WHO SHOULD FACE HIVE FLEET LEVIATHAN? GUILLIMAN OR EL'JONSON?

[@mcmarkmarkson7115]

Both of them fighting side by side would be dope af

[@seanreusing4409]

Exactly. It would be like a reunion in fire situation. Plus the aftermath would be interesting of how quickly Robute's stoicism breaks down at the sight of a lomg lost brother. Or maybe the Lion does it first. Either way that feels better than just a planned rendezvous on some back water world

[@piercebrosnan9528]

Dope? Did you invent that term you cookie cutter?

[@michaelc6473]

@@piercebrosnan9528 Settle down kid

[@piercebrosnan9528]

@@michaelc6473 I'm fuckin 230 bro and on heavy supplements, I ain't no little bo peep

[@thejammyproject]

I came here to say just this, why can they not work together instead? A master strategist and a war master working together? Yeah, that would be epic.

[@SirBlade666]

I always pictured Guilliman telling one of his brothers "we have this problem that suits your skillset" then asking him "would you be willing to deal with that"? He'd make it appear like they're doing him a favor rather than commanding them. He'd give them all the information he has, then let them do their own thing.

[@brockwilkie6022]

Especially 40K G. He has been humbled in several ways now. He could do what E told Horus to do, "don't force your brothers, they are strong of will". He was always more diplomatic than the rest where he worked well with humans. He just will be much better now with his brother.

[@LysimedVenteel]

I’d appoint Guilliman. The Lion is a remarkable general but this is not a war of individual battles and turning points - it’s like trying to direct a spear point offensive against the very tide of the sea. You need to hold the Hive Mind back, and you need logistics to do that.

[@badaoe3stratsonly130]

Lion wouldn't be a bad choice actually, because he has fought a war just like this before during the Rangdan Xenocides. That said, while the Rangdan Xenocides was an Tyranid level threat. They were also the only major organized threat that the Imperium was facing at the time. Since Orks hadn't adapted to the might of the imperium via THE BEAST yet. The Necrons were sleeping. And the Eldar were still cautiously observing the emperor. If all the other factions: Chaos, Necrons, etc could be held at bay by Guilmain and 20% of the Imperium's strength. Then Lion El could probably take the rest of the imperiums strength and go captain genocide against the Tyranids. Especially since the silence in the Warp doesn't seem to stop or counter Lions weird forest walk ability. So the Lion can strike the Tyrranids anywhere, any time.

[@Lenriak]

The Lion also grew up fighting beasts, he was once described as "A beast pretending to be a man", in terms of life experience - he's literally the Primarch built for fighting beasts.

[@HgHg-yp6ft]

Nah..It will be some other recently invented super overpowered character as what was the name -;Cabogon? who was controlling 1300! star systems and caused the death of 8 billion!! navigators or that pharaon who killed Aeldar god and destroyed a whole planet with a single blow or...something else in this crazy( but weirdly appealing) franchise.

[@grayfullbuster1242]

Bro you need a Good General to hold the Logistic lines LOL. Your point became null, if you don't have a good general then Logistic will get overrun by enemies and essentially hurt you the most in the end

[@silversurfer8818]

Guilliman: We take them together, you flank them slowly on the left and i....... The Lion: I am taking them now!

[@Masamune84]

My money is on the Lion, as a field commander and his legion taking on threats like the Rangdan in the past, they would seem the best to take on Leviathan and having the tools to do it

[@DJCallidus]

I would like to see the Lion open a few secret weapon cashes and reintroduce the Dreadwing. 3-6 Marines with Mad Dakka!

[@combomaster666]

@@DJCallidus Lion walks into the armoury of The Rock and says to the marine in charge of it: Give me all the weapons from Dark age of technology we have. Wait... I'm worried that what you heard is give me a lot of Daot weapons. What I said is give me ALL the daot weapons we have.

[@Kristian.B.Kristiansen]

Honestly neither. Ohh they would both do great, but so fare this isn't a Primarch-show. The Lion is stuck fighting in the Dark Imperium and Guilliman is focused on The Rift and Chaos's main attacks. This War is the responsibility of the High Lords and the broader imperial military machine.

[@AvACyberSecurity]

Yeah this is a numbers war! Which while no primarch is needed, Guilliman may get his brain behind the fight. But maybe the Lion still remembers some of those secret weapons he had. Not the ones he gave away lol. Why are we still asking IF Roboute crossed the riff though? We know he has because of 2 books and what Dante is doing, who then meets the Lion.

[@slip6699]

Yes, this is humanity's fight. Might be that the high lords come out a bit cocky afterwards thinking they don't need a primarch to tell them what to do.

[@unomauhasard5219]

Neither because they will bring back a new primarch to save the day at the last second.

[@Kristian.B.Kristiansen]

@@unomauhasard5219 I doubt it. They only return to check a traitor brother.

[@aurelcorstan5242]

The Tyranids are a Galactic problem. So everyone is going to have to fight them. I think The Lion engages first, because he is about protecting Humanity. But Guilliman will obviously recognize the threat and do what he needs to. And he has the Xeno contacts to rally against them. So it's inevitable that he will fight them. But really, this is a Galactic level threat. Even Chaos is going to have to fight to survive. So anyone who doesn't get involved is missing the point.

[@Eric-rr3zd]

Both. They will go together, brothers reunited. And whatever their relationship is, I think we know that they would work together in battle REALLY well. Both tactical geniuses, and both knowing they can rely on the other one. Especially if the Dark Angels aren't abandoning the battle to chase some fallen.

[@jasonhefner7704]

I agree here. The Lion doing the cleansing and Big Blue doing the reinforceing as the Lion pushes forward. Both of them were reliable for setting up compliance worlds in the Crusade which would be important here. Compliance being set up to root out tyranids. The only point I might give Big Blue over the Lion would be working with Xenos for fighting this threat to the Galaxy as a whole; the Necrons in particular.

[@brockwilkie6022]

@@jasonhefner7704 Agreed. Having them meet in battle would be the best. G probably caught while reinforcing one of his key planets and in a desperat fight that the LIon shows up and handles for him. G then showing a map of the galaxy and how the defenses are being set up to contain everything. The Lion noting how and aggressive strike at a certain point would really be devastating and how the enemy would react. The Lion then instant has counters planned for each reaction the enemy has an entire campaign of annihilation is planned. G just tells him to make it so and promises to keep everything contained and sending what the Lion needs.

[@thejammyproject]

More like give Lion one of Papa Smurfs strategies, and watch the enemy get absolutely obliterated.@@brockwilkie6022

[@DaMarakuHD]

It would be interesting to see the first unleash untold terrors from old night on the tyranids now that we expect them to be reinforce back to full strength with primaris

[@AnshumanKantiBose]

Ok, that would be terrifying no doubt. DAoT human tech, to make the hive mind pause for a moment. That'd be fucking awesome. This just makes me wish for an alternate timeline where the nids encounter DAoT humanity and just gets folded in half.

[@jonharrison9222]

They were reinforced with Primaris long before the Lion showed up. Now they need reinforcing again after the heavy losses they took against Vashtorr.

[@CrispinBac0n]

And linking in Cawl ? As Cawl really is into normalising archeotech.

[@nyx3988]

Imagine giving cawl​ gear from DAoT and telling him "make us guns" @@CrispinBac0n

[@CrispinBac0n]

Going to be epic. Would be great to have insights into the lord of the first as the hunter: returning his his roots in a way. Hunting beasts as he did where began as a boy on Caliban. A spiritual evolution, returning to the beginning and 'growing' and evolving as a character

[@SamuelDemers-z5e]

like any good generals know, a plan never resist first contact with the enemy. Shit hit the fan and unexpected situation always come up to threaten victory. The Lion is a much more flexible and adaptable commander and I feel he should be in charge of the army while Guilliman support him logistically.

[@eugenebelford9087]

Is he really much more flexible? Would he really cooperate well/ better with the likes of Cawl or Aeldari or T'au or whomever xenos, etc. if that helps winning the war? I strongly doubt so.

[@nathanial_summers]

Book excerpt: Lion El'Johnson: Lord of the First The Wolf King boasted to all that he was his father's executioner. He was a deterrent, a hound to snarl from behind a sealed gate, never to be unleashed. What the Lion was to his father did not speak its name so brazenly. For where Russ was a warning, the Lion was a solution. The final solution. He was the Emperor’s exterminator. Which is why i'd choose the Lion over Roboute.

[@Ave_Christus_Rex3777]

I'd like too the Lion fight. No complex reason, I just want the Lion to get more screen time

[@Cornerboy73]

Rob is on the other side of the galaxy but that's his only real disadvantage here that I can see. He's been around a while, he's familiar with the enemy and, as stated, is more or less ready to wield the might of the imperial military in response to the threat. I'm not certain the Lion even knows what a Tyranid is at this point in time. He's still getting up to speed and back on the scene so to speak. Heck, do we know if he's actually sat down with the Risen and the Inner Circle and put this whole Fallen thing to bed yet? Anyway, both are certainly capable of responding to this - if you plucked Guilliman out and replaced him with the Lion in charge of the imperial military, you're going to get the same result. Both are going to get the job done in their own way. In an ideal situation, they would work together to devise and execute a plan. I suppose another thing to consider is whether or not the Angels were to bring any of their forbidden weaponry into this. That could potentially have a huge impact in how fast this could get resolved. I just think that we all need to hold up a bit and consider that both of these primarchs have changed and grown in ways since we first met them. I don't like the idea of labelling them as 'logistics guy' and 'beast-mode' guy or whatever. Rob has done wonders for the imperium in the modern setting and he hasn't accomplished what he has by being an armchair general. The newly awakened Lion still maintains much of his old personality traits, but he's a bit more tempered now. He tends to pause for a moment to consider the bigger picture a bit more than he used to. Let's hope that if we ever see some books on this that the writers note these developments as I think it would make the characters and the stories more interesting. I just wonder - as Lion gets better at controlling his new forestwalking ability - and we already know he can take others with him - maybe he could be the one to find Rob and guide them both to the other side of the galaxy and fight this threat together. Thanks for the video !

[@jonharrison9222]

The Lion is in the Dark Imperium and Guilliman isn’t.

[@iloveplayingpr]

Didn't Guilliman crossover to the dark side of the Imperium?

[@jonharrison9222]

@@iloveplayingpr During the devastation of Baal; then returned.

[@johanstinson]

If we ever see some books on this lol. Buddy....GW can already hear the cash registers going crazy

[@magnithorsson2154]

Obviously, none of them will show too much emotion or vulnerability in front of their men, but when they have time alone, I can see Guilliman ranting, breaking down, not crying but airing tons of his frustrations and anger at what has happened to their Father's dream, and their father himself. With the Lion listening quietly, absorbing the current state of the Imperium at large from Guilliman's venting.

[@CountDVB]

And probably Lion concerned for Roboute, because of Bobby G had to deal with alot.

[@dagdamor1]

Plot Twist: ROGAL DORN. Seeing entire Hive Tendrils starve because the defenses established by the Sire of the Imperial Fists are so formidable that attacking them is more fruitless than attacking Necron Tomb Worlds would be both hilarious and awesome.

[@Vaille32]

I’d go with El’Johnson. The Emperor used El’Johnson and the Dark Angles to annihilate the Imperium’s most dangerous xenos threats - the Rangdan, for example. While other legions had their asses handed to them, the 1st Legion annihilated the xenos. Sure, the Dark Angles of the 41st Millennium are a shadow of the Dark Angles pre-Heresy, and they are fewer in number, but El’Johnson is still the primarch to the Chapters can rally around on the field. He’d be the better field commander while Guilliman is the better administrator and tactician.

[@Galactus78]

It’s ironic, Robute lacks the killer instinct that the Lion has to put something like the Tyranids down for good while the Lion just isn’t a big picture guy like Guilliman and is not great at building alliances like he is. Put them together though and you’d have the Hive Mind on the back foot.

[@jacobbrown130]

I think it will come down to both of them, not just one. The strategic mind of girlyman and the ferocity of the big cat working in tandem with each other will be the deciding factor against leviathan

[@andrewbyrne2173]

Actually Robbie’s strength is logistics, Lion is strategic genius. The heresy was nearly stopped dead in it’s tracks by Lion. Unfortunately he made the mistake of trusting Pertarbo.

[@jonharrison9222]

The Tyranids are in the western part of Imperium Sanctus. The Lion is on the other side of the rift. Guilliman is supposed to be heading towards the Pariah Nexus at this point.

[@nicholasblahblahblah1913]

This may sound ridiculous -- but, hear me out. Fulgrim returns to the setting & defends the Imperium for his own arrogance -- destroys the Tyranid invasion of Terra & creates a rift in the Imperium who might view Fulgrim as a hero returned. It could even go deeper with Trazyn & his uncorrupted Fulgrim clone...

[@karmaascendant3936]

@@nicholasblahblahblah1913Chaos forces get absolutely cucked by the Shadow in the Warp so I doubt he could even form an army capable of holding a single world from the remnants of his legion. It’d be cool if clone Fulgrim stepped up and had Emperor’s Children successors be exposed due to their reaction to the Aura though. Cawl would definitely start sweating and Gulliman would be pissed.

[@alrethianscraftsbattles]

Both brothers, would be a great throwback to Rogal & Sanguinius during the Horus Heracy as well. 2 Loyal brother reunited again.

[@MG-gj7pv]

That first picture of the ultramarine with the red cape was sooo sick

[@PeterReid1993]

Between the two? I think the lion is the better option. Guilliman is a practical commander of unfathomable tactics and insight. But he’s *the* general, *the* liege lord. But the lion? He’s a hunter. The unending march of inevitable doom. Ruthless extermination. Precise death.

[@Britishgridironfilms]

GW will probably forget about the hive fleet now they have sold a load of new bugs......Oh look the silent king is back.

[@xuk6042]

This 😂

[@80krauser]

‘Oh no Leviathan was swallowed up by the Retconian! Oh well… *BUY MORE NECRONS PAYPIGS!!*’

[@lisawatts-co5pt]

People here are selling El’ Johnson way short, they acting as if The Lion is the better individual combatant but Guilliman the better strategist which is just wrong. It’s more like who was the better general Eisenhower or McArther? Most people would obviously say McArther which he was but Eisenhower was better at logistics and diplomacy with Allies.just like Guilliman which is why he was given overall command but McArther was a strategic genius with planning just like the Lion. Guilliman was never in the running for Warmaster and it was Johnson who the greatest threat of the Rangdan and the powerful Krave was tasked.

[@errtuownsyou]

Guilliman can stick to strategy and logistics from a broader perspective while the Lion can be an excellent field commander. The two are well-suited to working in tandem.

[@garrettflicker2748]

Wolf, when you get time please do a video on the “Soulblade fleets” you mentioned.

[@barlotardy]

If anyone still has access to life eater bombs, it'd be the first...

[@davidmiddleton7958]

Well, both Guilliman & the Lion will both be facing the Tyranid threat in Imperium Nilhilus. However, Johnson has access to some very rare tech. The Men of Iron would be very useful against the Tyranids, plus free up troops for other theatres of war.

[@jonharrison9222]

Except the Tyranids are in the western part of Imperium Sanctus. And Guilliman hasn’t left it yet.

[@potato3457]

Lion don't have men of iron any more they got destroyed

[@ShadowGhost0117]

@@potato3457some of them did, but not all

[@tarinindell8217]

I mean, the entire point of The Lion is that he is the monster slayer. And other than chaos, i cant think of a bigger "monster" than the 'nids. So if we absolutely had to have one of them lead the fight against them, id choose The Lion. But ive seen others comment that neither should be the one to tackle this threat, and i think that would also be a good choice.

[@ThePredator315000]

Assuming both guilliman and the lion working together. The lion strikes directly while guilliman is the main strategic brain of the offensive, defense and the logistics. The lion striking directly kinda buys time for guilliman to plan and study the foe if needed

[@Ownedyou]

13:25 He let his emotions guide him when he chopped Omegon into cubes.

[@HarleyHerbert]

Ideally it'd be both, with Guilliman being the shield, bolstering the imperium and leading the defence in weathering the assault, while the Lion acts as the spear, to strike out right into the soft underbelly while the enemy is distracted fighting Guilliman But with the galaxy being so vast, enemies so numerous, and only two primarchs, they might decide not to have both primarchs going after the same enemy. I think the Tyrannids are the kind of threat that certainly warrants both but they may not see it that way

[@wheelhouse3221]

I have been wanting to see them team up so bad, that would slap so hard.

[@codyt.1905]

Can the lion forest warp in at points where there are tyranid organisms coordinating shit and just hop around taking out their command structure? Tyrranids are my least known about lore bit outside gladius.

[@Theotherlostprimarch]

I feel like the obvious but overlooked answer to countering the nids is the imperial navy. Use your heaviest weapons platforms packed full of astartes and engage the swarm in the open void where most of there advantages are completely neutralized. Distances to large to effectively utilize the swarms, most of their highly specialized bioforms are useless, and most obviously, no biomass. Am I wrong here?

[@Peter2k84]

Obviously, should leave the grand strategy to Guilliman, while having the lion bring down the hammer on key targets or defend key worlds. If for some reason you'd have to pick one, the grand strategy master.

[@Yandarval]

Certainly. Grand Strategy is not only on the battlefield. Grand Strategy encompasses politics, production, logistics, recruitment, alliances and strategy. The Lion would be a pick two of those options. G man can do all of them. The Lion may be better at one or two, compared to Bobby G. Papa Smurf can do them all with equal skill.

[@alastor8091]

They should do it together. Tag team the Queen, and then they both take off their helmets tired, beaten, and bloody, and just hug eachother. No words, just 2 brothers, glad theyre no longer alone against the infinite grim darkness of the 42nd Millennium.

[@rislingpodiumperformance]

have them strategically collaborate as they were ready to do in Imperium Secundus

[@michelletheia9853]

I wonder if the shadow in the warp would interfere with Lion’s forest walk ability.

[@seanyoung9014]

If I had to guess, I would say there will be a situation where forest walking will be the only warp travel possible.

[@michelletheia9853]

Yeah. I wouldn't be surprised if it wound up being the only way to do something in a story either, like get on board a Tyranid hive ship to blow it up.@@seanyoung9014

[@PhaeronServinus]

both of them. Girlyman can fight the leviathan logistically, overseeing the mass tendrills of the hive fleet, while the lion strikes at the heart of the hive fleet and takes it out from the inside out

[@Nah_Bohdi]

Abaddon and Guilliman side by side like a Pirates of the Caribean movie! :^)

[@RamArt9091]

I think they will meet, but they will have to split in order to face the Tyranids attacking from different directions. I also see there might be more Xenos intervention against Leviathan.

[@Aloysius10]

Tyranids will be the Big Bad of Warhammer 40k now. They make Chaos look like pansies.

[@xxmattopsxx3931]

I feel like this is more of a Calgar or Dante thing. Especially as they both have a personal beef with the hivemind and they've been somewhat sidelined.

[@arionofotherworld]

Agreed, time to let the slightly more mortal heroes shine once more.

[@piercebrosnan9528]

Dante has faced enough Tyranids for 1000 lifetimes.

[@boxy2k8]

Guilliman needs to sort out all the logistics, get the Lion the forces he needs and then let the Lord of the First do what the Lord of the First does best. Annihilate monsters. Let the Exterminator be an Exterminator

[@udp1073]

both, together, sending a signal to the whole Imperium and its foes

[@thegamersconclave8709]

I could see The Lion, Dante, and Gulliman forming a new Triumvirate as Rulers of the Empire.

[@andrewwelham8633]

Guilliman - "Give me a minute, I'm good. Give me an hour, I'm better. Give me 6 months, I'm unbeatable." Jonson - "Your first mistake, you took the job. Your second mistake? You came light. A four man crew for me? Fucking insulting."

[@doubledigital_]

plot twist, valdor comes back to save terra with his uber fleet :D

[@antonioj700]

This is more like dante&calgar taking revenge.

[@Knight-chaplainashriel]

Oh I really hope the 13th shows up. It'll really help my Redeemed chapters lore.

[@arionofotherworld]

Rogal Dorn, once he finally walks out of the Imperial Throne room in his customised Centurion armour :)

[@Lemon.Lime.69z]

I really think if fulgrim comes back into the picture in the lore, and if guilliman were to have a rematch duel with him that gulliman would end up winning, I’m expecting fulgrim will come back into the picture at the end of 10th edition leading into 11th after leviathan is tamed. The duel would prob be at the end of 11th edition to round out the storyline

[@slip6699]

I think we get the word bearers next once they figure out Gmans goal.

[@Balboainc]

I don't think guilliman would risk that again. I feel like he would bait fulgrim into thinking he was going for a rematch only for the lion to be there in his place.

[@dreamingwolf8382]

Curious what the reawakened primarchs thought about Tyranids and Necrons and tau and the like...What were their takes and initial thoughts on being briefed about the new galactic threats etc

[@irishwarlord100]

I Robute has a good batch of marines who have experience dealing with the alien threat and also his resources , to call on Ultramar for back up. I honestly dont know much about the Dark Angels, one thing I do know is the Dark Angels have access to advanced weaponary. Because the nids adapt to the enviroments it would be best to beat them as soon as possible with the most deadly weapons you have at hand. Its a tough quesiton. But remember experience is eveything. Edit: Should Robute be the one to take the brunt, he should call the 4th Company with Uriel leading any counter attacks.

[@azadzeeman1243]

Fitting the "Exterminator" would take care of the bugs. Under the strategic guidance of Raboute.

[@jameschar4711]

I hope the Third Primarch introduced is the Khan backed by the laughing god Cegorach to be able to use the webway to go fast and be speed anywhere in the galaxy

[@housetoocrowded7825]

At this point in time, Robute is better resourced to deal with the threat by a long stretch. In addition, he has the better intelligence on the threat and how to defeat it, including Uriel Ventura who has first hand experience with the threat. If it were Heresy era 1st Legion then you would argue that their Dark Age Technology would give them the upper hand. The Lion would still arguably be a better individual combatant but a Tyranif threat is not about individuals as opposed to bringing a mass of combined forces to bear is the key.

[@johnn4134]

Either would be good. I think the interesting question would be how each treats the genestealer cults. I could see the Lion seeing them as such abominations he starts purging any world with even a rumor of the cult on it. I could also see the Lion being ambushed by the cult in a situation where something like a fleet of imperial Navy ships shows up and he thinks they are his reinforcements but they are really controlled by the hive mind. Does the Lion even know about the cults? He might not even recognize their worship of the "emperor reborn" as being any different from the imperial ecclesiarchy in this new imperium he's in. Imagine him running off to help some poor imperial citizens only to find they are insane cultist.

[@worldsbuffestloremaster]

never forget how much plot armor the imperial characters have. especially anything close to resembling a main character.

[@ShadoonGrogono]

I think it will take both Guilliman and El'Jonson, to hold the wonderful Tyranids at bay. IT will also most likely be when they both meet, or at least when Gulilliman learns that his brother is back.

[@SirBrasstion]

Guilliman for the enemy within - rebuilding the fractured Imperium. The Lion for the enemy without - breaking Leviathan's advance.

[@MattyJaxx]

GW would 100% somehow find a way to make a Dark Angels vs Tyranids story about the fallen

[@michaelwallace7972]

Both. They'll need Guillimans skill in administration, but i feel The Lions martial prowess is also needed to face off agains the Nids

[@dondavenport7077]

I could see the Lion being great against the overt threat of the Tyranids, meeting and defeating them on planets that they swarm. However, I think the Lion, moreso than Guilliman, would be blind to the covert treachery of genestealer cults forming on worlds he believes unthreatened (just like he was largely unaware of the sedition within his own chapter during the heresy). I could see a scenario where his forces beat back all Tyranid invaders only to find himself surrounded by planets overrun by genestealers, just in time for a 2nd wave of 'nids to arrive.

[@tauras3108]

It’s gonna take the two of them to try and hold back Leviathan, I’d say.

[@ThePathStrider]

One is a builder of empires, the other a slayer of monsters - the decision should be obvious.

[@miles2378]

Is El'johnson in control of his "forest walking" or is he being draged around?

[@matthewtriplett8556]

The intire might of both legions would be great

[@adfury]

Dorn vs Nids would be an epic story though.

[@comeroundereroundere]

Absorb the necrons into the imperium alongside the mechanicus. Really just need a politician to prevent infighting. Maybe the emperor can get a new body while at it. Armies that can’t be absorbed and a direct enemy of chaos with super weapons ready and waiting. And the direct knowledge of what happens when you misguide tech and purpose.

[@maciejsawicki8095]

With Dreadwing Protocol initaited and release of some or most Dark Age of Technology weapons, Lion could manage

[@jules9094]

Dorn. Need those fortifications

[@jamesl3567]

Hope we see both tag team leviathan

[@cyanideinmycereal1077]

Honestly I’m a bigger fan of Leontus handling it

[@PumpkinHoard]

Let the Lion use the Dark Angels full war crime arsenal. Tyranids are the perfect opportunity to use some of those toys.

[@danielk3832]

So I give the edge to Johnson for a somewhat odd reason... Bureaucracy. Not as Guilliman being the source of it... But because he cares to navigate the red tape and b.s. that the Administratum and other organizations throw in is way at times. He makes concessions and tries to be a diplomat AND a general at most times because he sees it as building the Imperium. The problem is all of that takes valuable time. Johnson has little time for mediating and even less time for any extra distractions from the task at hand. There may be more political fallout for Johnson in the aftermath, but he would cut through all the red tape literally and figuratively until the deed was done.

[@David-li4uw]

Both. RG in the Eisenhower role and Lion in the Patton role.

[@tjorgensen8760]

There is also the ship master of the white scars of the book the last hunt

[@DoomStroller]

As much as I'd love to see the lion and the 1st unleash some dark age tech on the nids, we gotta give it to robby guiles. Even without him the 13th has more experience with da bugs than the 1st. Or sanguinius(if he was alive) could just juggernaut the whole fleet...

[@UnRu1eD]

I think, this is when Guilliman and Lion will meet.

[@Brorhie_Onome]

I say let the lion face chaos and Gulliman face the Nids

[@saltedllama2759]

Guilliman needs to mastermind the campaign with his unparalleled strategic overview, whereas the Lion would be the Imperial equivalent to a Norn Emissary sent in to execute specific targets.

[@allunt8170]

Lion under 2 conditions. 1st if the Forest walk is not compromised by the shadow. 2nd if Lion has all the intel. the he will simply teleport to the command unit, stomp on it and rest will be a walk in the park)) otherwise Gman has more chances

[@eichler721]

Honestly both are overkill for the Tyranids which is why Valoris and the Lord Solar are handling it. However between the 2 the Lion with his Legion gathered and his DAOT hunting the Norn Queens and destroying the command he would decimate the fleets. Letting Valoris hold the defenses. Guilliman would also be able to out strategy the Tyranids if there. But it would be harder. Guilliman and the Lion need to deal with the Silent King and the Nexus, Abbadon and Vashtorr finding the Old Ones weapon, and helping stop Chaos and secure the Imperium Nighalis.

[@johanvandersandt8904]

I feel that Angron has become nothing more than a punching bag for people to show their worth against. The red angel doesn't even have his full wits about him.

[@Judge_of_Anubis05]

Honestly I'd say the Lion should be the one to take the tyranids. Guilliman building a vast supply and intelligence network and the Lion having all the resources he'd need from Guilliman. Guilliman builds the backbone but the Lion directs the hands. Plus any plans he'd made for the tyranids the Lion could further refine and tune. Also there is the whole hunting of beast the Lion used to do.

[@bobloerakker7010]

The lion has more XP slaying monsters and beasts. But he could use some advise from the sons of Ultramar.

[@falsehero2001]

Why not both?

[@onimeno121]

If the lion is sent out to take on leviathan, we could see Cypher arrive with a huge cohort of the fallen in tow to save the lion in his time of need. I'd like to see a big redemption moment for the fallen.

[@onimeno121]

Forgot to consider that the new space marine 2 game is ultra marines v nids. Could be on purpose.

[@erikwhitney7403]

IT is an easy question. Gil creates what is needed to destroy the brain. El delivers it. Or. El will create the diversion and Gil will deliver it

[@ninodino444]

Well if it is such a great threat both at the same time

[@Sigismund697]

obviously both would be cool and a nice way to cap 10th edition but if it has to be one then: Guilliman has the indomitus crusades plus whatever info the ultramarines have on Tyranids Lion has both DA+Risen and we could assume, BA and successors of both plus whatever forces aligned themselves to him from Nihilus BA recently have a score to settle with Tyranids but Ultras should have much more experience I'd say Guilliman would be more prepared to deal with them as of right now because he has 100 years of preparation while Lion is still too new

[@sawyeratkinson]

Hey has anyone talked to the rangdan to see how they're doing lately? Oh...right...

[@LordAnubis00]

I mean Lion has immense experience with dealing with Xeno species. I mean Hell, he's credited with being the reason why the Rangdan Xenocides weren't the end of the Imperium.

[@harvestblades]

While they are both great strategists I would think Guilliman would have an advantage, but then again maybe not, especially when compared to the more mature Lion. Guilliman's greatest advantage is against humans or even Xenos where diplomacy can come into play. Diplomacy has no place with the Nids. Definitely curious to see what GW does with this one!

[@Mrgoldenboi]

Imagine The Lion and Guilliman fighting about to get over runned and lemon russ or vulkan or any loyalist primarchs come out of nowhere and save them when they need it the most

[@Brynngar1983]

Cant The Lion Go anwhere instantly now with his new forest walking ability? He could just put tanks and terminators on the hive fleet ships and take them all down from the inside.

[@comeroundereroundere]

Guilliman as strategist only over the militarum. Don’t be risking space marines to feed the biomass. It surprises me we’re still overlooking tyranids consuming gene seed. Perhaps this suggests it’s only a genetic average of total consumed, hence the minute amount of space marine material vs totality would be insignificant.

[@comeroundereroundere]

Also, we’re talking about appointing a warmaster. Another warmaster. Just saying.

[@sakomanlee]

40K makes a lot more sense when you realize that it is basically a continuation of Blackadder.

[@bequakynskagroupie3751]

Clonegrim needs to break out of stasis and take some initiative!!