The Psychology Of TRANSCENDENCE With Scott Barry Kaufman | Rich Roll Podcast

Rich Roll talks with cognitive psychologist Scott Barry Kaufman about what it means to engage a growth trajectory, self-actualize, and live a transcendent life. To read more about Scott and peruse the full show notes, go here👉🏾bit.ly/richroll669
✌🏼🌱 - Rich
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FILMED AND EDITED BY BLAKE CURTIS
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00:00:00 - Intro
00:01:55 - Scott's Story as a Late Bloomer
00:13:02 - Self-Actualization: The Bridge to Transcendence
00:17:22 - Framing It as a Way of Being Rather Than Doing
00:19:31 - Maslow's Hierarchy as a Sailboat
00:26:21 - Transcending or Surviving
00:30:50 - Self-Actualization & Finding Purpose
00:36:54 - Paradoxes between Selfishness & Altruism
00:42:08 - Vulnerable Narcissism, Start from Within, not Without
00:51:15 - Self-Actualization is not the same as Achievement
00:54:17 - Recognizing Someone Who is Driven by Growth Rather Than Deficiencies
00:56:53 - Healthy Authenticity
01:02:44 - Methods and Experiences for Getting Outside of Yourself
01:05:55 - Empathy & Compassion
01:09:44 - Building Resiliency
01:14:42 - Confronting Shame
01:20:26 - Be Love
01:24:23 - Can We Change Our Personality/Temperament?
01:34:35 - Self-Actualization Work: Tension Between the Work and Following Your Intuition
01:37:20 - Self-Actualization and Addiction Recovery
01:41:26 - The Concept of the Daimonic
01:48:36 - The Psychology of the Culture War
01:56:46 - A Breakdown in our Trust for Institutions
02:10:37 - Advice for Climbing the Ladder of Self-Transcendence
02:19:56 - Closing Remarks
* * * * *
NEW TO RICH?
Hi I'm Rich Roll. I'm a vegan ultra-endurance athlete, author, podcaster, public speaker & wellness evangelist. But mainly I'm a dad of four. If you want to know more, visit my website or check out these two the NY Times articles:
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#richroll #richrollpodcast

[@kalena26]

This is one of my favorite podcasts of all time. So genuine, and honest. The two of you really showed respect and admiration for each other and I found you both to be extremely humble and vulnerable. Please invite him back on the podcast. And I love his honesty of loving eating edibles on the beach. That's livin' man. 🤗

[@carolgerber6375]

What a beautiful soul! Loved his words.

[@claudieharris9046]

A truly amazing and wise guest (and such a cute laugh!). Such a treat to listen to him speak. Thanks to both of you !!

[@annephillips1870]

Rich has a fabulous laugh too, so these two together are a delight to listen too. Plus they have great insight and intellects.

[@teresamurphymoore6664]

What an amazing guest, insightful, wise, curious, and funny too! Lovely combination!

[@danmurphycbc3]

LOVED this one Rich and Scott. Takeaways: Goal - be an unending well of compassion. Avoid - being angry person looking for a fight.

[@leslielamb8699]

So enjoyed this dialogue...much appreciation

[@jasongravely7217]

This guy’s personality is excellent. Beautifully depicted information, awesome conversation - really glad to be introduced to him.

[@samdickson3552]

Love SBK. Great addition to the catalog here! Thanks Rich 🌱

[@loppan4534]

I hope there will be an episode 2 where you continue the conversation about masculinity

[@stellabandante2727]

The conversation is like two brains in a jar having thoughts, talking about them, talking about talking about them, looking at each other talking about them, observing each other reacting to talking about them and then talking about it. It's so under the microscope, but really well done.

[@crowley144]

I think the very end is the perfect representation of someone in their own flow doing their own thing. Respect for that

[@nikitadavid143]

Why do these guest insist on bashing Donald Trump? We never had people illegally crossing borders, unaffordable gas , global food shortage, vaccine mandates, CRT education, global pandemic and brink of WW3 with Trump, why not do a psychoanalysis on biden, kamala and psaki, its 2 years overdue.

[@divalivingston1664]

@@nikitadavid143 This is the same comment on a second post. Are you going to keep up this annoying nonsense? It takes our attention away from the contents of the podcast and relevant comments.

[@Whiteboi-uf9pw]

Rich, your prowess as an interviewer is incredible! Thanks for sharing.

[@juliahuffman1484]

Humble and enlightening talk-thank you!

[@Ooooopppsss]

I like this guy. He seems like genuine soul.

[@nikitadavid143]

Why do these guest insist on bashing Donald Trump? We never had people illegally crossing borders, unaffordable gas , global food shortage, vaccine mandates, CRT education, global pandemic and brink of WW3 with Trump, why not do a psychoanalysis on biden, kamala and psaki, its 2 years overdue.

[@ccziv]

He is. Some time ago, we were good friends.

[@lulitmelake7534]

Brilliant. Thanks for the caliber of guests you bring

[@user-pl7oo6dc3j]

Great podcast! It’s so refreshing to see more Science based KZbin videos and interviews with people who have PhD. Social media is saturated with empty and mind numbing stuff centred around self certified celebrities. Ps. adding PhD to the names of your interviewees ( in your titles ) would help us find your great videos like this easier. Thank you!

[@meee7922]

Brilliant interview with two brilliant people. Such amazing insights into this thing we call life. Thank you for creating such awesome content to help change the world xxx

[@Tvp247]

I love how he brought up the subject of shame and how it's a huge part of his work. I feel like someone needs to make a big documentary about it to show ppl how it rules so many decisions especially amongst people who are in jail. It is such a major part of society and it really needs to be brought to everyones attention.

[@JonJosephKuhn]

I’m a content creator and filmmaker. My KZbin following is small right now, but I have the means to make something anecdotally about shame. In my last few videos I’ve opened up about my past a lot. I think exploring shame and it’s restrictive nature would be super fascinating and helpful to people.

[@LasVegasSand_s]

This was a really great episode. I keep comimg back to it. I admire Scott’s courage to talk about the spiritual with such an open mind.

[@paolap3384]

LOVED the energy in this podcast, such an incredible conversation between such open beings! so loved and Scott definitely has the sweetest most sincere laugh!

[@LostInPhoenix]

@RichRoll I interview homeless fentanyl addicts here in Phoenix for my KZbin channel as we currently have an epidemic going on here with 5 Arizonans dying each day from opioid overdoses. Most of the people I interview are teens and young adults. I’ve interviewed about 300 people in a year and a half. 3 of them are dead from overdoses and 2 are in prison for murder. If you ever do an episode on addiction please invite me to speak on this subject to help create awareness and possibly save a life. Thank you 🙏🏼

[@arvinsenglishph2293]

I love the conversation I can learn so much from this amazing talk.

[@mauiswift6391]

So great you have Scott on! He is awesome!

[@enatp6448]

So many great topics of discussions! Take aways: spiritual narcissism, authenticity, masculine identity. Would love to hear the conversation of masculine identity expanded upon with this guest or another. RR, as always, a well facilitated conversation.

[@mariam.7271]

Rich thank you for your podcasts, i absolutely adore them

[@TreeLover-nr6ey]

So good!

[@frzd]

Great episode. Made me ponder upon my own life and ask myself some important questions! Thank you both🙏

[@liviar7760]

Loved the discussion around minute 40th.. what about "self-appreciative" as and alternative for healthy selfishness? Thanks for such an important discussion!

[@suzikotler6101]

I am so excited to come upon this podcast. I will continue to follow Rich and want to know more about Scott. He makes sense to me. I love him! Touched upon so many things but especially love the authenticity piece. I’ve been finding it interesting attracting others who desire authentic relationships. And finding others is not really the “goal” . It’s a practice for me in every interaction for my growth and I am confident along the way I will attract those aligned with wanting to create the same. Compassion... listening while writing. I love this

[@fionathompson408]

Rich often mentions the AA 12-step program. I just watched a movie about the founder of it entitled Bill W on Amazon Prime. A great movie. I’m sure Rich has probably seen it since it was released in 2012, but if you haven’t Rich, wow, what a gift this man was to humanity, and what a humble man he was.

[@bjnicolas3928]

8:37 😊😅😊😊😊😊😊😊😅😊😊 😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊

[@cherie9928]

Wonderfull discussion and sharing of ideas! Scott is a Highly Intelligent man,so insightfull with a humbleness that i find endearing.I haven't met many Drs of Anything that are as welcoming! I love people with a sense of humor,+Cute Laugh!*** Cute Smile too! I hope he is a Guest again. Rich great job! I admire your vast knowledge about each guest,and sensitivity as a Host. I'm deeply Inspired by the Conversations i've heard! Thank-you,~Blessings

[@MattAngiono]

Alan Watts often uses the sail boat metaphor to describe Taoism and the wisdom it expresses about how to live.... So this idea has been around thousands of years! We just forgot as moderns....

[@tulikbeck4516]

I love his laugh! 😂

[@dianeleirer9878]

At 16:45 mark: “quiet impacts on the world”. Parenting was the first thing that came to my mind. The second thing was educators-as Scott Barry Kaufman shared was his story about his 9th grade teacher.

[@ThankyouJesus81]

Just ordered this book on Amazon. Thank you

[@livkamal980]

Just ordered a copy of your book Scott! Can't wait to read it. xoxo

[@nyc1234100]

Thanks, hope you like it!

[@ThankyouJesus81]

Book arrives tomorrow. Can’t wait

[@anthonyfox477]

Another great conversation!

[@MarleneChism]

Rich love your point about doing inner work to trust your instincts! I often say “ you are only as honest as your level of self- awareness.”

[@temperhollow7716]

For the past 2 years I've been working so hard and releasing shame and developing my creative facets. This process is achieved in many ways, but I choose to walk, swim and meditate. I am also involved in writing a children's story and learning a language and yet my friends ask " but what are you up to?"Dismissing this incredibly-in depth process as something kind of frivolous which is so frustrating. Transformation is a big physical/spiritual investment and yet there are some who want to hide keeping "too busy" to run from feelings. Facing them is so much more courageous. The message is that if you are not juggling 10 plates, you are apathetic which is so untrue. I don't want to apologize for the huge transformations that have taken place in my life in the last 2 years. I have earned a grad degree, dropped some shame-weight and am recording prophetic dreams that may serve as narrative food for future works. How do I defend myself??

[@nikitadavid143]

Why do these guest insist on bashing Donald Trump? We never had people illegally crossing borders, unaffordable gas , global food shortage, vaccine mandates, CRT education, global pandemic and brink of WW3 with Trump, why not do a psychoanalysis on biden, kamala and psaki, its 2 years overdue.

[@Tvp247]

Alot of ppl are just projecting their stuff. Tell em you're on this amazing path and you love it. You love moving your body. You love connecting to the universe inside of you and getting the downloads. Find some new friends that are in to the same things? Join some Psychonaut Society's

[@divalivingston1664]

I commend you for doing what you want with your time. After putting it off for a number of years because I had issues I didn’t want to look at, I began writing my life story. I experienced shame around addictive behavior and bad choices. It was emotionally excruciating to look at it but I persevered. I’ve loved not working for the last year. I was staying at home because of Covid and decided to quit a job I didn’t like. At first, I hardly knew what to do without working. But then I found myself and my voice. We can be more of ourselves given the opportunity and by giving ourselves permission. If people find that odd, well, too bad for them. I was unburdened and began to lose weight by dancing and going for walks in a park that has a lake and lots of waterfowl and other birds. I found this podcast only a few weeks ago because I am not rushing around but am attracting what I need for my personal growth.

[@divalivingston1664]

@@Tvp247 Get some new friends is good advice! It’s important to be true to yourself. I am more secure after being alone and taking time to do a creative project and evaluate my life and the people who are in it.

[@chuchaftw]

Thank you for this comment! I can relate as I own a business meanwhile pursuing a second degree but over the last 2 years I have picked up yoga and reading books but when people ask me “what are you up to?” People value my career and academics achievements more than my yoga and reading journey and I have grown and learned more about myself through this than anything else I’ve done. “Transformation is a big spiritual/physical investment” couldn’t agree more.

[@jc10907Sealy]

This is a gold.

[@casslarkin4567]

What an amazing session, Rich. I really resonated with so much of what Dr. Scott had to say, and most especially for me, his bit on the word 'trigger.' Thank you so much!

[@U2B2024]

Great guest! Rich Roll is my favourite interviewer by a long shot!

[@elizabethdesousa8290]

Thank you for the conversation between two brothers. 💪🏼🧚‍♀️

[@GalactusOG]

Cool podcast episode number.

[@ccziv]

I'm a huge fan of SBK!!!

[@khaabrandhawa]

Lot of love from Australia 🇦🇺

[@georgeshepherd3381]

Thank you! This hit home big time!

[@gypsylotus108]

Excellent episode. :)

[@smilebot484]

i have the book. will check out the podcast. thanx rich for bringing us another amazing guest

[@drryanincemd]

Great stuff thank you 🙏

[@miki09l]

the fact the stood up bec he felt his butt hurt is so appreciated!!!!!!!!!

[@LasVegasSand_s]

This was great. There s so much covered here.

[@tblightningbolt8902]

this guy is awesome. So likeable and wise

[@knowledge1556]

Nice, thanks for that.

[@wolfbrother2474]

I wrote to Rich, he never replied and it really annoyed me. Only recently have I realised that the letter I wrote was for my own ego, in the hope of some connection with Rich. I am trying to find my own path but one that serves others rather than just feeding myself if that makes sense. Peace ✌

[@jcszot]

I love Dr. Scott! This was a phenomenal interview! This sounds kooky but I wonder if Dr. Scott is left-handed. I am left-handed. My father was a teacher for 30 years and he was also left handed. He always told me that we learned by using a different area and/or side of our brains. That we processed differently than the right handed population. I too was retained in the third grade because I was a little bit slow with reading and Math. I was classified and put in special ed classes as well. Between the classification and retention in grade level it does something to you. You don’t find out what he does to you until later on because when you’re a third grader you don’t know what low self-esteem is Lol! By the time I got to high school my parents had to fight to get me back into the main stream. I worked very hard with the Math. Still to this day I’m just not wired for numbers but I am darn good with English, reading, comp/ Vocabulary. This interview was so good that I saved it to my playlist. I will be listening to it again. Thank you Rich! 🙏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

[@MattAngiono]

Left handed means you spend more time in your right brain 😉

[@jizim8947]

I heard all left handed people are untrustworthy and scumbags. Very glad this is as close as we'll ever come to meeting. 100%💩

[@DrSRanjanMBBSAcupuncturist]

⁠@@MattAngionoRight brain is divided in thinking part and emotional part like left brain. 😊 - Whole Brain 🧠 Living Book of Jill Taylor

[@riekabosman7894]

Thankyou Rich for being such an amazing inspiration in my life...I am truely, and will be forever grateful! I have been able to change habits, create an amzinglife and continually feel inspired toward becoming everyday. Thankyou. You are beautiful

[@jizim8947]

12:05 I 100% agree with this. 👍

[@lindal6291]

Beautiful tables chairs background setup👍 healthy choice of water in glass cups 😀

[@jdt8983]

Great talk. I think for some of us who have mental health issues/neuroticism (and therefore likely more narcissism) we have to use certain modalities to break the barrier to then actually absorb these types of concepts. So a certain type of meditation...medication...whatever it is...and then the cognitive side kicks in. Plus a little Jung goes a long way. Accept that we're not all or nothing of any particular trait and no matter how many times we try to prove ourselves that's still going to be the answer

[@kathy2910]

Such an interesting and helpful talk. I will listen to this more than once.

[@DJSTOEK]

Thanks

[@gb4375]

Great reference to the work of David Epstein! Loved this conversation! The portion on healthy selfishness and pathological altruism was genius.

[@Nina-nd4bl]

Maybe not Saliery but something opposite and challenging and advanced. One word - spectacular

[@canyonhaverfield2201]

Thank you Scott & Rich 🎇 Love it how in the digs for such expansive grown, we get a look at how important just plain being comfortable is.. I'm betting from now on the set furniture will include ones that depart from the green stool design & go in a different angle..after all when ones in the hot seat for 2.5 hours under studio lighting & the RR scrutiny, one can't easily abide with strangling underwear or a stressed spine. I loved how the conversation drifted so perfectly down that road. It may be Scott merely choose the the wrong size underwear🎈

[@natenavarre8646]

I just started my youtube channel and am on video 8 already! Im thinking longevity with this channel and taking it one day at a time, its definitely a learning process! Does anyone have any advice for a new content creator like myself?

[@bluebutterflywellness2273]

One more awesome example of never accepting any other narrative above your own innate belief in your limitlessness.

[@sew1what]

Love this guy 😂 (s) 😅

[@tammyb8742]

This was very entertaining to listen to. I just finished Mindset, couldn't stand the way it was written but very much understood the point, will check out the new book 👍

[@brookie_cuqui]

One of the best conversations! Gotta love yourself before you can love someone else. "Incredibly non-curmudgeony, kind human being!"🔥 "If you're a real truth seeker, you'll be balanced."

[@mauiswift6391]

Yes, a very difficult lesson in life!

[@jizim8947]

@@mauiswift6391 not as difficult as when I put it in with no lube

[@tnijoo5109]

1:12:05 I actually think trigger warnings are helpful. It’s that sometimes when it’s completely unexpected it can really get you. It’s like you need a second to brace yourself to process some things. Trauma is different for everyone. So even if you’ve overcome a traumatic experience through exposure it doesn’t mean that certain exposures might throw someone else into a downward spiral after months of therapy. And even for people who have overcome trauma, there can still be times they’re thrown back into it. We can be compassionate and understanding instead of this attitude that people should just get over it and if they don’t they’re not learning to be resilient. I think with trauma your comfort zone shrinks and when you are recovering you need to find a comfort zone where you can feel safe and once you get there, then you can try to stretch a little out of your comfort zone to keep expanding. Pushing way outside the comfort zone seems to backfire. Just something to keep in mind if you or anyone close to you has experienced a trauma or serious mental health issues or triggers are an issue. Be well. 💚

[@amandamacdonald3073]

"With that said, with that said" 😄

[@michelemurphy3541]

What happens in cases of abuse that limit a human from getting beyond the first tier of the pyramid? How does one reconcile it? Thank you. This is amazing.

[@tb8827]

"The Body Keeps the Score" is changing the game for people with the same barrier.

[@BoloBouncer]

Self-actualization seems more objective and transcendence is subjective. I think SA brings you to your limits and transcendence explores the space beyond.

[@Wrw942]

I enjoy Dr Kaufman. His article on President Trump and summary, may say a bit more about Scott than Trump himself. It is easy not to recognize in another the ability to see a situation more broadly, and multidimensionaly than we are able know. This is unavoidably a common human state. Know also that we are all to some degree under the influence of an ongoing covert long term mass formation psychosis project.

[@timbo1476]

Wow. Tell me how cool it would be to have both of you guys over for a vegan BBQ. Wish I had this to show my children when they were younger. Great stuff

[@bodymindsoul60]

Absolutely loved the content of this episode! The extra bonus was hearing some one give attention to Jordan Peterson Psychologist take an oath to do “no harm” Not exploit!

[@mcc.o.4835]

Let's make compassion cool.

[@soffmusic9655]

Do yourself a favor and look into ACT. He talks about it at hour ten.

[@caso6481]

Sounds like Maslow got to where Shakespeare and Tolstoy were in mid/later life...

[@lidiarona4335]

There are universal themes running throughout the history. See Joseph Campbell's work. It is not about credit, it is about understanding. We might hear something 1, 2,7 times and actually internalize it only the 50th time. Don't discount, context and not content is the important part.

[@pamwagner4509]

Wouldn't it be easier just eliminating all social media platforms from your life?

[@smilebot484]

the Buddhist idea of right speech is that speech should be true, timely, and beneficial.

[@madhurmalkan3863]

Please Invite SADHGURU... It would be fantastic...

[@jgarciajr82]

These values Scott talks about sound like Socrates virtues.

[@K_Rae_Bee]

Not to be silly but,. It I think the plot in mean girls is a good Hollywood example of acting as if impacting your actual personality. I do think that can happen.

[@VladyslavKL]

🕊

[@Nina-nd4bl]

Superheroes come in different forms

[@TenTenJ]

Let him talk

[@danacohen2180]

Extrovert and introvert have little to do with they way someone acts. It has to do with where the individual gets their energy. Extroverts get their energy from the outside (from others) and introverts get their energy from within. Being outgoing or shy can be attributed to either an extrovert or introvert.

[@erosramasotti1080]

Awesome podcast! Maybe shorten the table a little bit

[@dtatman7]

Did Rich seriously criticize Jordan Peterson for being a non-expert talking about nutrition? Oh the irony...

[@selfesteem3447]

Thank you for this podcast. I believe everyone needs to stop being afraid to use the word narcissism, come on 🤷‍♀️wth. Don't apologize for using the word narcissist, it's not overused because the world is overpopulated with narcissists, and they've been Unknown for far too long and gotten away with so much and ruined lives. Why not just set out to make narcissism so well know, talk about it openly, and work towards a era when narcissist are so exposed they have no where to hide and they're running like cockroaches when the lights are turned on. So therefore it's necessary, call it like it is,.. call them out. And leave it to the narcissist to apologize,... for themselves. Our duty as people who are not narcissistic personality disordered - NPD, is to keep on, keeping narcissism as "the new buzzword", is to self reflect on,.... have we advocated enough on teaching others about narcissism, have we told others how imperative it is for them to know about narcissism and because of narcissism being soooo complex, so deep so daum damaging, manipulative and having many nuances, it's not only necessary to know it but know it extensively. To anyone offended, check out the yt channel called "wake-up warriors". Period. And, one more thing.. sorry Not sorry 👏

[@jizim8947]

You can tell that both of these guys were nerds when they were younger.

[@gabbya3369]

he is funny tho

[@MattAngiono]

If you want to talk narcissism YOU MUST interview Dr Sam Vaknin! There's so much misconception around this personality disorder, especially on KZbin! Narcissists actually don't have an ego, rather an over inflated one.... Still a great conversation!

[@GalactusOG]

We live in a kind of computer simulation engineered by God.

[@openroad25]

Interview Dr. Joe Dispenza.

[@Nina-nd4bl]

F Mozart and superenlighten and advanced Saliery, sorry I don’t know how to spell , not my first language MAStErPiece of communication of thought and past experiences

[@monikapandey8792]

Good closing men get it all wrong...what women look😊😀🤣😅for..

[@corrierou7768]

The use of words like stupid and dumb to describe neuro-diversity is outdated and offensive.. probably a good talk but I couldn't listen to it after hearing that, which was unfortunately right at the beginning.