Thoughts on the first four episodes of 'Mr. McMahon' | Wrestling Observer Radio

[@drewstar8611]

The whole series was basically a primer for everyone who wasn’t up on WWE history before it goes to Netflix

[@HeavenUpsideDown]

Spot on

[@youngzeus87]

Bingo. Sucks because this was our best shot at getting real doc on Vince with Vince in it. Waste of time and resources for long time fans

[@PopJPT]

Exactly. It’s nice seeing the never before seen footage but wrestling fans who do their research already know about this stuff. I guess this was more for casual fans and the people who aren’t even fans of wrestling.

[@JeroenZM]

Great observation. Felt like a puff-piece retrofitted to be more critical after the allegations came out. It's an odd watch with a tone that's all over the place

[@sanchez501]

"Gatekeeper of the the truth". Turns out kayfabe is alive and well after all.

[@MikeRubin-l8b]

it's not kayfabe

[@dannygoog9654]

Haha Dave a truth teller

[@hadhoda12345]

I just finished episode 6, and I can't believe how tame the entire thing was. Vince would have been better off not issuing a statement about the series in the first place, it did nothing to help or worsen his reputation. Way too many minutes wasted explaining wrestling lingo (I get they are doing that for non-wrestling fans but to me that was a agonizingly boring). I expected a true deep down dive into the history of Vince, yet important topics like how he was sexually abused as a child was merely glossed over. I wanted more hard hitting questions towards his family to see what kind of person he really is. Linda making an appearance yet not being asked about his affairs made no sense to me. Again, I wanted to learn about Vince, not a description of the history of WWE throughout the years, which documentary ended up being. Beating WCW, for example, shouldn't take an entire episode to talk about, there are a million other documentaries dedicated to just that.

[@megamanxhunter]

Or maybe they probably asked, and they left it on the cutting room floor.

[@hadhoda12345]

@@megamanxhunter I only care about the final cut, and based on that the documentary was very poorly done.

[@fpinel1]

I dont think anyone really knows Vince and for sure he was not going to confess to anything he didnt want you to know (this was said several times during the documentary). I understand there wasnt anything we fans didnt already know but there are probably a lot of people that dont know anything about the subject

[@mkultra5752]

How was bret over the top? Cohost doesnt know anything. Awful misleading documentary..a wwe timeline barely anything on vince..no new info, no dirt..terrible like netflix in general

[@ddust102]

I was surprised how hard they were on Vince. He def deserves it but it was surprising they didn't pull any punches.Heyman and Prichard being Vince Weinstein's fluffers was quite gross. Stone Cold being anti-science was surprising, too.

[@FilmThePoliceFTP]

He (austin) didn't elaborate at all as to what he meant. I thought maybe he meant that CTE was a copout for what was an evil act perpetrated by an evil person.

[@FilmThePoliceFTP]

Also, I love how people having different opinions means they're anti science. Anti science is a dogwhistle for "conspiracy theorist" which itself is a dogwhistle against people who question their government and estblishments. The only thing certain in science is that nothing is certain. Science is always evolving.

[@alexmonro1711]

Cte has a lot of scientific research behind it. Is there are a logical basis for questioning it? Or is it just being contrarian for the sake of it?

[@Br0130]

@@alexmonro1711The thing everyone is forgetting is that it was the CTE itself making Steve say that lmao

[@alexmonro1711]

@@Br0130 😂

[@lexorcism]

Video peaked around 00:20 🐶

[@daveborder7751]

Pause it at 17, 18 & 19 seconds & Dave's angry face is the total peak.

[@doug2731]

Overall it leaned negative toward Vince. Not saying that's a bad thing, just it wasn't flattering. The doc covered what felt like dozens of trials and scandals. The ratio of bad guy Vince to good guy Vince commentary was like 10:1. With the "1" being that Vince suffered an abusive childhood and went on to be a "father figure" to tons of wrestlers later.

[@silverbullet9442]

I think it was way more positive than I expected. It could have been 6 episodes of hatred towards Vince but it fairly highlighted his successes and positives alongside his negatives.

[@dannygoog9654]

I thought it wasn’t bad and I don’t think he’s a rapist and sen trafficker there not even blaming Janel grant for anything.. she stayed at wwe and willingly did those things

[@GillBoldberg]

It was more a history of WWE documentary than a Vince McMahon documentary.

[@alexmelendez6732]

Hogsn in 2006 i believe literally adnitted on bubba the love sponge he ratted jesse out to vince and even called him an idiot. The shocking thing here is hogan admitting he lied on arsenio hall

[@PierceTravels]

Dave you are the best in professional wrestling media

[@jocam21]

Episode 6 isn't anything controversial or special. The documentary as a whole isn't even a documentary about Vince, it's a documentary about the history of WWE during the Vince years.

[@A-small-amount-of-peas]

Whenever I see Mr Mcmahon I automatically say it in Gerald Briscos voice

[@xShoTime83x]

It wasn't during one of the first four episodes, but that Armen Keteyian interview is still noteworthy, makes Vince look gross/unhinged and throws serious doubt on that whole "WWE is a family" when guy didn't care at all about wrestlers who worked for him, dying on a regular basis.

[@dngn4774]

He looked like a psycho in the Bob Costas interview but Costas just smiled and let him have his tantrum.

[@xShoTime83x]

@@dngn4774 Vince did the same thing in both interviews, where he tried to get in their face, mocking their concern. No empathy shown, no empathy for him.

[@kevinsousa3370]

Hopefully they’ll have a part 2 doing a deeper dive in his controversy and scandals

[@jonpower9728]

"...that shady guy who got off" Best description of Vince McMahon

[@LuisReyes-pb4dt]

Nothing new in documentary.They never go into his childhood to show how he turned out as an adult.If you are a wrestling fan you didnot learn anything new .

[@_M_Zed]

Why did Vince still have animosity toward Hogan when Hogan’s testimony arguably saved Vince?

[@paulmenard6219]

because Hogan was supposed to retire and instead he led the charge against him in WCW. Hogan threw a lot at Vince verbally as Hollywood Hogan. Vince would have been fine with those words if it was under the WWF umbrella. Money is king to Vince.

[@_M_Zed]

@@paulmenard6219 Yes but Hogan’s testimony and Hogan essentially deceiving the feds with his testimony was huge for Vince though, IMO. And that was also ‘94, still years before Hollywood Hogan in WCW. I just felt they’d at least feel neutral toward each other given they both had survived the feds. ‘94 and ‘95 were also both horrible financial years for both WWF and WCW. ‘96 too until Hollywood Hogan and the NWO. I definitely understand why Vince wanted and thought Hogan should retire, I just found it strange it seemed to supersede the testimony.

[@FrozenSurf]

Did hogan and sheik go into their match not knowing the finish or is that more Hogan BS?

[@johansvensson833]

what hogan said i think was that he was winning but they did not plan out the match with a producer

[@Jagjeezy]

With Andre he didn’t know… for sure but with Sheiky they all knew

[@marsspacex6065]

Hogan said he knew the ending but they had not rehearsed the match.

[@sanchez501]

It's wrestling. It's all BS. These people are professional liars. The documentary was business as usual.

[@silverbullet9442]

Hogan says he didn't know the finish of Hogan Andre, not Hogan Sheik... but I think it's more likely that he knew the finish but wasn't 100% sure that Andre was gonna follow it. There's no way they went into that match with literally no finish planned.

[@Riptide27]

5:18 “The Gatekeeper of the Truth!” 😂

[@johansvensson833]

to be fair in the first two episodes he was ok but similar to wwe(93000) he has no profe on his 78000

[@sanchez501]

I know. Absolutely madness. I'm not anti Meltzer but he doesn't know what he's talking about and never has. Al Snow is right to call him the greatest worker in the history of the wrestling business.

[@ValSempai]

The only time Vince really looked bad in the doc is when he would say odd little off handed "uhhh wtf??" kinda remarks like where he talks about the rita situation and he goes off about "the statute of limitations of a rape" He made himself look worse than what they were asking him honestly.

[@inflatablecarnival3172]

I thought the doc sucked . No new info .. Nothing we haven’t seen from better film makers. Dark Side of the Ring > Mr McMahon in every way possible. Tony Atlas was the ONLY redeeming quality of Mr McMahon.

[@ftwsam2246]

Yeah I wanted to hear all the witnesses on the previous cases, but with the Grant case they couldn't do it because it's an ongoing investigation and case. But it was disappointing because it's just a timeline of Vince's career.

[@NaturalJoeC]

Couldn't agree more

[@bobshattuck6151]

I have a question for all of you. The cat is 77 and the trial is held up due to the government. So my question, to all you lawyers or law students out there, what if he dies? Does she still have a case and can she recover money? And, I think not, but do any of you know the other three women? I would imagine they would have to testify, even with the NDA. Anyhow, you are all smarter than me, so let me know.............

[@lawcheukyui]

Dave said don't judge before see the episode 6, I wonder why. (spoiler alert, uncle Dave....)

[@methos19751]

It focuses on the last few years, it really doesn't say anything new at all if already someone that keeps up but lots of it is likely to be new to most Netflix viewers

[@RMetsy]

The doc was everything we already knew

[@CraigWeir-q5v]

I mean Vince literally says at the start of episode 1 '' I am not going to tell you the big stories'' or words similar to that . I don't get why people are so upset about it not showing what THEY think it should have . There is literally legal proceedings ongoing , Netflix has just started a new working relationship with WWE , Vince refused to tell the ''worst'' stories . It was what it was . If you liked it , great . If you didn't , great . But to get upset about it is weird. Also thought Dave was really good on it . Sums up in my mind that his ''uhmm you know , uhmmm uhhh I dont know , you know '' thing is a character

[@lewis9025]

I thought what I saw of it was pretty decent. Other than having to see Dave Meltzer’s face go on there and try to explain shit he knows nothing fucking about as usual. It’s still amazes me that a guy like that got as far as he has. Amazing.

[@FrozenSurf]

I liked it best in episode 6 when Shane said “bong hit”

[@jonpower9728]

I noticed how they did a trick where Vince would say one thing about the Attitude Era but then would be vintradicted by showing footage of the exact thing Vince was denying. Other than that rhis whole documentary isn't going to change the way you perceive the man nedore rhis documentary happened.

[@ISM313]

It was a good documentary but I learned nothing new…. It should’ve just been called “WWE The Vince Years”

[@sanchez501]

I take issue with Meltzer stating that it was Owen Harts blood on the canvas when tt wasn't. It was from the broods blood bath on heat.

[@puma12345ace]

Dave had more interview screen time than Vince xD

[@jusducks07]

Unreal for Bruce Prichard to sit there in the last episode and say it's a hit piece, when it's a straight up puff piece

[@Bownzinho]

The documentary showed everyone what people have been told for years - that he’s a disgraceful suck up

[@SirGeeeO]

This series was the Netflix adaptation of Dark Side of the Ring.

[@Swoll826]

Except not as good

[@times2duel]

I felt bad for Shane

[@TheGrittyUrbanSaga]

It is well made

[@suplex400011]

So many misrepresentations of the truth by Vince and Hulk in the documentary.

[@zerocool1980]

Watching tgis documentary reminded me of when i saw The Iron Claw movie. The story of the Von Erich family. While i did tear up i didnt cry as much as the people who were with me. Because i knew just about everything that was gonna be portrayed in the movie going in. So nothing caught me off guard as it did the people who were with me. There was very little that caught me off guard in the documentary. Im sure somebody new to wrestling or who doesn't watch it was surprised but not many wrestling fans. Boring!

[@HectorGonzalez-gb2qj]

😒🤔🤦‍♂️ Dammmmmm, after watching this documentary. I got to say a few things. Let’s be honest, Vince K. McMahon is practically the Stan Lee of Professional Wrestling. His Legacy is practically the greatest promoter of pro wrestling of all time. You can’t take that away from him. I definitely agree with Tony Atlas on that 1. Now that’s on a professional level and basis. But on a personal level this dude is really a FUCKED up lad. Not a WORSE one of the Worst but he is up there. I mean there other examples in the entertainment industry that rack up a top 5. Like for example 1) Marilyn Manson 2) Bill Cosby 3) Harvey Weinstein 4) Jeffery Epstein and etc. So it’s pretty difficult putting VKM on a top 5 of worse individuals of entertainment. But definitely he is on that list. And the documentary wasn’t that hard on Vince per say I mean cause $12 million dollars of hidden $$$ of settlements for Sexual Assault, Harrastments and rape that was just found out on that company???? And Vince was the principal suspect on those lawsuits dammmmmm it’s prettt difficult NOT taking a curious peak on that subject. But those situations were consequences that unfortunately Vince was involved in??? So the documentary put the truth there. Now on that side, I want to be a fly on the wall on that McMahon Family thxgiving dinner cause that family dynamic is a FUCKKKKKKKKKKED UP ONE!!!!! Holy SHIT!!!! There’s NO way one can defend that dynamic like it’s a normal family thing???? And lastly dammmmm I got more respect for Dave Meltzer now on his role as a Wrestling journalist I mean dammmm this dude spew some truth bombs there and it was prettt interesting watching his takes over the documentary. Ohhh that Owen Hart tragedy dammmmm that’s just was SAD!!!! AF I LITERALLY forgot wrestlers performed over Owen Hart blood 🩸 Vince definitely screwed the pooch on that one. That definitely CANNOT be defended including this Janel Grant lawsuit holy SHIT 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ so yeah Vince McMahon is NOT a bad guy and he wasn’t portrayed as one on that documentary BUT he is an ASSHOLE, a sexually fucked up deviant, had a FUCKED up childhood, and is somehow androgynously immune to having family emotions and feelings cause he rather live tru his business career accomplishments COOL 😎 but that doesn’t make him as dr 👿evil 👿 let’s be honest a LOT of people in the entertainment industry are really FUCKED up and this doc is not a worse of the worse hit piece. Ohhh and I kind of lost some respect I had for hulk hogan after watching this doc. 😒🤔🤦‍♂️

[@JMag_24]

Props to your “thesis” but do you think anyone would ever read all of this?🤦🏻‍♂️

[@HectorGonzalez-gb2qj]

@@JMag_24 I mean NO disrespect to you I’m really not insulting you actually I want to take your answer seriously so I can reply to you. Be it social media or a paper if you just read the headlines (bullets) of an information then your a MORON and you are a problem for your community. Why? Cause you need to be informed and learn to have an opinions on subjects And never be afraid to put them on social media to have a good conversation so you can be insightful on whatever comment or subject there is on the web. Just my honest opinion ob your comment

[@Hesaheel]

@@JMag_24they have posted the same comment on other podcasts as well. It just tripped me out for a second.

[@gregsmate1]

Dave saying they could have gone harder on vince, as if he hasn't heard and known this shit for years. You could have gone harder as well, little cromagnon Meltzer

[@Dr_1212]

Jail proven predator for decades Vince He.s no genius Just the luckiest dumbest worst wrestling promoter in history

[@foaly5]

I don't think people call him a genius? It's not something that I've heard many people say. He's certainly intelligent at the least, given his level of education and success as a promoter. It's not fair to say he was merely lucky, he made some clearly excellent decisions that lead to the success of WWE as a business.

[@Dr_1212]

@@foaly5 I wouldn't say he.s intelligent but he made some good decisions about wrestling that made WWE what it is today but if you look at his history you can clearly see he had amazing luck & for every good wrestling idea he had he had 100 bad 1.s for the good of all wrestling now he needs to be jailed or fade away there's no excuse for all the horribleness he.s done he.s hurt the wrestling industry the fans pro wrestling & many many women with his bs

[@justinmichaels7856]

You know that Vince McMahon took legal action on the documentary series 💯

[@bobshattuck6151]

That went well

[@pooldead7712]

He tried to buy it.

[@sdd619]

He signed off on it. He also did say. He wanted the good & the bad covered. Problem is Vince is not a good person. His views are that of a sociopath.

[@megamanxhunter]

​@@sdd619 One moment that made me laugh was when they called him out on his hypocrisy regarding WCW.

[@JonathanHassingerChannel]

No. He didn’t and can’t

[@StephenSmith23.]

Vince is p diddy

[@davidstevenson2271]

Fuck me, Dave talks some shit 😂 just get to the point

[@Krispen_Wah]

don't forget to not subscribe and dislike the video right away

[@stefan21cydsfm]

Weirdo

[@johansvensson833]

dislikes no longer exist on youtube dude

[@RyanCMcD]

@@johansvensson833 Except they clearly do, dude.

[@megatinmand5524]

That'll teach em!

[@daveborder7751]

Dave hates that dog like Big Bossman hated Pepper.

[@unruly2337]

Gatekeeper of the truth?!? what a joke 🤡 😂

[@TheMoralReason]

Dave Meltzer Gatekeeper of the Truth? Reporting lies, getting stories wrong, spreading misinformation 🤔

[@KittyKatMan93]

Watching the whole thing smiling at the thought of Cornette fans stroking out while trying to figure out how to leave "UNCA DAVE" comments on the Netflix app

[@paulkerr2654]

The usual key jangling nostalgia