lotariosarsi4635]

Don't you see that? We are stepping from a character with and a psychological, deep and meaningful arc of grief and redemption to "she's bad 'cause book bad" and accepting that flatness. Even if we could all agree that's a fair justification we also have to admit that it still sucks.

[@FireJach]

It wasn't mentioned to safe the kids in the movie

[@jordancrass4527]

@@FireJach what? That's the entire movie plot. Wanda wants to get America to steal her powers. She literally says in the movie she's going to steal them incase anything goes wrong and the kids get sick/something happens.

[@BigPurp9]

Personally after watching Wandavision it made me reflect on how Wanda’s probably the character who’s lost the most and been through the most pain and trauma in the mcu, so if anyone was going to “snap” it’d be her. Plus I think after a world she created herself, a completely real physical version of her boys out there somewhere for her would be big enough temptation for her to act illogically again imo

[@Dave483am]

Wanda has a history in the comics of going back and forth between good and bad and the darkhold was driving her down that path.

[@thatomanaka323]

Exactly

[@Fargoth_Ur]

She started out as a bad guy for like, two issues of X-Men, and then was a straight-up hero for a good 30 solid years of Avengers comics. Until Brian Michael Bendis came along and used her as a plot device to destroy the then-current roster so he could fill the Avengers with his favorite characters. This "history of going back and forth between good and bad" is a fairly modern contrivance of the character.

[@davescrams]

I'm not sure that everything that works in comics also works in film. They're very different media with different cadences and different built-in conceits.

[@negatron5514]

These people are fake fans. they just created the channel because the mcu is getting attention. they've been releasing stupid ass contents a lot recently.

[@negatron5514]

@@davescrams well that's her arc. and people should know that. If you guys don't notice, her arc is that she's broken. She lost her parents, she lost her brother, she lost vision, and now she's looking for her kids. She's a good person, but very unstable and been longing for love. That's her entire story arc unlike Tony who's been cocky and learned, or Capt who's always been good. It's a good balance that they introduce different type of characters. Not everyone in this world is perfect, and so is in the comics.

[@ErolMazharAksoy]

7:05 actually Dark Powers corrupting and deceiving is a oldest trick in the box, and we saw same thing happen with Shang-Chi's father. He was hearing "his wife" from far away through miles far from magical village and behind giant door. And dont forget absolute power corrupts absolutely. Mandarin with 10 rings achieved is extremely little compared to what can SWitch can do with direct contact with Darkhold itself. So how Mandarin keep his calm and ideas straight but turned to Dark Side for revenge and yearning without revealing great evil side, same could apply to Scarlet Witch too. She wasnt herself at all since she hold the book. Same can be said for Strange now too also... Thats how great evil works one little whisper and one small fake hope and you find yourself crusading on innocents.

[@joeftan]

Perhaps they could’ve used a Wanda from a different dimension as the supervillain. One who had slightly different experiences, who could more believably be so evil.

[@justingoers]

I think it worked...it just needed like 10-15 more minutes to really sell you on the idea that the Darkhold was steering her decision making.

[@Cyrus-rodn45]

It did not

[@thatomanaka323]

I think it also worked

[@shinkounova8485]

"It just needed..." Bruh, you literally just admitted it didn't work.

[@BH-jy3bc]

Agreed it definitely needed a little more time

[@sbm969]

It did work! It was explicitly mentioned that the book greatly affects those who use it…people just need to put two and two together

[@Moshuun]

Idk how people are missing that in WandaVision, she went thru all of that & she had to accept that he fake world wouldn't last. That *LED* to her looking for/finding a way to get REAL versions of her kids. She didn't learn *ANYTHING* in WV, she's grieving. That doesn't go away because Vision is poetic. Combined with the DarkHold manipulating her emotions, it all turned into what happened in Ds-MoM.

[@nickstanton6021]

Thank you, this guy is just disappointed his expectations were wrong

[@to_ru_kw]

Also, I get it’s a movie but people in real life are in the same way unpredictable! Plus she’s being influenced by an evil book to justify her poor judgment.

[@Max-my6rk]

exactly... why people just do not understand.. Wanda is not a saint.. gosh

[@jaredlewis3001]

See I enjoyed the movie for what it is sure not everything was the best it could but it made for a good movie like come on her actions showed she was a major threat.

[@char170]

This!!!!

[@aaronjerome5084]

I am glad some else brought this up. I was completely disappointed that Wanda was made the villain. The whole WandaVison show was made irrelevant for anything other then a way for Wanda to get the Darkhold. I definitely felt that more emphasis that the darkhold was the controlling/corrupting factor would have been helpful.

[@grantmcroberts4089]

No it didn't her having the darkhold in wandavision wasn't made irrelevant because soon as you read that book you get corrupted

[@Relugus]

@@grantmcroberts4089 It's also written by Chthon, who is the source of Wanda's chaos magic. Chthon is obsessed with Wanda. Raimi and Waldron seem to know very little about Chthon.

[@KittyKraftStudio]

The whole point of Wandavision was to show how much damage she could do without even realizing she was causing it. She also found out she didn't understand her magic, which is why she read the book, which made things much worse because she realized by reading the dreamwalking bits that the kids were real in other universes and not just made up by her spell like she thought they were. Between that and the chaos magic she can't fully control because of her mental state, it was a disaster waiting to happen.

[@emperornapoleon6204]

I think the fact that we can reasonably assume Chthon was behind it all (through the Dark Hold’s influence) is good explanation, but it probably would have been best for this to be given a more direct nod by Strange or a scene with Wanda in a Dark Hold-influenced trance. I will say that the climactic scene where she comes to terms with the monster she had become was more powerful precisely because the boys had their real mother to turn to, to CHOOSE over her. I don’t think we could have had the same powerful scene without that, so the “kidnapping” plot device actually works, in my opinion.

[@MrJackfaire]

I think if they had been more clear and handholdy then people like this critic would condemn the movie for that.

[@emilyk5168]

I think they just needed ONE scene where Wong talks about the Darkhold, as the former Librarian of Kamar Taj, and what it does to someone who uses it. It would explain things and give us more Wong. Win-win. My understanding of the lack of the Vision was that Elizabeth Olsen felt she had mourned Vision in "WandaVision" and she didn't want to rehash that. Instead focusing on the kids. It could've been interesting if they explored the "Thanks for choosing me to be your Mom" line a bit more. Maybe they could have her think that specific set of twins had chosen her, not the other Wanda? I would LOVE to know what the original story was (when MoM was set to come out before WandaVision and No Way Home and Scott Derickson was still the director). I imagine she wasn't the villain then but it was still setting her up for becoming one?

[@shep1582]

Yes, yes I needed that Wong scene & didn't get her turn. Would have made more sense to me. Great take by you'

[@xspacedude]

It’s really thrown in our faces several times how the darkhold corrupts people, the illuminati killed their dr strange for it, then strange goes to a universe where his variant is alone in a dead world completely corrupted by the darkhold and all alone.

[@mholzer1]

I completely agree with the second paragraph and I think you put it perfectly. My first thought was she purposely didn’t go to universes that had Vision because she was knew Vision would fight back and she didn’t want to do that again, but you nailed it

[@elmerayala5366]

Are the movie watchers really that stupid that they have to be spoon fed every bit of information possible god damn , didn’t know people had a problem with Wanda until my friend told me

[@TruthTheChamp]

I dont get what is confusing. Its reiterated.. the Dark hold is causing her to lose reason and to use unnatural means to achieve the emotional healing that is her kids

[@NORKonline]

What I felt lacked the most for Wanda story wise was the inner conflict of what she was doing. When she faces her kids and immediately turns around, it feels very abrupt and out of the blue. So to me, it was extremely unsatisfying. Small moments of her reflecting I think even would've helped. Like for example, if she'd spent a moment thinking about [redacted's] kids after what she did, but ultimately shook it off as a small sacrifice for her to have her kids back, it would've felt far more satisfying (personally, at least). For connecting WandaVision and MoM, I think all it really needed was maybe Wong or someone talking about how the Darkhold is parasitic and infects a person. It would've tied the ending of WandaVision looking through the Darkhold to how in MoM it was feeding off of and playing into her grief over losing her kids.

[@CaylasCapsule]

Agree! It could just be her hesitating every once in a while, and then the Darkhold egging her on using the voices of her kids.

[@shootthecaptn4666]

I kind of agree. My biggest issue with the film was how rushed the beggining was. I felt that this movie would've been a lot better if we had a Scarlet Witch solo film that picked up after the end credits of WandaVison, talked about her orgin more, the darkhold etc then it could've had a post credit scene introducing America Chavez and seting up MoM. The start of MoM was way too rushed christine's wedding was so pointless and did nothing for the plot, they introduce this new character and then tell us wanda is the villian all in like what the first 15-20 mins? They were doing too much at once that I persoanlly found myself having 0 connection to America or Wanda's kids. Same goes for all the fanservice it was just for people to be like OMG CAMEOS and didn't do much for the plot (although I did enjoy her killing spree lol).

[@sydiris666]

She was being mind controlled, you dolt

[@marty2204]

@@CaylasCapsule It did happen several times during the movie (without the voices) Everytime she was confronted about her actions, she always had that moment of hesitation/consideration before reacting (it happened X2 in Wundagore). Seeing how scared of her "her" children were finally made her snapped out of it

[@lillrice27]

@@shootthecaptn4666 I agree, or maybe just an epilogue of wandavision, I just feel like mom kind of ruins her story

[@felipeiturbe7493]

There’s a thing about how you could say how Wanda already lost her kids once and she wants to keep them eternally safe with that ultimate power

[@Pink_Mommy]

I feel like since wandavision ended with wanda reading from the darkhold and we know that it corrupts whoever is using it plus everything that wanda has experienced it does make sense to me that she would be the villain of multiverse of madness…but I think since we don’t actually see the corruption process…we don’t see the decline it..it does feel a bit surprising to see her as the villain. For me I wish that there had been a moment just acknowledging on screen that yeah she’s being corrupted by this book..and then we see the events of dr strange it would have felt more cohesive. That being said I absolutely love Elizabeth Olsen and Wanda can do whatever she wants as long as I get to watch her do it. I’m really interested is where her character goes from here and what that can mean for the future of the mcu

[@river8783]

Agreed. Especially with Master of Horror Rami I was expecting a showcase of the Darkhold's psychological power and how it can burrow itself inside of you and manipulate you. It would have helped link Wandavision to this story better and also helped add some tension at the ending fight of the movie.

[@Pink_Mommy]

Exactly! I still really enjoyed the movie I just expected a little more than what we got

[@justinritchie282]

Not everyone, don't forget strange used the darkhold as well.

[@Pink_Mommy]

@@justinritchie282 good point but we also don’t know how that will affect him yet. We saw in another universe that strange was corrupted by using the darkhold to the point of causing an incursion we just don’t know if the same will happen with our Dr. Strange….we really don’t know the impact of him using the darkhold yet.

[@Kal824]

This generation of needing to have everything played out or explained. Because it didn't happen on-screen makes it surprising? What? You can't your imagination with the info WandaVision gave us at the end to understand that those could possibly be the results? Even when I saw it I was like "Oh Shit!". She never truly got to greave over Vision's death, and then add the boys on top of that... To lose the life she's wanted twice over as Wanda has....that would make anyone fly off the deep end, especially in the way she lost it.

[@DEricKesler]

Regarding Vision’s absence, I remember wondering about the lack of Thor and Hulk in Captain America: Civil War. Those two were busy with Thor: Ragnarok. We may discover that Vision is elsewhere.

[@AdonisButlerOfficial]

I think the villain arc for Wanda makes sense, they could have made it more evident that the dark hold is responsible. As far as retcon from WandaVision, I think it was more of WV was jus Wanda getting her toes wet as a villain for the show, and ending with the dark hold scene in WV shows that she was gonna take that bigger step towards villain in Dr strange

[@iconicjungle4774]

^^ and the idea that they didn’t want WandaVision to be a requirement for understanding this movie

[@ikeeditz2012]

THANK YOU

[@AdonisButlerOfficial]

@@ikeeditz2012 anytime fam 🙌🏽

[@AdonisButlerOfficial]

@@iconicjungle4774 trueee, I would hope most fans peeped WV before seeing Strange 2

[@hohohopika]

Dark hold showed her the dream every night, showing the possibility that she could have. The feeling of unfair and jealous cause people to do stupid things. People chase for a better life, I think this is a great enough motivation for her to become the villain.

[@Notoriouslydevious]

I totally agree with Matt! The whole time I was wondering, "where's white vision? Where'd he go???" Was waiting for him to show up for the whole movie. Maybe he's going to get his own movie?

[@minhhuy4248]

I lost my father due to a car accident recently and I can feel Wanda’s pain. There was a time when I would literally sacrifice everything just to see my father hug my mother in his arms again. They did show the fact that she has dreamt of them every night just to wake up in this harsh reality one again. I agree that it’s really a bit too fast to make a her a villain right away but personally I really have no qualms with it. Plus I went into the movie blind without any promotion material so I really had a great time watching the movie

[@shreeya3789]

I think that's the main flaw with everyone's argument with Wanda's character: they never faced the hopeless never ending grief. As someone who lost a loved one very abruptly I would do exactly what she did in a heartbeat, no regrets.

[@AntiZombieFortress]

The writing's portrayal of Wanda is this film's *best* quality for me. She is a villain. More specifically, a victim who becomes a vilain. People don't just shrug off trauma. Typically a pitfall like Wanda's gets worse before it gets better. Her cathartic moments are just that. Only moments. They are only present to show that Wanda's eventual redemption isn't unreasonable, but this woman was evil in WandaVision and to say otherwise is disingenuous Last note: It can be difficult to separate Vision's virtues from Wanda's in the series... but the two are incredibly unsimillar

[@adriangutierrez3196]

u don’t have to go film school to realize this script is awful at best

[@BaronZemo10]

Victim of ?

[@youraveragehotdog6836]

@@BaronZemo10 that's why she's a villain, she believes she's a victim

[@youraveragehotdog6836]

@@adriangutierrez3196 what about it is? This movie was meant to tie up loose ends to stranges and Wanda's story, introduce America, and explore the multiverse, I believe that it delivered on that

[@LoudAngryJerk]

@@adriangutierrez3196 You saying so doesn't make that accurate.

[@DavidStarrUSA]

*I lost my boyfriend in February 2021. If I had Wanda's powers, I would've tore the world apart too in my darkest moments. When I seen her on screen it was too much, I couldn't help but feel her pain. I couldn't help but to relate*

[@yez9475]

Wanda also lost everyone that are close to her. No wonder she wants to be with her kids

[@insomniousluci2931]

Yes, exactly, IF you had the power. Normal people don’t have chaos magic, so we can only use normal people as an example of how to deal with grief. But how would someone deal with it if they were the most powerful being in the universe? And they had immense trauma and an evil influence whispering in their ear? Grief makes us think irrationally. Add world crushing powers and the darkhold on top of that and you get the Scarlet Witch. Also, I’m so sorry for your loss.

[@morganross6399]

Yes, grief is a very powerful force. The problem as pointed out in the video was the result of losing Vision was why Wanda manipulated reality and created her world with kids. This movie completely ignores Vision and her grief for him.

[@xspacedude]

@@morganross6399 because she’s after her kids, no vision. She even says that in every other universe she has her kids b but in the MCU she doesn’t. I think Wandavision served as a conclusion to wanda losing vision and moving on.

[@kevsthebadboy1703]

If you're the kind of person who would literally commit genocide because you lost your boyfriend, that's a huge red flag. Deal with grief however you want but never bring innocents down with you.

[@aprilwarren7404]

I personally think they did an amazing job because at the end of WandaVision guess wonder wasn’t evil but she said that she was going to figure out her power so in using the dark hole trying to figure out her power it slowly corrupted her and turned her evil and then it just took that grief and turned into anger and turned it into a drive for her to be the villain and get her children back

[@WaffleBunBuns]

A love vision's quote in the wandavision flashbacks "What is grief if not love preserving"

[@beholdenbeto]

I agree there's holes in the narrative which feel weird when trying to connect the dots. But, there's so many details that give the viewer enough material to fill those gaps. Wanda said it herself on the series, everytime she wants to lift herself up, life makes her bend and fall again. She was almost through with grief by the beginning of Infinity War, just for Vision to die horribly twice, and she "died" just to reappear 5 years later, the love of her life totally dismantled. And then, she again needed to get over West View, all fine, with just the detail of the Darkhold to overcome... but then, the multiverse happened, and there was a constant reminder she had kids night after night. That would be enough to break any person. That along with the influence of the Darkhold would be enough in my view to have her series character development thrown into the trash, without disregarding the same value of said development. And I don't know why they mentioned the Darkhold's influence wasn't clear enough. Every character mentioned it so many times, even 838 Strange was killed because he was considered dangerous for having used the Darkhold. Why would you believe any word Wanda has to say about her not being at all under its influence and just wanting her kids, but not taking all the warnings from all the other characters about the Darkhold being dangerous. There's even a visual representation of what it has done with Wanda when she kills the profesor. And I don't think Vision was needed at all. The 616 Vision has still to resolve his identity crisis. Other universe Vision wouldn't have sense at all, as the point of Wanda sending his Vision off was to say she would only want that specific Vision with her, HER husband. And even if that's no the case, the "original" Vision still tried to kill her. But with the kids, it's another story. She has a line where she says something along the words of "What if they get ill? In the whole spectrum of the multiverse there's a cure for everything. I won't lose them again." That, along with 838 Wanda's words of "They will be loved" means that Wanda wanted egotistically to be the one who protected the kids from everything. Starting from that scene at the end of WandaVision, she became horrified at the thought of them being unprotected, and who else better to protect them than the Wanda who has the most power across universes. All accounted. There're many elements to fill the narrative gaps. Wanda is still a really complex character, more so because of the lengths she'll go when pushed to the limits, pushed by the sacrifices she had to make, by the now never ending dreams of her other universes selves, and by the increasing influence of the Darkhold. She wasn't simply a bad day into the making of a villain, she was totally emotionally overburdened.

[@chlewey1280]

thank you for this! we can be disappointed with her in this movie and wish so and so happened but at the end of the day this is what we got, and it’s better to try and figure her out than give up on her character completely

[@Tinkerbe11]

I completely agree with all you wrote! To me it all made sense, and I thought it was made totally clear - even in WnadaVision, that the Darkhold was a dangerous book that corrupts people. And since it was written for Wanda , she was the one most corrupted by it.

[@aleck1739]

That’s some really twisted morality. Just cause you had a bad run in life does not justify enslaving and murdering people. If that were the case the word would be way more fucked up than it is already.

[@beholdenbeto]

@@aleck1739 It's never a justification, that's why she's the villain. And you don't need to say "more fucked up than it is" It is more fucked up than you think.

[@eduardozayasrandel1854]

I completely agree with your thoughts and it definitely helps understand how she got to that point. I think the reason why Chthon isn’t actually seen corrupting Wanda is because the writers wanted her to have autonomy of her choices. The darkhold could be seen as a metaphor for our temptations, that being mixed with the situations that as you put it, overburdened her are what ultimately lead her to decide to give into this villain version of herself

[@BleachO]

All the film needed was about 10-20 minutes in the beginning to show Wanda being corrupted by the dark hold. If they are going to make the darkhold analogous to the One Ring then we needed a few scenes displaying that effect on Wanda. And show the book making her think her kids were in danger and need her help. Other than that I loved the movie.

[@sadieyegads]

Absolutely. I didn't even get that the Darkhold was corrupting her until I saw a breakdown after the movie.

[@duecedajuice2678]

Agreed

[@kamkilledkam]

They showed her being corrupted by the dark hold at the very end of wandavision

[@yurimalek554]

@@sadieyegads How though? At the end of Wandavision they show her using the darkhold and it potentially tricking her and corrupting her. They show Dr Strange & Agatha with black fingers after using the darkhold and being corrupted by it. They state in the movie that the darkhold takes a toll, to the point where we see Two alternate Dr Strange succumb to it and have to be killed because of it. So I don't really get how you can't realize the Darkhold corrupted her. They told you straight up without saying hey the darkhold corrupted Wanda.

[@omartalamantes9951]

Well that's why u should've watched wandavision...those ending scenes were all u needed to know to Kno what would eventually become of Wanda

[@ProfEru]

They could have done something with "Mom, please help" by actually showing a Billy variant shouting it but he was simply playing with Wanda and Pietro. They could have inserted something like that and then the Darkhold would make the desire to have her kids back so much more intense that she would rather get those specific variants of her kids.

[@JonGarcia]

My quick take: - WandaVision was about her grieving her loss over Vision & establishing her as the prophecized world destroyer, the Scarlet Witch - Wanda is a magic addict doped up on the equivalent of Dark Magic Meth, aka the Darkhold. - Her characterization is of an addict who feels victimized by the universe and she's ready to take what she wants, with some general misdirected vengeance, no matter the cost. - She kills the Illuminati because 1. not her universe so meh, 2. she sees all heroes as hypocrites who break moral rules all the time and end up praised for it. The universe punishes her for even trying to be a moral hero. Every time she's taken action to be a hero, she's been tortured, her brother is killed, inadvertently killed people, had to kill her husband, etc.

[@Relugus]

You are spot on, though whst she thinks of as the Universe is actually Chthon, who has been making sure her every good deed is punished.

[@lex_rodriguez]

We're forgetting that WandaVision was about Wanda moving passed Vision's death, not her children's. Notice how Vision was nowhere to be seen in this movie? But she clearly hasn't forgotten about him since she mentions him in the film. Not to mention that losing a child is much more traumatic than losing a partner.

[@cloudburstt]

Thank you! I feel like MoM is Wanda's "hex" for her kids but on a larger scale. The Westview hex was obviously for Vision.

[@ravenabstraction]

Thank you!!!! I feel like many of the criticisms in this critique are actually hitting on what I saw to be the point of the movie. One is that this is, as you said, basically the hex for her kids. The other is how maddening greif can be, and how you can lose yourself in it. She starts out thinking her kids may be in trouble, then gets caught up in the idea of her kids, loses herself to that greif, and then the Darkhold took advantage of that focus on loss....

[@theunderscore001]

Sadly while this could be explained with "comic Wanda is often influenced by the darkhold", its likely due to how not everybody has access to Disney+, therefore not being able to view Wandavision and Wanda's development, so they built the movie around the series instead of using it

[@Artiri]

Wanda didn't want to steal her children from an alternative self, the fact that they were real in the other multiverses confirmed that her children (created with chaos magic in her universe) exist and she needed the power to go to the dimension where they are located to save them/get them back. We understood that it was the Darkhold doing it and that's why in the end she destroyed it, after realizing though the multiverse kids that she had been currented. Maybe her children are real and trapped in the same dimension with Chthon, since they were made with chaos magic. That's a plot that can be explored in future Scarlet Witch movies, I hope we get those, a mini Scarlet Witch saga where Chthon is the ultimate villain.

[@justinritchie282]

I hope someone else realized that when she heard her kids when going through the darkhold in the end credits it was literally in the multiverse of madness scene with alternate Wanda being thrown and her kids rushing to her aide. Instead of her kids being trapped like she thought she had actually heard a future event.

[@petiewheat82]

Wanda is always trying to protect herself because she's seen so many people close to her die. Her life was threatened as a child, so the primal instincts that saved her then are the strongest motivation driving her to the point of being active in her subconscious mind, causing her to use her magic without full awareness of what she's doing. (Wandavision) A key factor of Wanda's power level is her emotional state when using her powers. When someone she loves is threatened, her power level spikes and she is able to do things she didn't know she could do. She consciously thinks she is trying to save her kids, but subconsciously, her actual goal is to use them (or the idea of them) as both the rationalization and the catalyst to test the limits of her own power. Even her romantic relationship with Vision had more to do with the mind stone having the capacity to unlock her own power than it actually had to do with loving Vision for who/what he was, but she doesn't consciously recognize this.

[@kevhayden6506]

The professor X scene pretty much explained what was happening to Wanda. The Darkhold even was visually depicted as taking over her mind and trapping the sensible Wanda personality deep down. The witch has taken over. We all just were more shocked at Professor X neck snapping than what happened right before.

[@flying-magpie]

@Jj Yeah, he even told her that she was being taken over by another Wanda, so he was talking to 838 Wanda.

[@erikafreeze5721]

Vision has his memories back, but not his emotions... if they are going by a very specific storyline in the comics.

[@bigapplesd7757]

TLDR- Wanda’s actions and behavior in this movie make perfect sense if you consider her character progression from Age of Ultron through WandaVision. Multiverse of madness part of a much bigger story arc. And we need to start recognizing the difference between the arc of a single story and the development of a full character. Wanda’s development starts from her home being bombed and continues well past what we’ve seen so far. In terms of character development, we aren’t even at the midpoint of her “arc” yet. The event of WandaVision alone are not what leads to Multiverse of Madness. If you watch her arc from Age of Ultron through WandaVision, you can better understand how she got to the behaviors in MoM. If you think WV was about Wanda overcoming grief….maybe watch again… Some things that folks seem to be forgetting or overlooking… 1. Wanda’s parents were killed by shenanigans with Stark weapons, leaving her and her brother all alone at a very young age. 2. Wanda and Pietro were radicalized by an agency that used their unaddressed grief as a means to manipulate them into becoming lab rats. 3. Wanda did not join the Avengers. She fought them, briefly worked with them against a common enemy, and then Tony kept her under house arrest until Hawkeye busted her out. 4. She spent years in hiding/on the run with Vision, occasionally checking in with Cap and Natasha. 5. She didn’t join the fight against Thanos. She was pulled into it because he was after Vision for the mind stone. 6. She had to kill Vision under duress in order to destroy the mind stone and keep it out of Thanos’ hands. 7. She watched Thanos turn back time and kill Vision all over again, rendering her sacrifice (from mere seconds ago) completely meaningless. 8. She got snapped out of existence for five years and returned to a world where she has no family, no friends, and nothing but pain and trauma. 9. Agatha lulls her into Westview and creates that entire hostage situation so that Agatha can steal Wanda’s power. Try not to forget that Wanda did not just waltz in, take everyone hostage, and create a false reality of her own volition…it was Agatha all along. 10. Wanda broke Agatha’s hold over her, restored Westview, and immediately left. When she left, she was confused, horrified, and further traumatized by those events. She never healed from aaaaaany of the previous trauma, she just got more piled on to her during the events of WandaVision. 11. She spent who knows how long holed up all alone studying a book of spells that corrupt a user, dreaming of children that exist in every universe except her own. Effectively experiencing loss every single time she wakes up. Nobody checking in on her. Nothing but demon whispers from some unknown entity whispering in her ear…. After aaaaallll of that, how can there be any question of her actions in MoM?? Unresolved trauma plus acquisition of extreme power equals somebody doing very much big bad. There’s soooo much more I can say about this but my comment is already way too long, lol.

[@grub_killer2149]

Well said and well put together. Apparently its just not much to "sympathize" with tho. Her actions are "unjust" and she shouldn't have been a villain. (Sarcasm.)

[@maitotello]

I completely disagree and I think all made perfect sense for Wanda's arc. Let me explain: I lost my brother 7 years ago at a young age and I still haven't overcome the grief, neither has my parents. There is nothing as hard than losing your kids/siblings. That kind of pain makes you stronger but it also makes you a little snappish and very vulnerable to addictions. In Wandavision, white vision left the hex before she got a chance to understand that he now remembers everything and wont try to kill her again. She ended up alone after a bunch of traumatic events and she naively started reading the darkhold to understand her powers not realizing that it was like a very bad and addictive drug that transformed her into a monster. In the movie it was stated several times that she got corrupted by the darkhold and to me everything that happened made perfect sense. My spouse didn't see Wandavision but it didn't matter, he was able to understand that wanda went through a lot of trauma in her life and that she became addicted to the darkhold. He just though Wanda became crazy from her addiction + traumas + dreams with the kids she never had. He didn't know that vision came back so it made perfect sense as well that vision wasn't in the film. I think the movie portraits in a exact way how it feels like to lose the people you loves the most, you dream about them and wish you could bring them back. If you add to the cocktail the darkest and most dangerous book ever and that she's one of the most powerful beings in the MCU, it makes perfect sense what happened to her.

[@Izelor]

Just because you can relate with something due to personal experience, it doesn't mean that everyone can and should. The movie never explains anything. They keep repeating "I am a mother and I love my kids". No, you are not a mother and you don't have kids. You created kids and a husband with magic because you are a crazy witch that in the real world would be under therapy and/or medication. There is grief in alcoholism, other substances or even overexerting yourself in your job. Enslaving an entire town and killing dozens of innocent people isn't grief. It's madness. It also makes for a terrible message because they all treat her like a person who they can negotiate with, as if her rampage was limited to hitting a random dude or destroying a car or two. The movie should have either, made it clear that it isn't the true Wanda but her corrupted conscience or give her a more valid motive. Imagine if she was the one going to Strange to find her kids, because they were once a part of her soul, since she had created them, and without them she would lose her innocence completely and fall to the dark side. Then, as they try to find her kids in the multiverse, their time is up or they disappear forever, thus driving Wanda completely insane. It would make for a much more valid transition that the "angry-sad mother go brrr" that we got.

[@TruthTheChamp]

I dont get what is confusing. Its reiterated.. the Dark hold is causing her to lose reason and to use unnatural means to achieve the emotional healing that is her kids

[@MichaelNgTzeWei]

This comment (and similar comments like it) is WHAT enabled messy films. They did her dirty but people love it anyways so Disney will keep making subpar superhero films. Sequels, man. They're almost never an improvement over the first film. What a shame.

[@mannybruce8950]

@@Izelor , thanks for making the point . This person emotionally reacting to the lost of a real brother is understandable , but if this person experienced the death of a real brother and an imaginary sibling it would make sense to be grieving and missing the actual real brother . Vision and her love for Vision were actual lost tangibles in reality , but imaginary magically conjured up children were not . They couldn't make that she was searching for Vision because in WandaVision Vision had told her to accept the reality that he is gone and what she had done was wrong . They just shitted on the arc of WandaVision because after Vision consultation to Wanda she shouldn't of had any interest to be studying the Dark Book of magic . Wanda should have wanted to avoid going down the path of darkness and grief after Vision , the love of her life , had spoken to her about misusing her powers . The sudden character shift to all out crazy reminds me of the last 2 episodes of " Game Of Thrones ". A big disappointment .

[@lmtlsak1829]

@@TruthTheChamp many people don't completely understand what the darkhold is they just think "magic book give power what's there to understand?". But actually it gives the user more knowledge about things that they want for example in MOM the book guided her to America through which she can get her kids back. But the problem is the book corrupts the person like a really bad drug and they use any means necessary to get to their objective. That means even if you put iron man, thor, superman, captain America...anyone in her position the book will still corrupt them. In agents of sheild this is better explained.

[@12mmratchet84]

She was the villan in wanda vision. Her powers are set up to be based on being a villan. I think is amazing for her charector development. She has ultimate power to manipulate matter at will but is constantly being denied the one thing she wants so she went out to go get it. Charectors having morally ambiguous motivations is a great story

[@trippytimesjosh355]

Thank u

[@Relugus]

Her motives are boring, though. I don't care about her kids, especially as they have little to do with her in the comics.

[@chrismaxwell3001]

I think if vision was there, they could have used that to show how deep the darkhold had influenced her. Him having no influence, would have made it clear, that she was being manipulated and was loosing grip as a result, being too blind to see. I think the fear in her children's eyes, verses love through vision reaching out is the right choice. It hits differently. And because as its along the lines of the darkhold's realm, that primeval fear, could have slipped through its hold of her mind, triggered her protective heroic side, bringing back her sanity, helping her realise she was indeed being the monster in that moment. I hope she didn't die under that tower and has a chance to redeem what she has done, both in hex town and threatening the multiuniverse. To show she has a choice in her fate, vs the one predicted for her (rule or destroy).

[@gageburney4868]

I like that the Dark Hold corrupted her to a degree that doesn't seem realistic because to me it shows just how powerful the Dark Hold is and how far it can corrupt someone so far from our understanding

[@insomniousluci2931]

As someone who has struggled with grief, mental illness, and trauma during the formative years of my life, I relate a lot to Wanda. It’s not just about her kids, or what happened in Wandavision. I think you have to take her whole arc into consideration. She is messed up in the head because she’s been through a lot of messed up stuff. And when she tried to do good and join the Avengers, it only brought her more hurt, and no one was really there for her after she sacrificed everything she loved in Infinity War. Plus you then have the Darkhold which I think is comparable to like a substance abuse problem. Take a person with deep trauma and grief and mental illness and give them drugs- they won’t be thinking rationally about anything. That’s how I see Wanda. I had no problem with her portrayal in this movie.

[@sazude2]

If you were addicted to drugs with all your mental issues, would you kill someone for drugs if you couldn't get it?

[@insomniousluci2931]

@@sazude2 considering people actually have done that, yeah idk maybe? I’ve never had a drug addiction but I know that it will make you do crazy shit. I mean first of all this is a comic book movie, it’s not real life. I gave it a real life comparison but I’m not saying it’s exactly 1 to 1

[@sazude2]

@@insomniousluci2931 Yes, obviously it isnt but these characters are based on things that people can and have done yes so I'm with you there and not arguing that. My thing is, there is a difference with a drug addict who might steal to get something vs one who non chalantly commits cold murder to do it. Wanda was so hell bent on finding her children that she would do anything to get them. Some might find that noble, but wandavision sets up her arc as someone who would not hurt others for her own selfish gain even as a result of grief. This movie throws that right out the window. If there were even small moments of her questioning herself it wouldn't be so bad but this weird heel turn as a result of the darkhold that didnt even affect agatha the same way is just baffling.

[@insomniousluci2931]

@@sazude2 I definitely wouldn’t call her actions noble. I’m not saying she was in the right, I just disagree with the opinion that this wasn’t the way her character would behave. I think her motivations made sense. And originally the only person she planned on killing was America. As for the Illuminati, to Wanda, they were the same as the faceless minions we see in every Avengers movie. I mean think about how Captain America fucked up everyone on that boat to save the hostages. I would not be surprised if some of those guys died in the fight. But because they are just extras, no one cares. People only care about the Illuminati because they’re characters we know. But to Wanda, they’re nothing special. Once again I’m not saying she is morally in the right I’m just saying her actions make sense to me

[@kiyowokiyowo8862]

@@insomniousluci2931 agreed

[@doctor-jw]

The only thing I agree with is that her motive should have been to save them rather than just have them, but we were still set up for what she heard in the Darkhold. Ironically, what she heard was more like a premonition. Her sons were crying out to their mom, but that's because they were facing a monster (her). Her actions to claim the boys led to what she heard and drove her to the moment.

[@chidorirasenganz]

Even saving them was addressed because that’s why she needed America’s powers to jump to different realities in case her sons became sick or were in danger

[@meadgarfield8320]

@@chidorirasenganz agreed... Also why can't it be both having them and saving them ?

[@mannybruce8950]

@@chidorirasenganz , why can't she just magically conjure up her children again ? What is the reason why she could only do it once ? Also , if she wanted children so much then why not go get pregnant ? It would be real children instead of a magical illusion of children . The sole obsession with her illusionary children makes no sense because the whole purpose of the children in WandaVision was to have her intended family with Vision . The children were created to compliment her fantasy relationship with Vision and not the sole reason for imprisoning an entire town . They booted out the primarily motivation of Wanda doing what she did in WandaVision ( being with Vision ) and substituted it with her just wanting to be a mother . Throughout Wanda and Vision screen time together we didn't hear her mentioning how much she wanted to be a mother because she understood that Vision was a machine incapable of having children with her , it was just about them being together . The ending of WandaVision with her studying the dark book of magic was for what reason ? What was her motivation to read the book after Vision had told her to let him go and to let all what she had wrongfully created to fade away , and for her to move on with her life . The MCU didn't do a good job to building up Wanda's increasingly mental instability . In Avengers: Infinity War they suddenly showed a Wanda and Vision passionate affair , but before that we saw Vision keeping Wanda detained under house arrest on the behest of Tony Stark . The sudden passion between Wanda and Vision was forced , just like the sudden motherly obsession Wanda haves for made up children . Again , if she wanted to be a baby mama so bad then she should just put on a tight red dress and go into a bar and " magically " she'll get pregnant . This would be much easier than going around in muti universes .

[@meadgarfield8320]

@@mannybruce8950 lol....its comics.. However on a good note this is a entertaining movientertaining movie and actually makes people think we'll think a lot about a comic book movie...👍🏾

[@carsongraham475]

i imagine that when wanda hears her children crying for help, that is wanda seeing into the future and it's her children when they are asking THEIR mom for help when scarlett witch scares them in their home

[@pepetrueno8722]

There’s something that is being heavily discounted in this video. There is not a single parent on this planet who would sacrifice their children for any greater good. Case in point Benedict Cumberbatch had an officer blow up an entire Star fleet research facility to save their own child in “Star Trek - Into Darkness”. Any idea, any notion that Wanda was going to be ok erasing her children is pretty naive, especially considering that she is one of the most powerful beings in the galaxy. Some will choose to blame the Darkhold, I prefer to be realistic.

[@sr7046]

I thought WandaVision was about the her dealing with the grief of losing her parents, her twin and finally Vision. It wasn't specifically about her relationship with her children directly. So by the end of WandaVision she had grieved everyone BUT her children, who she had to destroy along with the Hex, retraumatizing her. The darkhold in the last scene uses the children she'd presently lost, can hadn't grieved yet, to control her.

[@gabrielmurray929]

I think that while the movie could have done a better job explaining Wanda's corruption from the Darkhold, the last scene in WandaVision of her flipping through it just oozes villain energy.

[@HisLilyPrincess]

I hated it. As someone who is grieving, I hated it. As someone who has wanted to see Strange and Wanda on screen together, I hate this result.

[@nianicole4066]

I agree about Zombie doctor strange, that’s part was so shocking and so cool. When he made the dark souls into his iconic cloak 🤩 I screamed in the theater lol !!!

[@Bryan-dr5qy]

Personally, I think Wanda's arc complements Strange's arc that's spanned since his first movie. In Wandavision, her arc was her realising that she's avoided processing her grief her whole life with the narrative revelation of her suppressing her witchcraft since childhood. And the narrative payoff to her arc is her embracing her role as a witch with the help of the darkhold. All she's learned is just to process her grief, but depending on the manner in which grief is processed, people can come out of it with their negative tendencies reaffirmed. And with the allure of the darkhold and the possibilities of the multiverse, this is exactly what happens to Wanda. Multiverse of Madness isn't Wanda regressing and repeating the same arc, it's the logical conclusion of her arc which is her coming out of Wandavision even more sure of what she wants. Remember what Monica said: "they will never know what you sacrificed for them" She knows the Hex was just a bubble for her to escape her grief by means of projecting her own version of reality, which is precisely why she turns to the darkhold to see whether her fantasy can be a reality. And in an infinite multiverse where anything is possible, why can't she be in a reality where she's with her kids? What makes the pairing with Dr. Strange so perfect is that with Strange Wanda sees someone who gets to break the rules and come out a hero, he gets to have his cake and eat it too (in her view). So it provides her more ammunition when defending her viewpoint. Like how Defender Strange was ready to take America's power for the greater good, Wanda could just justify herself by saying "if I don't take it eventually somebody with evil intentions will anyways, but instead of ruling the world I just want my kids so shouldn't it be a good thing that her power ends up with someone who won't do evil with it?" And she didn't say she wanted to kidnap 838 Billy and Tommy, that was just the reality she was forced into by America, she could've just easily found a reality where they were orphaned and be on her way. It's an antithesis to Mordo in the first film who refuses to cross the line knowing the bill always comes due, and Strange is walking the fine line in the middle. It's touches like this that make me inclined to believe that this movie did in fact service both Strange's and Wanda's arcs.

[@1klakak]

They kind of did the same thing to Thor in Endgame (not in a villain way). He progressed in Ragnarok, and then seemed to have lost all that progression (such as solely relying on the weapon, for example).

[@carlosmillan5568]

Nah thor was were he was supposed to be in endgame completely broken by the dead of his family and friends and half of the universe. Wanda needed maybe one more scene to get her fully there and that’s that

[@1klakak]

@@carlosmillan5568 totally not what I referred to. I specifically referred to character building where he stopped relying on his weapon and realized how powerful he is without, then in Endgame all he tried to do was use his new weapon. And he’s 1500+ years old. He doesn’t know who he is in the least yet?

[@diceborngames]

I think a small switch in motivation of Wanda would help. In Wandavision she heard the kids screaming "Help!" through the Darkhold. She should have been motivated to "Save them" from whatever it is that she thinks is harming them. Then you realize at the end when she confronts them that she is the one they were screaming help from. she was the danger they were faced with. That small shift of motivation changes everything and makes her more believable arc of why she is risking things, if she thinks they are actually being harmed.

[@shivanipathak5380]

I think this is what I'll believe in my head forever to feel better about this movie.

[@jessedconner]

I think that the opportunity of exploring the multiverse more by having BOTH Wandas excited me. I kind of assumed (after watching WandaVision) that the Wanda I saw in the trailer was naturally from an alternative timeline where she embraced the darkhold. Then the Wanda from WandaVision would come to the rescue the later by helping her grieve. There would be some magic battle, for sure, but ultimately they would expose a shared point of pain to have common ground.

[@ericjome7284]

Why does Wanda relent in the face of her children's abject fear when she didn't flinch at destroying other people? Her kids were the goal. The others were merely obstacles in the way, obstacles to be moved. When the children won't accept or recognize her, she realizes the impossibility of her quest. The promise of acceptance or being reunited is what fueled her. When that's off the table, she just collapses.

[@janetlynn324]

Plus when her children see her as a monster, she realizes what she has truly become. Makes sense to me.

[@amyadams656]

Exactly. I really didn't think that was too hard to understand, lol

[@iTROLLxTHExTROLLZ]

Not only all of this that you guys talked about but I also feel that Wanda's 'relationship' to the Dark Hold in the MCU is similar to Jean Grey's 'relationship' to the Phoenix Force. An Entity(Phoenix/Dark Hold) with unfathomable power connects too a person with unknown potential that end up taking control of said person and makes them go "mad" and goes on a killing spree.... Now I'm hoping that the MCU doesn't do the Phoenix Saga cause if you include the X-men movies and Multiverse of Madness we've already seen 3 versions of the Phoenix Saga and none of them were done particularly well...😔😔

[@nitsugazemag]

You do realize that the Darkhold poisoned her mind and triggered/warped her feelings to regain her children at any cost. While it might not have been explored, the end credit scene from WandaVision indicated that something was off and showing who disconnected she’s become by obsessively scouring the book of the damned and finding out that she has an opportunity to get her kids back. In WandaVision, she was getting over Vision’s deaths where her children were imaginary. Her arc in Multiverse of Madness is kind of similar to Wenwu, Shang Chi’s father, who kept hearing his dead wife’s voice calling out to him telling him lies about Ta Lo and corrupting his mind. I think, if anything, her arc felt a little incomplete leading in, but gets to a place that was emotionally resonant.

[@jillwang5070]

My biggest question regarding the plot: who is the father of Wanda's children in the other universes? Wanda cannot have children with Vision biologically; hence, If the other Wandas in other universes are happy, Billy and Tommy would not exist. If the other Wandas had children in normal ways (biologically with other men or by adoption), then these children would still not be Billy and Tommy since Billy and Tommy are created by Wanda in Earth 616 when she was sad, right?

[@rhiannongreen2642]

So there can be several ways to justify this. My take was that Billy and Tommy are specific to the 838 Wanda and an unknown father (or possibly a fully human version of Vision?) and 616 Wanda has a connection to that universe in her dreams, presumably before or during the creation of the Hex and that's why she created them for her and the recreation of her 616 Vision. Might explain why she wanted the 838 Wanda's kids so specifically, and needed Americas powers to keep them safe, there's no "back up" of them.

[@jserrano580]

Agreed! Also, they all looked alike? I guess they're not variants? confusing

[@jillwang5070]

@@jserrano580 I don't think Tommy and Billy can exist in other universes because they are not naturally created. Or I should write they don't exist. However, I can imagine other Wandas have children in other universes in natural ways (adoption or biologically with other men). Those children are stable existences in the multiverse, which means there are different versions of those children in different universes. For example, Vision and Wanda in "Earth 617 " adopted two little girls, Emily and Jennifer; then, It is more likely to see other versions of Emily and Jennifer in other universes since they are naturally created and are stable existence.

[@jserrano580]

@@jillwang5070 I get that, but why would they look the same? I will re-watch the movie soon and take a closer look at the scene where they show multiples. I really enjoyed the movie, there are a lot of theories to why Vision was not included.. but they should have at the very least hinted at his existence IMO

[@Relugus]

Chthon created Billy and Tommy.

[@SilentWarrior88]

I was thinking the same thing about Vision. He did hit himself with a lot of info and memories, but maybe he was trying to process or maybe the memories didn’t grab ahold of him emotionally as we thought. Wanda knows Vision is gone, so, I mean, I don’t think Wanda would worry too much about Vision at this point; however her kids, as she’s heard using the darkhold, are “alive”.

[@krishgarg2806]

Thing is, if you remember the line "She is not our Wanda anymore" from Doctor Strange 2, you will understand why her emotions were out of place. The "Wanda" knew the right thing was to move on, but the Scarlet Witch made by the Darkhold couldn't. Even at the end, I think she probably lived because Darkhold can never un-corrupt anyone. They will have to be killed to stopped.

[@sadhanavijay636]

true, even after all the darkholds were destroyed those who have read them will always remain corrupted as shown in the end credits scene, with Strange having another eye

[@ewokpants4891]

"Wanda is grieving, she finds a way to regain what she lost and disregards the cost to others and need for authenticity, she's forced to confront her delusions and becomes good again" - Wanda's arc in WandaVision and Dr.Strange2 - how did this happen? was it just a lazy reskin of the arc? the director not watching the show in its entirety is one thing but the writer, Michael Waldron, must have. I dont know how you work on something as big as a marvel movie and not get caught up with the continuity. Does this mean they intentionally tried to sell us the same thing twice and expect noone to notice?

[@angelahull9064]

All the arguments and details that screen crush makes concerning the problem with her story are exactly why I actually think this is very clever way to show her inconsistency as a key characteristic of her story since Age of Ultron. She is deeply damaged and pulled in different directions all the time and everyone except Vision is afraid of her to the point of trying to coddle her back into goodness, because they sure can't stop her with might alone.

[@Schrsmnymkr]

One thing is clear there are larger forces in the mix that have yet to appear. I truly look forward to seeing how kang and his variants make a play for power amongst all the chaos. I think while it seemed too simple that Wanda was manipulated into thinking she needed to catch America Chavez. I hope Wong name dropping Cthon was more than just a mention 😈

[@wiinterflowers4277]

Please don't mention Loki here..

[@Schrsmnymkr]

@@wiinterflowers4277 I didn’t mention him. You did

[@uros2404]

There was something missing definitely, the way they introduced her as the villain in the movie was a shocker but maybe to early? It is what it is at the end, I mostly agree with the video, I didn't enjoy how she went full villain in the movie and how her character was written. Her end was also shocking but then I realised: the multiverse is noe a thing, everything is possible and she's definitely coming back with her true origin as Magneto's mutant daughter.

[@gregerv37]

I understand why you feel this way but the darkhold (chthon) has it's clutches in her. I like that it seems as though it's a possession less than her being that person.

[@Iambunny-ry2os]

Shes literally the most powerful being in the universe and ur telling me a book could manipulate her? Gtfo wanda being a villain is old at this point

[@gregerv37]

@@Iambunny-ry2os such language but do the research on chthon then come back.

[@meghanjcoyle]

Is it possible that the voices of the boys calling for help at end of WV are actually the boys calling for their mom (Earth-838 Wanda) to help at the end of Dr Strange M of Madness when Earth-616 Wanda shows up? Like a self-fulfilling prophecy??

[@seangettler1917]

In all fairness, the moment she heard their voices while using the darkhold, the fandom assumed she was being manipulated. There are still video essays about that very thing up. So I didn't take her being the villian all that surprisingly. And I think Elizabeth Olson sold the hell out of it to where strange saying the darkhold corrupts and showing a corrupted field is all you really need. Wanda is even stating in a field she would have watched rot and ignoring it because she believes her kids are out there and she can get them back where the part of vision that was vision to her only exists in her head. We also never see her going on a quest to find her kids. She could have planned to hop for one universe to the next, looking for one where they were orphans. Her going to 838 was what was needed, like strange said. It forced her to see how the darkhold had corrupted her and how she had taken the wrong path. And as for vision not being alive in 838.... yeah, that's not a surprise. In 838, ultron was a good system. It never went nuts and created the body for vision before shoving Jarvis into it. So why would there have been a vision. And no "She has her kids" isn't the answer because she's capable of chaos magic. She always was. She could have birth them from her mind like she did in the hex just based off the same American sitcoms she always watched. Was the movie flawless, no. But does it deserve to be compared to game of thrones? Definitely not

[@TruthTheChamp]

I dont get what is confusing. Its reiterated.. the Dark hold is causing her to lose reason and to use unnatural means to achieve the emotional healing that is her kids

[@RiceCubeTech]

@@TruthTheChamp I liked it. It took elements of house of M, a story I thought was super cool, and adapted it as well as it could be in a world with no mutants so far. She’s always toed the line of being a bad vs good person. And I didn’t feel like it was out of character, but I also found Wanda vision boring and didn’t watch last episode 3. So maybe that’s why I feel this way.

[@jonathandash6871]

As someone who has lost a child, I don't give a damn about other versions of me. If I could be with my son, I'd do it. Let that guy deal with what I'm feeling. Darkhold or not, I thought Wanda's motives were pretty clear. Plus, I think it's cute that you think the appearance of her husband can tame a grieving mother.

[@stanimirul]

In her life, her children were made up, were an illusion. She was grieving after Vision and imagined an ideal life with him where they had chlidren for a couple of days/weeks. She wasn't a grieving mother and she didn't even have children...at least not real ones. And she gave up the illusion of those children because she realized it was hurting people, only to hurt more people in pursuit of the same illusion.

[@AshenDemon]

Would you try to kill a child and summon demons?

[@AshenDemon]

Also before you answer if she didn't enslave a whole town her fake children wouldn't exist so this wouldn't be an issue.

[@gabrielmurray929]

Vision not being in the 838 universe makes perfect sense. The Ultron project was a success in that universe, so Ultron never goes haywire and tries to make a new body that becomes Vision.

[@dallaspatrick82]

As someone that lives with traumatic grief I'd say her story was completely warranted and excellent. Just because she seemed to make some reconciliation with what she was going through in wandavision doesn't mean it's over, not even close. It tears at you every day, and if you just discovered new found power or means to possibly bring back something you lost, you'd probably sink right into it. Especially if you're corrupted/exploited by an evil magic book. Grief is like addiction, you can only learn to be aware of it and try to manage it as it comes, and that ship is gonna turn whatever direction the wind is blowing in any given situation

[@dKoDe3kAy]

The story should of emphasised more on the darkholds history and power of chthon or better yet made chthon the real villain not the scarlet witch. I was really pulling for wanda or strange to reach out to agatha for help but that didnt happen either.

[@midnights1389]

I think Agatha will most likely be in the next Wanda (or Dr. Strange) related movie since WandaVision definitely set her up to be around in the future.

[@demetriusreyna971]

@@midnights1389 she’s getting her own series it was announced awhile ago on Disney plus day

[@TheTribute410]

I disagree because vision would’ve had the same affect on Wanda that Rachel McAdams has on strange because he literally says “I love you in every universe” so I feel like if Wanda actually loved vision and saw a version of him where he didn’t die, that would actually be a great way to get her to calm down

[@Yibambe.]

THANK YOU for this. The way they portrayed Wanda broke my heart for all of the reasons you mentioned.

[@klmitchell5486]

As powerful as she is that darkhold power overwhelmed her and she couldn't handle it. I really think in Agatha's show they're going to do a call back to Agatha told her she's going to need her because Agatha knew that when Wanda got a hold of the dark hold it was going to send her Every Which Way but Loose

[@jerredmillirons3677]

As much as it pains me to admit, scarlett witch did everything that the Phoenix failed to do. I LOVE the DP storyline, but it has always failed to be translated to film. Scarlett witch makes up for it

[@haroldhopkins7719]

'Disney Interpretation' 'Marvel Lore'

[@TheJim42069]

The end of Wandavision literally had the twins yelling for help so it's left with us thinking they are in danger or trouble and Wanda needed to find and save them. That's one of my biggest problems with Wanda's inevitable heel turn even with the whole "corrupted by the Dark hold" thing they are trying to go with...at least as quick as they are doing it.

[@iLLiCiT_XL]

I really feel like even though Wanda overcame her grief for Vision, she never resolved missing her children. That was an easy plot thread to pickup for MoM. Plus add in the angle of the Darkhold corrupting her? I buy it.