Trailer: Roundtable - Brown & Storms vs. Peters and Osman

On Friday March 1, 2024 we are releasing a 4-hour (uncut) roundtable with Justin Peters, Jim Osman, Michael Brown, and Sam Storms. The topics of discussion center around the differences these men have in discerning false teachers and false prophets, and the work of the Holy Spirit today. As many of you know, Justin and Jim bring a cessationist view to the table, while Michael and Sam share a continuationist perspective on the gifts of the Spirit.
This discussion began with a phone call that Jim Osman made to Michael Brown's radio program in 2021, which reveals some sharp differences in how he is more quick to label certain individuals as “false teachers” in comparison to Dr. Michael Brown. This led us to coordinate some behind-the-scenes conversations about these differences in Biblical discernment, which finally lead to this public discussion on April 1st, 2023.
Dr. Michael Brown unfortunately withdrew his involvement in our American Gospel: Spirit & Fire (AG3) docuseries a few months ago, leaving us unable to use the footage we recorded with him. Shortly after that was announced, he kindly gave us permission to publish this roundtable (originally intended to be part of AG3) in an uncut form, as long as it was separated from the AG3 project.
This discussion will be exclusively available to AGTV subscribers on Friday, March 1, 2024. A few weeks later, it will be accessible for free on both AGTV and KZbin. We pray that this conversation will be edifying, and leads to greater discernment within the body of Christ.
AGTV Link: www.watchagtv.com/roundtable-...
Available for free on KZbin, 3/15/24!

[@LetHimSaveYou]

So impressed that these men came together to discuss. All glory to God. As someone who was lead astray, for years, by false teachers, I can’t wait to watch this. It was only until I learned Biblically sound doctrine that I felt freedom. I thought I was a Christian but was not. Knowing what true repentance and being born again is all about has freed me. The false teachings kept me in bondage, confused, selfish, a slave to sin, and forever searching for something. I’m forever grateful to people like Paul Washer, Chris Rosebrough, and Justin Peters and wish the truth and freedom for everyone else, as well. I pray for Michael Brown. I hope these false teachers like Todd White, who I used to follow, eventually see the truth.

[@AlexA-ss4te]

Ditto to all that. It's my story too, and a multitude of others.

[@de1623]

Can't wait to see this! Don't know how Brown can defend his celebrity friends and their bizarre, unbiblical theology. We are to call out wolves in sheep's clothing!

[@Keverember]

So much respect for Dr. Storms and Dr. Brown. I’m very excited for this and praying that Jesus is glorified by and through it.

[@Morethangood.]

AMEN

[@e.m.8094]

I'm excited for this. Wish the premiere wasn't at exactly the same time that I start work.

[@janterjeandersen5708]

Looking forward to this one!

[@raccafracca940]

Mike Bickle

[@richardm23]

Yes! There’s going to be some “Bickle Bombshells” in this one! Must watch!

[@SBots-xo2nn]

Exactly. Those two on the left have lost any respect and credibilty, IMO.

[@brettmagnuson8318]

Exactly. Two of those men endorsed bickle. Two did not.

[@RebeccaJeffersonOAC]

I believe Sam Storms called out Mike Bickle for the latest thing.

[@de1623]

May have been filmed before the Bickle bombshell.

[@bradgulock247]

I can't wait to watch this.

[@lilygrace4562]

So disappointing to see the quenching and grieving of the Holy Spirit by these two cessation peddlers. The Holy Spirit and his work on the earth gave me the gift of faith to believe that my son could be healed of his brain tumor the week before treatment began 14 years ago and documented by his neurologist at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester Minnesota. My 28-year-old son is alive and well today because of a miracle healing that came as the gift of faith, the gift of healing.

[@eduardoramos1460]

Seems like you don't understand Cessationism. Cessationists believe the HS can and still does miracles, however, not on demmand by these fakers of the faith and how it is being represented today. Peters states that God could heal him but he also could stay like that because it is all for the glory of God. A lot of people comment on things they do not even understand.

[@rational3521]

I'm stunned!

[@jackcrow1204]

I am so excited for this Brown and Storms are right about the continuation of the spiritual gifts But Osman and Peters are right about plenty of these charismatic guys being false prophets and false teachers, especially Benny Hinn whom both Storms and Brown consider to be saved albeit not someone they would recommend

[@MinLeeMajors]

Where's the guy with the gift of healing then? Amazing how he didn't show his face during Covid when we were all locked down. Everyone has a camera.... I haven't seen this guy tho.

[@jackcrow1204]

@MinLeeMajors the gift of healing is not something that can be turned on and off at any time Also read craig keener 2 volume work on miracles and get back to me

[@RebeccaJeffersonOAC]

God can decree healing just like he can allow sickness. He allowed covid. Some people were healed from covid. Whether or not gifts of healing are given in on situation versus another does not negate the existence of those gifts. It's all based on the will of God, like it's God's will to best own any gift on any believer he chooses. Not everyone will be healed, and not all believers have all gifts.

[@felixguerrero6062]

Agreed. It's really that simple But Brown sadly is so manipulative and deceptive. Especially in defense of bad actors.

[@TheQuickBrownFoxTV]

Sjoooooweeeee, amazing.

[@mturner2572]

My desire after watching this would be for a follow up round table. Anytime it came to a discussion of the prosperity Gospel and the topic of healing in the atonement in the our current life - all four of these men agreed: they categorically do not support it. , I think it was Storms who said “it’s not Christian…” I would like them to discuss how they could to eradicate this from the Christian landscape in teachings in our country. I honestly think that Dr. Storms and Dr. Brown value their personal relationships above reviews of what people like Bill Johnson actually teach and write and communicate. The evidence of many sheep is not welcome to them over their personal perspective. How could all four of these man “stand against“ this together? The consistent response by Storms and Brown is that we haven’t done the investigation that you have or we know the person and they totally discount any evidence.

[@idahojoe8232]

I look forward to watching this. Thank you so much. May eyes open to Truth not feelings. Best,

[@theouterplanet]

Maybe have Dr Brown and Storms on again and ask them why their discernment was wrong about Bickle.

[@dbaxley4342]

ITS NOT OVER PEOPLE. How about What’s Gods discernment re: this whole thing. Following man will lead you right back to SQUARE ONE. Oh I despise the level of regression of true gospel. In American Christianity and what perspective it has embraced. Now go Vote for your real leader. 🥹. God help haughty America 😢

[@lewislibre]

Can’t wait! (Cessationist)

[@vanessaloy1049]

Have you considered interviewing someone like Mike Winger or Joseph Schimmel?

[@JohnnyJee]

You have to pay for a subscription to watch this 🤦‍♂️ If this is “for the body of Christ” this is a weird way to show it.

[@beelos1982]

Well its not how they define it its what scripture says about it we can clearly see it in Galations 1:8 ,"Anyone preaching a different gospel is an ANATHEMA.

[@sophieshiels4503]

When will this be released?

[@carpediem2372]

As announced release for free viewing on March 15.

[@sophieshiels4503]

Oh I missed that, thankyou!

[@RandomBoxingGuy]

“Dr. Michael Brown unfortunately withdrew his involvement in our American Gospel: Spirit & Fire”… sounds to me like he didn’t want to offend sone of the extreme Charismatics that he has either endorsed or failed to call out in the past (Bill Johnson, Todd White, etc)

[@nldj344]

Or it could be AG was clipping things to their advantage and not releasing it in it’s entirety

[@RebeccaJeffersonOAC]

They said he agreed to it as long as it was separate

[@anotherdayatthefeast8100]

I thought Brown turned tail and ran from any involvement with AG claiming he couldn’t be involved with this project for some high minded reason or another. What changed?

[@AmericanGospel]

See here: www.americangospelfilm.com/ag3-production-blog/roundtable-peters-osman-vs-brown-storms “Dr. Michael Brown unfortunately withdrew his involvement in our American Gospel: Spirit & Fire (AG3) docuseries a few months ago, leaving us unable to use the footage we recorded with him. Shortly after that was announced, he kindly gave us permission to publish this roundtable (originally intended to be part of AG3) in an uncut form, as long as it was separated from the AG3 project.”

[@anotherdayatthefeast8100]

Thank you for your response.

[@gersonsalazar973]

Got it thank you agtv 👍👌

[@nldj344]

I think it was bc AG wasn’t releasing it in its entirety, they were cutting out and clipping things to their advantage

[@AmericanGospel]

@@nldj344 no, Michael Brown participated in two different roundtable discussions (including this one) and an interview. Our agreement was that any of this footage could be used in the AG3 docuseries edited with other content as long as he approved (that we didn’t take him out of context). We were also going to publish these roundtables in an uncut form as well. Michael simply didn’t like how we were critiquing certain ministries that he has connections to. He disagreed with how others were labeling those ministries “NAR”. He felt this was destructive and untrue. We invited him to add his disagreement into the series, but he insisted that we subtract the content that he disagreed with, rather than adding his own disagreement clips. In sum, his dropping out has nothing to do with our integrity and editing, but his unwillingness to be involved in something that critiques ministries that he’s closely involved with (example: Christ for the Nations, where he teaches.).

[@guygifford]

ON PROPHESY: If you host a Roundtable on prophesy, I put myself forward to be at the table, as I've written and published on the meanings of "prophesy", and now understand that God has made me a prophet ... BUT I'M NOT of the "everyone who wants to be a prophet can be" group, nor is Benny Hinn a prophet. God has verbally spoken to me, like little Samuel, and one vision, and other encounters. I didn't seek it out. Corrie Ten Boom told her story at the tiny 35 person church I attended as a boy. Also, an author named John Langer hears from God regularly. I consider Johnathan Cahn a prophet, although I've never spoken to him and I don't know if he accepts that mantle. The late Chuck Smith was a prophet. Prophets do not hear from God at their own will, and even Bible prophets seldom heard from God.

[@davidgoodrich1258]

When does this release?

[@rick381v69]

March 1st

[@AmericanGospel]

Friday March 1st www.watchagtv.com/roundtable-peters-osman-vs-brown-storms

[@JohnnyJee]

@@AmericanGospelit’s March 1st and I don’t see it 😳

[@AmericanGospel]

@@JohnnyJee the link above should work ^

[@mlbreen]

I've bought and watched all the American Gospel movies. And have been able to discern and identify a lot of the errors in the Word of Faith movement. My extended family is charismatic. But I think we have some much greater challenges to the church in general than these two brothers. Also, my two young believing boys have begun to notice "the grumpy Christians". And I don't think this trailer is really doing your argument any favors, when you see two frowning and visibly upset pastors on one side of the table. Frankly efforts like this should be aimed at those "churches" (if you can even call some of them churches) that are teaching things so beyond the pale of orthodox Christianity. Not to say damage is not being done here. But we do have bigger fish to fry.

[@graysonbr]

I want to know why 20 years of not having spiritual revelation on Mike Bickel's antics by those believe in prophetic revelation existed. Nathan didn't operate like this.

[@RebeccaJeffersonOAC]

Well, the Holy Spirit could have revealed that to them, but he also gives discernment. I have no problem saying Benny Hinn and Sid Roth are heretics. I think quite a few continuationists would agree with me. If we can't even live holy lives through the power of the Spirit, then what is the Spirit for?

[@RebeccaJeffersonOAC]

Re: Mike Bickle, I know anyone can be deceived by their friends. It happens. David was betrayed by Ahithophel and didn't know early on that he was like that, and David was a prophet, so prophecy (at least OT prophecy) doesn't always warn you of things like this. God can, but doesn't, just like many things. We do have discernment, however, and we just have to rely on Christ to help us have godly friends and to pray for our friends so they can be faithful to Him.

[@gersonsalazar973]

Where can i watch this conversation? Anyone know?

[@g.h_-heart-_bunny]

It says in the description:)

[@AmericanGospel]

www.watchagtv.com/roundtable-peters-osman-vs-brown-storms

[@theouterplanet]

I can’t afford that!

[@Kenneth-nVA]

@@theouterplanetit’s free

[@mattg7151]

Yes a free trial but just add your credit card details 😢

[@g.h_-heart-_bunny]

Brown is the Dr. of obfuscation.

[@stevenirizarry9427]

In reality Michael Brown by himself would destroy these two in a debate.

[@amichiganblackman3200]

Only your reality

[@stevenirizarry9427]

@@amichiganblackman3200 Justin Peters himself acknowledges how good Michael Brown is. Justin Peters isn’t a debater and neither is the other individual. Michael Brown has debated plenty of times regarding different topics. Realistically it would be too easy for him.

[@sylvestre9440]

Very interesting that Justin and Pastor Osman cannot see their double standard wrt Lither vs. Benny Hinn. I addressed Justin about the total flip flop of John MacArthur wrt Pastor Chuck Smith. The videos are out there showing his complete reversal blaming Chuck and Calvary Chapel for all of the charismatic and charismatic excess running rampant today... the antithesis of Chuck's ministry! It was a complete slander job and misrepresentation. Justin's response... no response.

[@winonahart]

When will this conversation be released in its entirety? Is that still the goal?

[@richardm23]

Looking forward to this. I wonder if they will praise Mike Bickle for his wonderful life of holiness, and his great example as a NARismatic 😬

[@nldj344]

Wow….is this what your religion teaches?? No grace?? Stone him! Torch him!! Are you after justice?? Or restoration??? God is after restoration. He made a mistake, he needs prayer You people and yes I said it YOU PEOPLE have no love or grace for anyone!! All you do is criticize and tear people apart. That’s not what the TRUE gospel is about. Disgusting

[@skylineFJ]

I mean this is men vs boys. Charismatic movement abt to get wrecked in this matchup 🤣

[@troyte831]

You obviously haven’t read Storms if this is your view of him.

[@SBots-xo2nn]

And when people warned him in the past about Mike Bickle, he didn't listen to those warnings.

[@Allen-L-Canada]

DMB is a very good at debates.

[@mikerutkowski7265]

They are all false preachers. Justin Peters is a lying minister for the devil since his wicked soul is twisting verses of scripture to justify why he has cerebral palsy. He has stated that his disability is from the fall and it is the greatest gift that God gave him and that certainly is a lie since there are no scriptures that ever relate that afflictions are a gift from God or from living in a fallen world. If afflictions are a gift from God then why didn’t Jesus bless people with afflictions instead of healing them? Well the reason why is because every sickness or disability is a curse from God and all you need to do is read Deuteronomy 28:58-61 to prove as much. “If you do not carefully observe all the words of this law that are written in this book, that you may fear this glorious and awesome name, THE Lord YOUR GOD, then the Lord will bring upon you and your descendants extraordinary plagues-great and prolonged plagues-and serious and prolonged sicknesses. Moreover He will bring back on you all the diseases of Egypt, of which you were afraid, and they shall cling to you. ALSO EVERY SICKNESS AND EVERY PLAGUE, WHICH IS NOT WRITTEN IN THIS BOOK OF THE LAW, will the Lord bring upon you until you are destroyed.” ‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭28:58-61‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ Scripture relates how God does not lie, He shows no partiality or favoritism and He never changes but yet the majority of believers overlook what God related to us about sickness and plagues in Deuteronomy 28. Realize that this evil world is ruled by the devil and God promised to protect us from the devil’s afflictions if we chose to obey and follow His commands and live a righteous life. So any lost soul that believes in the nonsense that Justin Peters is relating is certainly proving how they are completely ignorant and deceived and they clearly possess very little scripture knowledge since God has never used anyone who has a disability as His messenger. Why? Because anyone who possesses a sickness or a disability is definitely a sinner who is disobeying God and His commands and that person clearly has no idea what scripture is even relating. Now this wicked man has stated that you can only hear God by reading scripture and that you cannot actually hear the voice of God and that is another lie. He likes to claim that if you desire to have God speak to you audibly then read the Bible out loud and with that statement he clearly proves that he does not possess the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ. “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.” ‭‭John‬ ‭10:27‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ This wicked man has also stated that the miraculous gifts of the Spirit have ceased with the apostles which would mean that Jesus lied as well. “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do he will do also; and greater works than these he will do, because I go to My Father. And whatever you ask in My name, that I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything in My name, I will do it.” ‭‭John‬ ‭14:12-14‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ This wicked man has even stated that he does not believe that Matthias was an apostle and that the other apostles “jumped the gun” as he so claims. “And they prayed and said, “You, O Lord, who know the hearts of all, show which of these two You have chosen to take part in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.” And they cast their lots, and the lot fell on Matthias. And he was numbered with the eleven apostles.” ‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:24-26‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ This wicked man has stated in his videos that God did not promise healing to everyone and that He chooses who He desires to heal. Well if that was true then God would be a sinner and a liar since scripture relates that showing partiality is a sin. ”For there is no partiality with God.“ ‭‭Romans‬ ‭2‬:‭11‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ ”If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well; but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors.“ ‭‭James‬ ‭2‬:‭8‬-‭9‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ Lastly, this wicked man has stated that just because someone teaches something that is false does not make that person a false teacher. Oh really, then what does it make them then? ‬ “These people are springs without water and mists driven by a storm. Blackest darkness is reserved for them. For they mouth empty, boastful words and, by appealing to the lustful desires of the flesh, they entice people who are just escaping from those who live in error. They promise them freedom, while they themselves are slaves of depravity-for “people are slaves to whatever has mastered them.” ‭‭2 Peter‬ ‭2:17-19‬ ‭NIV‬‬ There are over 2000 different bible versions that all have different translations, words and different meanings and a lot of these bible versions are leading many souls astray. If you watch Justin Peter’s visit to Charis Bible College video you will see him reference the NASB1995 version of Exodus 4:11-12 to justify his cerebral palsy since he is insinuating that God is the one who is giving people sickness and disabilities. “The LORD said to him, “Who has made man’s mouth? Or who makes him mute or deaf, or seeing or blind? Is it not I, the LORD?” ‭‭Exodus‬ ‭4:11‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬ So if you read this version of the Bible, yes it does state that God makes human beings blind, deaf or mute. But know I want to give you another Bible version and show you how it reads: “So the LORD said to him, “Who has made man’s mouth? Or who makes the mute, the deaf, the seeing, or the blind? Have not I, the LORD? Exodus‬ ‭4:11 NKJV‬‬ When you read this version it is not stating that God made them mute, deaf or blind but that God made the individual, whether they were someone who was deaf, mute or blind. God is not saying that He inflicted the disability on them. God loves you and He wants you to be healthy for He is the God who heals you. So why would a loving God who loves you and heals you desire to make you sick? Sin and sickness are strictly of the devil and sickness reveals that we are disobeying God and living in sin. God made it very clear that He would remove sickness and disease from anyone who did not sin and who would obey what He commanded in scripture. This is why the devil can no longer put his afflictions on anyone who is truly born of God because they are now someone who can no longer sin since they are now being guided by God’s Holy Spirit. “And said, “If you diligently heed the voice of the LORD your God and do what is right in His sight, give ear to His commandments and keep all His statutes, I will put none of the diseases on you which I have brought on the Egyptians. For I am the LORD who heals you.” ‭‭Exodus‬ ‭15:26‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ “So you shall serve the LORD your God, and He will bless your bread and your water. And I will take sickness away from the midst of you. No one shall suffer miscarriage or be barren in your land; I will fulfill the number of your days.” ‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:25-26‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ “And the LORD will take away from you all sickness, and will afflict you with none of the terrible diseases of Egypt which you have known, but will lay them on all those who hate you.” ‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭7:15‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ “We know that whoever is born of God does not sin; but he who has been born of God keeps himself, and the wicked one does not touch him.” ‭‭I John‬ ‭5:18‬ ‭NKJV “HE WHO SINS IS OF THE DEVIL, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. WHOEVER HAS BEEN BORN OF GOD DOES NOT SIN, for His seed remains in him; AND HE CANNOT SIN, because he has been born of God.” ‭‭I John‬ ‭3:8-9‬ ‭NKJV‬‬ So scripture clearly relates that anyone who sins belongs to the devil and whoever is born of God does not sin and cannot sin. There are no scriptures that ever relate that a sinner belongs to God or that a sinner is a child of God! There are no scriptures that ever relate that a believer will always sin or that a believer can never stop sinning! There are no scriptures that ever relate that sickness would be a normal part of this life or that a Christian will possess sickness in their life! You can look all that you like but you certainly will not find any such scripture to back up those lies. God commanded us to live a Holy and righteous life and this can only be achieved by being someone who overcomes their sins. Psalm 107:17. “Fools, because of their transgression, And because of their iniquities, were afflicted.” Know what this means? First transgression, it means an act that goes against a rule, a law or a code of conduct. Next iniquity, it means a wicked act or thing, sin. Finally, affliction, it means something that causes persistent pain or suffering. Translated it is saying that you are a fool if you do not follow God’s laws and commands and you go and sin because you will then have pain, suffering and sickness. Believers who are suffering with a sickness, a disease or a disability certainly are not comprehending what scripture is relating and this is why they have allowed sin and the devil to destroy their lives. They overlooked that Jesus is alive and He commanded us to follow Him, so instead of following Jesus through His Holy Spirit they have chosen to follow mere mortal preachers and religions instead. This is why Justin Peters is nothing more than a false preacher who is a condemned liar and he is leading people astray with his false and misguided interpretations of scripture in order to justify why his wicked soul possesses cerebral palsy.

[@bobkeller8899]

I'm convinced now that Storms and Brown have zero discernment. In fact, I question if they are enlightened or illuminated in their hearts and minds. A genuine fruit of regeneration is discernment and love of the truth so much so as to want to defend it and guard it. But also to protect the flock from error and false teachings. I see no erring on the side of caution with these two. I only see them defending individuals who have (credible) accusations leveled against them. If there is sufficient doubt or concern about a person or his "ministry" he must be scrutinized. This is not "judging" wrongfully or persecuting him, it is biblical to confront and to ostracize and discipline him but more, to seperate from him and not encourage him.

[@andrewmattiewalter]

Really you're gonna put a conversation this big and this important behind a pay wall?!!! Utterly ridiculous!

[@AmericanGospel]

It’ll be free on KZbin in two weeks. It’s also free to see now with a free trial. Please understand that these things cost money to produce and we have to find ways to maintain support, so we can pay the expenses and costs to make this type of content (especially since Brown’s decision to remove himself was a huge financial loss).

[@kimte8575]

@@AmericanGospel Thank you for explaining!🙏🏼